Gifted Bulletin Board

Welcome to the Gifted Issues Discussion Forum.

We invite you to share your experiences and to post information about advocacy, research and other gifted education issues on this free public discussion forum.
CLICK HERE to Log In. Click here for the Board Rules.

Links


Learn about Davidson Academy Online - for profoundly gifted students living anywhere in the U.S. & Canada.

The Davidson Institute is a national nonprofit dedicated to supporting profoundly gifted students through the following programs:

  • Fellows Scholarship
  • Young Scholars
  • Davidson Academy
  • THINK Summer Institute

  • Subscribe to the Davidson Institute's eNews-Update Newsletter >

    Free Gifted Resources & Guides >

    Who's Online Now
    0 members (), 306 guests, and 11 robots.
    Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
    Newest Members
    Emerson Wong, Markas, HarryKevin91, Gingtto, SusanRoth
    11,429 Registered Users
    May
    S M T W T F S
    1 2 3 4
    5 6 7 8 9 10 11
    12 13 14 15 16 17 18
    19 20 21 22 23 24 25
    26 27 28 29 30 31
    Previous Thread
    Next Thread
    Print Thread
    Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4
    #57969 10/09/09 02:32 PM
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    T
    Junior Member
    OP Offline
    Junior Member
    T
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    Hi All

    I have a question about my daughter who is almost 6 and has not skipped or been subject accelerated at this point. Upon reading the psych testing and our suggestions, the teacher did try to send her to upper grades for reading but she would not hear of it and stubbornly refused to go. As an overview, she was an early self-taught reader at 2, first words at 7/8 months, singing tunes at 12 months and wholes songs at 18 months, speaking in 2 or more sentences at 2 years sometimes up to 10 words per sentence. Used big words like 'frustration' at 18 months. Rote counted to 10 from 13 months - could one one one count to 20 approx 2.5 yrs. Due to her early milestones, testing was suggested for educational purposes. She tested at iq score 99.7th percentile on the weschler preschool test (verbal at 99.8th, perceptual at 99.6th and processing speed brought her down somewhat) and her WIAT reading words was at 160+, with a reading comprehension score of 8 years when she was only 4 1/2 years - which I suggest at around 5.2years was 9 years and would be (from my non-expert assessment) around 9.5 to 10 years now. Maths not as high - but 130. Her reading progress has slowed a bit as she is not as interested in books since being at school. We decided after must thought and discussion to leave her with her age peers (acceleration had been recommended by psych). This year has been quite a shock as the teacher tells us that she is not at all interested in doing anything academic like reading, maths and particuarly writing - all she wants to do is create art, draw, play make believe (with younger kids in class) or play on the monkey bars. She tells me her favourite subject is sport. The teacher says whilst the other children are putting up their hands in drove to write, read and do other academic and/or 'enrichment activities', my daughter is politely saying 'no thanks' I'd rather sit over here and draw a picture. The teacher says this remains so despite the fact she has quite complex books, puzzles etc out for her (I don't know how complex but she pointed to one which was colour by numbers (you had to add eg. 7 + 2 = 9 and 9 would be red). She says that around 10 other children in the class can write pages (and can write better) than my daughter already who just refuses to write. I wonder what is going on, she tells me "she is not comfortable doing those things in the classroom environment" (her words)and the teacher is forcing her to sit by herself and read more advanced books (the teacher says this is not true there are others at the table) The teacher says DD tells her DD does those things at home and just wants a break from them at school. I was astounded as she does these things of her own free will at home (although I have always provided my kids with books and other resources) - the teacher says she appears to be compartmentalising. However, you can tell that the teacher is now thinking the test results and everything is wrong despite the fact she was blown away by my daughter's reading at the start of school (when she actually did read at school). She later commented that any child would read like that if she had been read to as much as my daughter was read to at a young age. She said that she has had a child write entire scripts at DD's age adn DD is not doing any of that. The current teacher tells me that a relief teacher (who took DD's class for 4 months) did not know what she was talking about when she asked how DD was doing - she has no idea DD was GT. The current teacher also looked at me like I must be mad/stupid when I even mentioned subject acceleration. Yet, I am still consistently being told by other parents how bright she is (by the things she tells them, her reasoning and vocab she uses etc). I would be very grateful for any suggestions/comments or advice you may have for me as right now I am at a loss as to what is going on? Should I be concerned or not at all and let things evolve in their own good time?

