Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy Just starting to look at DYS program

I have spent the evening reading everyone's posts. It has been very helpful.

I am trying to decide whether or not I should apply for my DS. He turns 5 next week. We have only had IQ testing done with the SB-5 a few months ago. FSIQ 141 with a VIQ of 145 (which seems to meet the minimum requirement). He got four 19's, an 18 and two 17's. The only thing that brought down his score was the average scores in the knowledge sections (both verbal and nonverbal) which I have heard is usually lower for boys at his age.

I can have Achievement testing done privately within the next few months but I am not sure if I should just try the portfolio route. My son shines in math. He loves numbers. His whole day revolves around number and math problem. He loves sport score, probability, comparing relationships, patterns. He is a self taught math whiz. I work full-time and have two other younger children so definitely no hot-housing here.

With his borderline scores on the SB-5 (which I believe he had a ceiling effect--some of the those 19's he actually score beyond the points even required for the 19) I am almost thinking the Math achievement tests might be beneficial (if he's having a good day, of course).

Does anyone have a similar child with similar score that was accepted? Did you use achievement testing or portfolio?

We are hoping that DYS can help advocate for DS since we live in a non-gifted friendly state. I don't even have many private school options. Currently he is doing okay at a Montessori school that can accommodate him until the end of K (another 1.5 years since he missed the K cut-off this year).

Thanks!

Cris

I know other ladies will have much more seasoned advice but I would say that it never hurts trying the application with the portfolio option but based on recent events of my own, I think having those achievement tests to back up the IQ test seems to be a "must have". GL! He does sound like the type of kid they're looking for!

DD had a WISC IV verbal 150 and FSIQ of 140 and was not accepted, however I had no achievement testing to include and the DSYP has asked for that information and I think my portfolio was weak since most of dd's abilities were hard to show on paper.

Hi Cris,
Welcome! It seems like if you just go ahead and get the needed achievement test, you could save yourself some time and emotional wear and tear. My son was tested IQ and WJIII, for 'other reasons' ((anty pantsy in school)) so we had the test to send in.

I'm glad you found us. Isn't it amazing talking to people with similar situations?
Trinity

Hi Cris,

We are in a similar situation to Tammy's.
We are having our DD7 take the WIAT because that is the achievement test our tester uses.
It will be good to see what DD7 actually does know and what she is able to do in terms of achievement.
If nothing else, I hope this information can help me advocate for her in her public school.

Welcome,
Incog

My son may be similar to yours. He is 5 and we just got back his scores. He took WPPSI III, his PIQ is 150, his FSIQ is 144. He is quite good in math and he got 160 on Math on WJ-III which is much more than they ask for. Needless to say we plan to apply to DYS in January.

I say if your son is good in math then the assessment test may be worth to do it at this age. I consider my son being very good in math but not THAT good. KWIM? His score took me by surprise. My guess is that extensive math knowledge at this age is very rare and your son my do really well on the test and get qualifying score with a few points to spare. Good luck

Hi LMom,
Welcome, glad you found us!
Is your son in school? How's it going?
Smiles,
Trinity

Hi and welcome!

We just applied this month!

My ds5 took the WPPSI and came back with a PIQ of 144 and a FSIQ of 148. Like you, though, we hit ceilings with a 19, two 18s and a 17. And he got a straight 10 in coding (particularly variable in gifted kids), which has a considerable effect on the overall score. So we're hopeful that they examine the full score report, which I've heard they do. We also had WIAT-II achievement testing done. which allowed us to apply using the scores method: Ds qualified in both math and language composite (with a 160 on word reading). Fingers crossed!

I'd go ahead and get the achievement testing done. It really has been helpful when advocating with the school, and it gives me a better idea of what to be doing with him!

One note of caution/advice: My ds is a number whiz too -- but he does almost all of it verbally. Because we never spent time teaching him many of the written conventions, he doesn't do as well on standardized tests. He perfectly understands and uses percentages, fractions, etc., but he can't always apply this knowledge to the test. You may want to spend some time with him before getting achievement testing done, to make sure he understands all the written symbols. We just figured out that ds didn't know what a division sign looked like! Of course, your ds may know this stuff, but we were/are like you -- no time for hothousing here! Which meant that ds could do a *lot* of math, but not express it on paper.

Thanks for the words of advice regarding written math. My son prefers to do math in his head but when I need a few minutes alone I usually write a bunch of problem on a sheet of paper for him to solve. Not only has this helped him learn what the symbols mean it also helps him with his writing (which still included a backwards number 5).

I am not very familiar with achievement testing. Are there also ceilings on those or do they continue until they find that the child can't figure out more problems.

I had mentioned on an earlier post that research gave me some insight into how high the standards for admittance into the Davidson Young Scholars program actually are. Here's the reference I pulled from the article "Pursuing Profound Possibilities" on this site at: http://www.davidsongifted.org/db/Articles_id_10041.aspx:

"We use the term "profoundly gifted" to mean individuals with an extremely high level of intellectual precocity. These individuals are identified by demonstrating mastery of a significant amount of content in a particular domain, far beyond the norm for the child's age group, or by a score in the top .001% of their age-peers in a particular domain, as measured by an intelligence or achievement test."

Other references mentioned the "demonstration of ability to function at the level of a talented adult in a specific academic domain."

No surprise that the test scores on specific tests listed on the application are minimum criteria.

Disclaimer: I know nothing about this program other than what I've read online or read here - just reprinting something that may be of interest to some of you.

Yeah, Dottie, I'm afraid they would never let you on their admission team--you'd let us all in!