Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Identification, Testing & Assessment Bombed placement test.

I posted last week regarding my dd 10 who has been approved to accelerate to 6th grade in the fall (skipping 5th). They gave her two math tests last week that they give to all incoming 6th graders. One is a standard math test to place you in either 6th standard grade math or advanced math (the equivalent of 7th grade). The second test they gave her was the 6th grade gifted test to see if she qualifies for 6th grade gifted math (equivalent of 8th grade).

Needless to say she bombed both tests. She scored a 74% on the first and only got 1 out of 26 word problems correct on the second. Both of these tests were of math she has likely never done, but still I was disappointed.

According to her MAP math, she outscores 8th graders on average and has a 99.9 percentile. She got a 75th percentile on the ACT explore in math, which I thought was pretty good all things considered. She currently takes gifted 4th grade math which is equivalent to 5th and half of 6th grade math, and has an A. She also has high WISC-IV scores:
Verbal Comprehension Index 151 >99.9%
Perceptual Reasoning Index 141 99.7%
Working Memory Index 110 75%
Processing Speed 126 96%
Full Scale IQ 144 99.8%

Global Ability Index 156 >99.9

According to the middle school handbook, you have to score into at least 6th grade advanced math in order to get into the gifted Science, Social Studies and English programs (why English I don't know, but since she is ALREADY in the gifted English program at the middle school and getting an A, I'm hoping they will let her continue with it!). She has a 100th percentile in English on the ACT Explore and a 96th percentile in Science on the ACT Explore.

I'm frustrated, scared and worried. The middle school coordinator told me they are discussing the math placement scores, meeting with her current math teacher, the principal and the scheduling person and will get back to me shortly.


I don't understand how a child can score so very high on all these standard tests and have so little working knowledge of the subject in actuality. The tester wrote:

--Struggled with basic computation (when subtracting, she has issues with borrowing and when adding, she had issues carrying numbers. When multiplying 2x2 digits she forgot to put a zero in as a place holder when multiplying the second number).
--Also seemed a little frustrated.
--Did well on problem solving, understands fractions well, read graphs accurately


My husband insists that had she been exposed to the math ahead of time instead of being tested cold, she likely would have done better. He also said we should offer to teach her at home or externally to get her up to their "advanced math" standards. It's all such a disconnect. And I doubt the school will expect "we'll catch her up."

I don't care if she gets into gifted math, she excels in science and social studies and reading/literature. I feel like math is hampering us. She technically meets all their other criteria except for the Math.

I don't want to skip to 6th grade if she is going to be behind where she would have been if she STAYED in 5th grade. If they are going to plop her into non gifted 6th grade based on the math score alone, I'd rather she stay in 5th grade next fall, take the gifted math that will expose her to the math she needs on the stupid placement test, and get into all the gifted programs.

Have you discussed the test results with your daughter? She may have some insight into what happened.

Was the 74% her normed percentile or percent correct?

Oh, she told me she thought the test was "easy" and she "did great on it."

74% was her grade. As in a big fat C

updated because I learned just now a 74% was a C not a D.

Still yucky!

I'd expect the High WISC, Explore and MAP results would be a more accurate snap shot of your daughter's abilities than the 74%. Do you know if it's a national test like the Stanford Achievement Test or a locally developed test?
I'm inclined to agree with your DH.

marieg- I have a dd10 who is in gifted 5th grade classroom and is finishing 6th grade math currently. Last year she did a similar skip like what you are planning. She is not a math genius as science and LA are her strengths. It really helped her when we went over some general concepts beforehand as she is not intuitive with math. But when I showed her something once, she was good to go. I wonder if this is similar with your dd?

Also, this year the school tested her on 5th grade achievement for middle school math placement next year. Since she skipped 5th grade math, she did not do very well on the test. Her teacher and gifted coordinator took that into consideration and she was placed in pre-algebra anyway. Their reasoning was that she is doing well in 6th grade math and is motivated to work hard. I hope your school can also look at the "big picture" and fill in gaps in knowledge instead of slowing down her progress.

Jen

Just some test they came up with.

Oh I hope so. I just don't get the warm and fuzzies from her email.

I would also think that the other tests would be more accurate than their own. Also, one "bad" test among many better scores shouldn't concern them this much.

Could it be that she gets the math conceptually, but hasn't had experience actually solving problems? DSs tester mentioned to us that he grasped above level concepts and could set problems up, but wasn't always able to complete the calculation. She felt it was due to not having the instruction yet. I do see that DS can do mental math far easier and quicker than he can do it with pencil and paper. Once he writes it down, he gets it all confused, especially if he's not had practice with it.

Just a thought.

Unfortunately you've learned the hard way that you can take nothing for granted when it comes to placement tests.

A WISC-IV test is so basic that a 7 year old can do very good on yet have only limited math skills. Their is also a very good possibility that the school isn't teaching her math in the same way that she was tested. It is completely possible that a child could be taught only basic math in terms of add/subtract/multiply/divide and have no word problems at all. If that child was then given a test that was 100% word problems they could very easily just freak out and get none right... not because they were stupid but because they were given something they had never been exposed to before.

Working with her on your own might be the best way forward in math as it would appear that what the school teaches in the elementary grade isn't what they test later on.

If being in the advanced programs is very important to you then why not hold her back instead of skipping a grade... there is nothing wrong with a child not finishing school when they normally would... not to mention there are other issues you will have to face when you push a child to skip grades - social issues like a lack of friends, not fitting in, being small.... you have a great reason now not to skip a grade and it would give you a lot of time to prep her for the math test she would then take again.