    Thank you so much for listening,
    T

    Joined: Apr 2009
    Posts: 101
    B
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    B
    Joined: Apr 2009
    Posts: 101
    Oh man, sounds like she is going through a rough time. I am no expert by any means. My little guy is only 4. It sounds like underachievement to me. Could be a little of the dumbing down effect too. You may need to think about switching schools or possibly homeschooling if you want things to change.
    GL

    Joined: Sep 2009
    Posts: 701
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    Joined: Sep 2009
    Posts: 701
    You DD sounds like a very bright little girl! She also sounds like she has a mind of her own, which is wonderful, but a little tough on parents sometimes! Is she maybe a perfectionist who is afraid of doing things in class in front of other people she doesn't know very well and instead finds comfort in drawing? Maybe, too, she feels like she already knows what the teacher is teaching and just doesn't feel the need to proove it. Just hypothesizing here . . . . If only school were more about learning and less about jumping through hoops!

    And, I know how much I HATE it when people say my kids are the way they are because I "work with them at home," but try not to focus on her uneducated statement. You have assessments that prove that she is a fast-learner and a deep-thinker, and you can't teach that!

    ((HUGS))


    She thought she could, so she did.
    Joined: Sep 2009
    Posts: 701
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    Joined: Sep 2009
    Posts: 701
    One other thought: maybe she just thinks of school as a place to do fun stuff like play and do art. That's what K is or was supposed to be about. Especially for her, since she knows most of the academic stuff. Maybe that's her way of keeping it fun and interesting rather than frustratingly slow. Self-preservation, if you will. Also, maybe she does prefer art and playing and gym to reading, writing, and math. Just because you happen to be good at something doesn't always make it your favorite thing, and there's nothing wrong with that! Also, how can the teacher say other kids are better at writing if your daughter refuses to write for her?

    Last edited by mnmom23; 10/09/09 08:08 PM.

    She thought she could, so she did.
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 199
    J
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    J
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 199
    Hi T - you could be writing about my youngest daughter *sigh* I agree that she's probably just trying to make school as fun as she can. Art, sport, music, drawing - are probably survival strategies and coping skills. It's easy to blend in and feel just like the other kids when you're doing this. It's harder to feel the 'same' when you're reading chapter books when everyone else isn't.

    Like me, you're probably wondering whether a 5 year old really has the capacity to dumbdown to this level. Perhaps she's not really that gifted after all? Because surely if she was then she would be running rings around everyone, completing work way beyond the standard of everyone else, self-motivated to study algebra while everyone else is counting to 10... Not gonna happen!!!!

    What I have learned thru watching my eldest daughter is that when you get a good fit with the teacher, when you're not the smartest kid in the class, when you have to apply yourself to get good grades, when you have to learn how to try, when the material you're learning is interesting (not just finger-painting fun!)... learning becomes addictive and exciting and satisfying!

    Keep your chin up and let me know if you come across any answers... jojo

    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    T
    Junior Member
    OP Offline
    Junior Member
    T
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    Thanks everyone, there is some good insight there. Jojo, I agree you do start to wonder - is this child really gifted? Did I imagine all of this and are the test results all wrong in some way? Was she just an early spurter? The only tip someone has given me is that she needs to be in a multi-age/level class where everyone is working on their own level so she cannot discern "the norm". Yes, she certainly has a mind of her own and when she is motivated and determined she moves forward quickly and in huge leaps - she just hasn't shown that at school this year. This is not a child you could easily force to do anything - if she does it (as she feels its mandatory) - it will be a mediocre outcome at best.

    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 199
    J
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    J
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 199
    Norm referencing is interesting T because I think we assume that this happens much later than it does. Miss 5 is in a multi-age class and, as it turns out, is the second youngest in her class (by way of being a 27 May baby when the cut off in Oz is 30 June). But... multi-age doesn't necessarily mean multi-ability which is what you really want - a range of abilities above your child, at your child's level and below. In this situation, it may be harder to discern the 'norm', depending on where his/her friends are performing. But going for a multi-age hasn't solved anything for us because the ability range is too narrow. Does that make sense? I would agree that multi-age is VERY important but with caveats...

    jojo

    Joined: Sep 2009
    Posts: 70
    Min Offline
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    Joined: Sep 2009
    Posts: 70
    Your DD's profile is very similar to my DS(7)'s, except DS is stronger with perceptual and weaker in verbal.

    DS waffles between much higher level novels and picture books that fascinated him 4+ years ago. At school there were issues with boredom during free-reading time because he was picking those easier books at the beginning of the week and getting stuck with them for the rest of the week. We talked to him about his responsibility in picking something that will last, and the teacher also gave him permission to change books as often as he wants during the week. That seems to have resolved the problem.

    What I notice is that he reads more difficult books when he has time to really get into it, and when he has no big distractions. School is a big distraction. He knows he is different, and he wants things to talk about and share with his friends. At home he relaxes and will switch from high level books and pick up Robert Munsch (or the like) for some laughs. Stacked by his bed are books ranging from grade 1 level straight through to near-adult level books and he enjoys them all.

    It sounds like, with your DD, there is a bit more than this going on, but it is worth exploring. She is probably well able to handle a discussion about good reasons for varying her choices in reading. I talk to my sons about the need to challenge themselves, but I also make a point of laughing with them at the easy books so they know it is okay to enjoy all levels.

    A bright side for you is that her teacher knows very well that she is performing below her level. Perhaps over time she will get comfortable enough to challenge herself. It has taken a while for DS's teacher to understand that my sons are more capable than they show in more than just language arts and sciences which are the most obvious differences.

    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    T
    Junior Member
    OP Offline
    Junior Member
    T
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    Yes, my daugter does that too - flipping from easy picture books to more advanced chapter books and non-fiction. HOwever, at school I notice she selects the easiest books - I will talk to her as to why. She also came home from school yesterday saying 'I was the last one to finish my maths worksheet and I had to be told to stop talking 3 times'. Apparently, the teacher had to help her finish it as she was taking so long.... tHis is very easy maths - she passed this level plus more in the WIAT achievement at 4.5 and does maths on her brother's maths program at home - which easiest level is about 2 to 3 years ahead of this school work. Go figure?

    Joined: Sep 2009
    Posts: 40
    S
    Junior Member
    Offline
    Junior Member
    S
    Joined: Sep 2009
    Posts: 40
    Originally Posted by Tizz2008
    She also came home from school yesterday saying 'I was the last one to finish my maths worksheet and I had to be told to stop talking 3 times'. Apparently, the teacher had to help her finish it as she was taking so long....

    My DS8 will do this, and I think I finally understand why. He is a voracious talker and extremely social. I have found that he does not view math homework as a solitary activity-- he wants an adult to be right next to him, chatting with him about every problem. If I leave the kitchen table (where he's doing his math work) to work on dinner, he suddenly doesn't remember the order of operations or he'll take 5 minutes to remember 7x7 (7x7 being the simplest part of the complex math problem).

    Your daughter may have learned that by stalling she can get the teacher to come "socialize" with her.

    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    T
    Junior Member
    OP Offline
    Junior Member
    T
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    Thanks SLhogan and eveyone - it is certainly providing me some possible insight. Unfortunately, things are not improving and the teacher now tells me this morning that DD will do anything to get out of reading or writing. I said that is so different to the child at home and she is reading Enid Blyton's wishing chair series at the moment - she simply replied oh they are good I enjoyed them as a girl. She also tells me that my DD (to my great surprise as it sounded out of character to the quiet girl who would not say anything -teacher's words a few months back) is arguing with the teacher and other kids about answers to quiz questions and then told the teacher she was right and she was smarter than her. The teacher told me well I told her that I was smarter than her as I had been to University and if she listened to me she would learn something. Apparently (and I am still shocked that DD would say this!) she says she is smart and doesn't need to learn X and Y as she already knows it and is the smartest in the class. I'm a bit embarassed by this as she has not been brought up to boast like this or say this type of thing. The teacher also said she only gets 50% of the quiz questions right - I am not sure how hard the questions are but I don't imagine they would be challenging for DD. She has now continued the reluctance to go to school and the stomach aches and she looks kind of dejected - in contrast to the girl who started school who always had a smile on her face and laughter on her lips. This teacher also says all the above comments in the classroom, in front of my daughter and other parents who are there to drop kids off. That embarasses me as I am quite a private person, not to mention how it must make my daughter feel.....

    Last edited by Tizz2008; 10/20/09 01:09 AM. Reason: spelling
    Joined: Apr 2009
    Posts: 529
    N
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    N
    Joined: Apr 2009
    Posts: 529
    Originally Posted by Tizz2008
    The teacher told me well I told her that I was smarter than her as I had been to University and if she listened to me she would learn something. Apparently (and I am still shocked that DD would say this!) she says she is smart and doesn't need to learn X and Y as she already knows it and is the smartest in the class. I'm a bit embarassed by this as she has not been brought up to boast like this or say this type of thing.

    I think it is wonderful that you know what she is thinking so you can discuss it with her. I know I felt the same thing as a kid, but I never expressed it. My response would be threefold: First, I'd try to validate her feelings, but also explain that we can still learn from people who are not as smart as us. Second, I'd try to introduce/reinforce the idea of modesty--even when others are not being modest. Third, I'd do my best to get her out of that classroom, away from that teacher. IMHO, any teacher who goes around saying that they are smarter than their students (or otherwise comparing intelligence) is a poor choice for any student, and especially for gifted students. frown

    Joined: Dec 2005
    Posts: 7,207
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    Joined: Dec 2005
    Posts: 7,207
    Originally Posted by Tizz2008
    She also tells me that my DD ... is arguing with the teacher and other kids about answers to quiz questions and then told the teacher she was right and she was smarter than her. The teacher told me well I told her that I was smarter than her as I had been to University and if she listened to me she would learn something. Apparently (and I am still shocked that DD would say this!) she says she is smart and doesn't need to learn X and Y as she already knows it and is the smartest in the class.

    Tizz,
    My heart goes out to you. There are moments in parenting where our children ask us to grow in ways that we had planned on just giving up on. You are at one of those moments now. My son put me through plenty. I believe that you are hearing her cry for help, and that none of your previous plans will stop you from doing what is right for her.

    It is frustrating that your daughter was offered to go with the older kids for certian subjects, and didn't take the opportunity. I think it isn't her fault. I think that she was reading the hidden 'ambivilances' all around her and doing what she though was going to make teachers, classmates, and maybe even you, the happiest.

    Your daughter is 'right' in a way - her adults have certianly been 'stupid' in asking her to sit with her agemates and make the best of it for (count up the hours) since school started. My son had a lazer-like ability to notice what the teacher expected him to be able to do academically, and to resent the teacher's perfectly reasonable (but wrong) assesment. We adults have mixed feelings about so many things. We delight in the reading ability, but still wish that the child didn't have special educational needs that inconvience everyone.

    You had the best of intentions for your daughter's educational placement. You were told that the teachers always have a large range of ability in the room (ahem, but not that large!) and are trained professionals. You also may know of kids who were skipped and weird.

    It's the old 'causation/association' question - were they skipped because they were weird, or weird because they were skipped, or were both the weirdness and the skip caused by some other factor (bingo!)

    I can pretty much garentee that those kids would have been weird no matter what, in our societies that value conformity. I'm weird, (although not skipped) and it just wasn't in the cards for me to be able to hide it!

    Girls, particularly gifted girls, are quite good at figuring out what is 'expected' and 'acceptable.' She knows that bragging is not approved - and so you can take her actions to mean that 'the gloves are off' and she has tried her best to be the child you have been telling her (through the action of not skipping her) to be, and now she has had her fill of it, so watch out.

    She is also saying, with her behavior, that Adult Attention is her favorite reinforcer - positive or negative matters not a bit to her.

    Please don't sit her down and explain that it's wrong to tell the teacher that she is smarter that the teacher. Yes - it is unacceptable behavior, but your daughter knows it. If you don't believe me, try telling your DH, (or DP or a friend or whatever) that you are smarter than them within your daughter's hearing and watch her face. She will laugh, or be upset, or something that will let you know that she knows better.

    ((You may want to get your conspiritor's agreement first.))

    You have to get her out of that classroom situation. If possible, ask your tester to help you advocate, or switch schools, or do a few months of homeschooling. You need to appologise to your DD and start fresh. You are the adult, and you are supposed to know better and be able to fix everything. As a fellow adult, I know that often I don't know better, often I can't fix everything, but our children need us to do our best. It's the intention that really matters.

    I'm so glad that you posted here. That was really brave of you. Your daughter is giving you a wake up call, and hitting you right were you live - your 'I'll just be quiet and not make a fuss' button!

    ((Many Hugs and Smiles))
    Love and More Love,
    Grinity



    Coaching available, at SchoolSuccessSolutions.com
    Joined: Apr 2009
    Posts: 151
    B
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    B
    Joined: Apr 2009
    Posts: 151
    Grinity, thank you so much for your thoughtful post. I am not having the same troubles as Tizz, but I still find (as I often do) relevant and highly insightful thoughts in your response. I am so glad you're here!

    Joined: Jul 2009
    Posts: 42
    W
    Junior Member
    Offline
    Junior Member
    W
    Joined: Jul 2009
    Posts: 42
    Tizz - I don't have anything helpful to add, but I feel for your daughter. Best wishes.

    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    T
    Junior Member
    OP Offline
    Junior Member
    T
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    Grinity - Wow - you have the ability to cut right through to the essential issues - amazing! THank you so much for your wonderful insight - that makes a lot of sense. She has spent the whole year being the "tolerant, good girl" who so wants to fit in, and it would seem she has simply "exploded" and can't hold it in anymore. I know I made the wrong choice in not skipping her - and others in my life are going to say "I told you so" as they surely did - now I have to fix it. I have to say, it wasn't even so much the teacher's words as the manner in which she said it (in front of others as well) - like she took my DD words (a 5 year old child no matter how GT) as a personal affront to her (as if another adult had said that to her). When I mentioned, re-visiting the psychologist for some ideas (and a re-test of certain achievement aspects such as reading, maths etc) she said "I'd like to speak to THIS psychologist" in a disdainful way, so I knew she was doubting it all and just was not 'on-board' with DD at all. AS I walked away, I had the feeling that my daughter had to be away from that class - that the damage was just rapidly accumulating being with this teacher (who my DD loved at the outset of the year). You have confirmed those feelings. You are right I do not like to hassle and DD is obviously now screaming out for help. It is such a shame though as she has met a highly artistic little girl (who appears really bright) and has become quite friendly with her. Whether that is a true friendship or her trying to find a friend in the classroom, I'm not completely sure. Thanks Grinity and everyone else for your wonderful comments and support. I can't say enough good things about this forum - and so refreshing to be able to talk about these things with others who can provide such a high level of insight and lucid comments - when I am feeling so stressed that I can no longer think straight.

    Joined: Dec 2005
    Posts: 7,207
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    Joined: Dec 2005
    Posts: 7,207
    Oh Tizz ((hugs)) you made my day!

    BTW - where do you think that your daughter's ability to read peoples thoughts and desire to please them came from? Your story shows just how much of those qualities you have in you as well!

    And don't let anyone say "I told you so!" Unless they are prepared to go through ME first! We are all very heavily conditioned to disbelieve that gifted kids have special educational needs. I made plenty of mistakes, and what is so amazing about you and me is that we are willing to go - "Opps, that was a mistake, time to fix it!"

    A friend of mine says that if the outcome of any decision could be known in advance, than it couldn't have been a very difficult decision in the first place. Welcome Home Dear!

    Grinity


    Coaching available, at SchoolSuccessSolutions.com
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    T
    Junior Member
    OP Offline
    Junior Member
    T
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    Hi Grinity

    Not sure where DD got it from but my mother was a very empathetic person so perhaps a bit comes from there.
    Yes, you are spot on this was a big mistake for DD! I took a risk and I recall at the time, really finding it difficult as I tried to convince myself that perhaps my DD was one that could survive without accomodation in the ordinary classroom - I took the easier option and there was always that uncertainty in the back of my mind - I never felt completely satisfied with my decision. Now I know why!
    Thanks Grinity, for taking the time to provide me with your wonderful insight and support with these issues.

    Tiz

    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    T
    Junior Member
    OP Offline
    Junior Member
    T
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    Originally Posted by no5no5
    Originally Posted by Tizz2008
    The teacher told me well I told her that I was smarter than her as I had been to University and if she listened to me she would learn something.

    .....IMHO, any teacher who goes around saying that they are smarter than their students (or otherwise comparing intelligence) is a poor choice for any student, and especially for gifted students. frown


    I agree no5no5 - this was s startling comment by the teacher to a young child - any child - I would never say that to a child who said that to me. I was shocked that she told me she said that. Thanks again for your advice.

    Joined: Jul 2008
    Posts: 137
    B
    BKD Offline
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    B
    Joined: Jul 2008
    Posts: 137
    Quote
    I mentioned, re-visiting the psychologist for some ideas (and a re-test of certain achievement aspects such as reading, maths etc)
    Hi Tizz - we did this, and I wish we hadn't. She brushed off the 30 point discrepancy between her testing and the school's GO's with "I can't explain it", but then proceeded to advise that "he seems happy", "of course" we'll have to go with the new test, and acceleration obviously isn't appropriate any more. It turned out that DS7's teacher had spoken with the psych the week before, and what the psych had to say seemed to be a recording of what the teacher has always said. She did a little achievement testing too, and advised that he's only reading a few months above his age. Well since even the school knows his maths and reading are two + years above grade level, we couldn't see any credibility in the advice.

    I don't like to sound like a wet blanket, but it may be less than useful to go back to that particular psych. The result has made our advocacy even more difficult than it already was.

    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    T
    Junior Member
    OP Offline
    Junior Member
    T
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    Thanks for the tip BKD. It is all quite bizaar - that is awful that it has made your advocacy more difficult. Tizz

    Joined: Jul 2008
    Posts: 137
    B
    BKD Offline
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    B
    Joined: Jul 2008
    Posts: 137
    And now I'm having one of those all-too-frequent fuzzy doubtful moments - we did use the same one didn't we? Otherwise I've revealed to the world that I'm completely ditzy.

    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    T
    Junior Member
    OP Offline
    Junior Member
    T
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    Hi BKD - Yes, pretty sure we did - and no, you are definately not ditzy smile

    Joined: Oct 2009
    Posts: 10
    T
    Junior Member
    Offline
    Junior Member
    T
    Joined: Oct 2009
    Posts: 10
    Hey Tizz,

    I recognize many of your daughters traits with those of my own. I hate to do anything that's not interesting to me.

    But here's some of the difference. I obviously matured too quickly. So it would probably help to treat her like an adult, also by her teacher.

    I don't remember what actually motivated me at that age, I think I was quite average. Actually, I think I spoke a lot in class, and I most definately hated homework.

    Around the age of 13-15 I had grades, and I was driven by the consept that I had to do well to become rich as an adult(so I could provide for my family). I did not understand the meaning of the things I learned! And this is where my teacher was great, because he respected that. But he said I needed to get through with it, I had to learn it, so I could get into a good school and become successful. I'm not saying that your daughter is at this stage, I'm saying that some of it might apply to her as well.

    Key is to have a good teacher-pupil relation. Even though she's gifted, she still has the same rules as everybody else. Forget about being gifted, think of her as a normal child with strengths and weaknesses. And ask yourself how to prevent those weaknesses from taking over. Think motivation and encouragement.


    Below is something that might be a bit off, but might be relevant.

    I don't know how you're raising her, if you're giving her a lot of space to do whatever. The thing is consequences. I was brought up getting a lot of slams on me. It might have been very harsh. I don't have anything to compare to. My parents were strict. So I think that has made me into the person I am today. I am thankful for what they did to me, because without it I could have been an idiot. But consequences are good sources of motivation, being in contact with the real world.

    Give her the truths. Tell her, that she has the potential in her, if she wants. Tell her how much you love her and how you'll always have her back.

    You say that she says she is the smartest, and I believe she is, but maybe she has gotten ahead of herself. She says she knows it all, well, present her problems she can't handle yet. Don't give her worksheets, give her a math puzzle that will make her rethink her position. I know that math problems that I can't solve, will drive me to learn how to solve it.

    Anyway, this is just my perspective on things smile There are many thoughful and great posts here already. A bit hard to get a grasp on things, but I hope I helped just a little bit.

    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    T
    Junior Member
    OP Offline
    Junior Member
    T
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    Thanks TommyH - I will try some more difficult puzzles and see how she copes. I will also talk about how doing well in school can help with success later on. Thanks for your input and advice. I am hoping that she may find the right puper/teacher relationship.

    Joined: Jan 2009
    Posts: 215
    T
    Tiz Offline
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    T
    Joined: Jan 2009
    Posts: 215
    Hi there from one "Tizz" to another smile
    I really feel for your DD and it sounds like her teacher doesn't "get" her at all. My DS5 needs lots of encouragement to attempt some things - his standard position is that he can't/wont - this is due to perfectionism and fear of failure. You haven't mentioned this so I am assuming that it is not a problem for your DD, I just thought that I would mention it as it took DH and I a while to figure out what was going on with DS5. I know that girls also seem a lot more aware of conforming with their peers. Maybe also she just isn't challenged and therefore sees school as a social event so chooses to do just that. Is there anyone else at the school that you can approach for advice/help?


    Joined: Oct 2009
    Posts: 85
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    Joined: Oct 2009
    Posts: 85
    Hi,

    I think many of us are in this same boat. Everytime we attempt to chart our course and set sail, for what we think will be a educational voyage, our DD 4.5yrs up and out-grows our plan.

    We found early on at age 3.5 that she was hiding her ability. Her preschool teacher had no clue that she could read Level 2 I can read books, and thought she only knew her letters. DD would spend her entire day painting, playing and generally just hanging out and having fun (this is what preschool should be). We had no problem with this, until our DD started having in depth discussions with us at home about adding and subtracting fractions and yet in class they were learning their numbers. We asked her if her teacher knew she already knew her numbers, and she replied, "No, she really loves teaching kids" WOW - my DD knew how much her teacher loved her job, and wanted to let her do it, rather than speak up and say "I already know this".

    We scheduled a Parent Teacher Conference the next day. We brought samples of the math, art and reading that she was doing at home to show what she could do. The teacher talked to the administrator the next day, and within 2 weeks our DD was transitioned into the K class at 3.9yrs.

    Now, we did have to sell this to the K teacher, who rightfully so was a little concerned about having a 3yr old in her class, however, after 4 days, DD showed that she was an focused, repectful learner (even if she already knew the K material too) and was a great fit in the class. (well quite a bit shorter than the rest of the kids, but socially fit fine)

    At 4.2 the K teacher called us for a conference and told us that she knew that our DD had past all the standards for K and probably first grade, however, was almost rufusing to do anything in class and that she had again reverted to "just playing" and doing "practical life jobs". (which again was fine, since her physical development was still that of a 4 year old). Again, we spoke to DD, and asked her why she is spending all her time at those jobs, and didn't she want to do more academic jobs? And again, the responce was that she knew her teachers loved teaching, and she did not want to hurt their feelings. Plus the oldest girl in the class (someone DD looked up to) could only read to set 6 book 3 of the phonics readers, so DD did not want to make that little girl feel bad,since that little girl "feels so good about being the best reader in the class" as my DD put it, that she couldn't bear to hurt her feelings either.

    So......bottom line, we now use a private school/distance learning/homeschool for her education ensuring that she can learn at her own pace which is fast without hurting anyone. LOL And she still attends her other school 2 days a week in the 1st-3rd class, and fits right in with the kids. She actually has taken on a more of a nurturing role and helps the other students. Which in and of itself would not be how I want her entire educational year to go, but this works, since I know she is learning it at home and solidifying it by helping others. I also think being around the older kids has forced her to step up and "show off" her abilities (almost proving to them why she belongs there).

    Like I said at the start, each time we think we have it planned...bam...she up and outgrows it. We have now just decided that we are making plans for today and today only, and that we make them with full knowledge that when she changes, we will change our plan.

    Gifted kids sure can surprise us with how much the know and feel!

    :-) So glad this board is here!

    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    T
    Junior Member
    OP Offline
    Junior Member
    T
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    Tiz - thanks for your input! yes, perfectionism could be an issue with the writing as she never seems satisfied and when she was in preschool the teacher said she would screw up a lot of her work as she wasn't happy with it. However, I don't see this as an issue generally with her as she does try new things in other areas. She told other parents that she already knows the answers to the questions asked so she just wants the other kids to 'have a go at answering' as they are still learning it. This was given as her reason for non-participation in quizzes etc. When asked she will answer though. thanks again, Tizz

    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    T
    Junior Member
    OP Offline
    Junior Member
    T
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    Yes, she does seem to react differently to who I would expect JewelsJC. It was interesting to read your experiences with your daughter. I think my daughter too is very aware of letting the teacher teach - at least where the other kids are concerned. She is very strong-willed though when she just wants to do her own thing. She is quite like my son in one way, in that, she has to see a practical reason for doing something (eg. she cannot stand copying out a sentence just to practice handwriting, as opposed to writing a letter to her cousin or invitations to her party). I am sure that a lot of kids are like this... Some just are more compliant...:)

    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    T
    Junior Member
    OP Offline
    Junior Member
    T
    Joined: Sep 2008
    Posts: 44
    One thing that has been revealed to me recently is that other parent's views of my DD are completely different to that of the teacher. These are parents who have spent a lot of time in the classroom. They seem to "get" where she is at, and the teacher just seems to have no idea..... Most of them say she is far ahead of where the class is at and will not participate as she is bored and disengaged.

    Joined: Nov 2009
    Posts: 195
    M
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    M
    Joined: Nov 2009
    Posts: 195
    My son(16) is one of those compliant ones and has always been respectful of allowing teachers to teach. He also has that nurturing side of teaching others. As far as I can ascertain he enjoys doing it.

    One interesting point though was I never realised until this year how much he sits back and observes. I had to attend a university residential school for 4 days with him. He never said a word through all the lectures and tutorials unless asked and barely took any notes. By the end of day 3 I was becoming a bit concerned by his apparent non involvement. When I asked him about it he said he already knew the work. I then asked was he bored. He said no he finds it very interesting to see how other people react and solve problems.

    I say go with your gut feeling and advocate for your daughter, after all you are the one that truely knows her. Also the views of the other parents speak volumes, as it is often the views from another perspective of those not directly involved that give you the answers you are looking for. Good luck and best wishes.

    matmum


    Joined: Nov 2009
    Posts: 90
    G
    GM5 Offline
    Member
    Offline
    Member
    G
    Joined: Nov 2009
    Posts: 90
    The not wanting to write reminds me of my GD5. Her fine motor skills are not advanced like her reading, math etc. She also has perfection tendencies and gets frustrated when her writing does not turn out the way she wants it to. A year ago, she would not even draw because she insisted she didn't know how or even color much. At least now she likes to draw - what a change! Hopefully, her writing will be the same. She has quite a bit of writing homework (in Kindergarten) and I have a very difficult time getting her to complete it. However, she is actually getting much better at printing and I try to encourage her. She would be much more receptive to practicing in fun ways, but just does not want to write work to turn in at school.

    Anyway, writing is not a good indicator of giftedness for most kids. BTW, GD says her favorite parts of school are lunch and recess. She has mostly typical K work at school and gets very bored then tends to act out.

    Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4

    Moderated by  M-Moderator, Mark D. 

    Link Copied to Clipboard
    Recent Posts
    Beyond IQ: The consequences of ignoring talent
    by indigo - 05/01/24 05:21 PM
    Technology may replace 40% of jobs in 15 years
    by indigo - 04/30/24 12:27 AM
    NAGC Tip Sheets
    by indigo - 04/29/24 08:36 AM
    Employers less likely to hire from IVYs
    by Wren - 04/29/24 03:43 AM
    Testing with accommodations
    by blackcat - 04/17/24 08:15 AM
    Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5