Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Learning Environments New to all of this - 6year old DD in 1st grade

My daughter just turned 6 last month and is in first grade. She's an avid reader, loves all kinds of books, fiction & non-fiction. She'll read any book you put in front of her - from a baby board book to an encyclopedia. She also loves science experiments, piano lessons and "projects." She always has some project going on. Her memory and ability to pick up facts, new vocabulary is also surprising. She enjoys school and says it's fun.

We just had parent/teacher conferences tonight and learned nothing. The teacher said she's doing fine, tested her at a "K" guided reading level and that's great because that's the end of 1st grade, so she's way ahead. However, I know that her reading level is well beyond that. The teacher wants to keep her at that level because to ensure comprehension, etc. I asked if she ever would give her books beyond that and she said no.

She also tops the chart in math. But that's just first grade math. I know her capabilities are well beyond that too.

In addition, she can be a perfectionist and has been learning to control her emotions (angry, throwing tantrums -- but that has improved.

We have met with a private practice school psychologist who specializes in underachievement. We have a meeting with him and the teacher in a couple weeks. When we first met with him we were impressed with the fact that he could describe our daughter without even meeting her, based on his experience working with other similar children. He cautioned us that our daughter may "get lost in the crowd" because she is always meeting expectations and may never stand out.

I have always hesitated to be one of "those moms" and am always second guessing myself about my daughter's abilities. The teacher asked us today what we will be discussing at the meeting in a few weeks. I told her to discuss a plan for our DD's abilities and emotions. She knew a bit about her emotions and we already have a pretty good "cooling off" plan in place at school. But with respect to the giftedness, I have no idea what to do. I'm afraid that she's already getting lost in the crowd.

Thoughts? Comments?

Welcome Becky C!
Glad you found us? BTW, how did you find us, I'm just curious...

First of all- your daughter sounds like a delightful person. I'm really proud of you for setting up a safe school routine. My son still appears 'more emotional' than a boy of his age 'should be.' Well, I figure that if the boy sitting next to him had been worrying about global warming for the last 6 years, then my son would suddenly look quite normal.

I'm glad that you found a professional who was able to discribe your daughter just from her circumstances - pretty cool, yes? Wait until you met the rest of us (LOL)...

So - what spurred you to make the appointment with the 'underachievement specialist' in the first place.

If you've read 'Genius Denied' then you've heard of 'Enforced Underachievement' - which sounds like exactly what your daughter's school is doing to her! And yes, 'Enforced Underachievement' can damage a child -

I keep track of the 'perfectionist moments' to track how my kid is doing -

Is he willing to try new things?
Is he willing to try new things that are hard?
Is he willing to stick with learning challenges that don't come instantly?

As for the emotional outbursts - I think that they are part of the territory, and our job is to teach them how to 'melt down gracefully' and 'prevent unnescessary melt downs' rather than to avoid them altogether.

Have you thought about a gradeskip? Has the school offered subject accelerations? Do you have IQ and Achievement scores?

Smiles,
Grinity

Thanks --

We decided to seek out the advice of the psychologist after our daughter was having these extreme tantrums - throwing things, turning over her keyboard (use for piano practice), fighting and hitting friends during play dates, hitting us....the list went on. We read the book "The Explosive Child" and it was a big help and also took the advice of the psychologist to give our DD an "out" -- or a time out -- not a disciplinary time out, but a cooling off spot. It was such a simple solution. And it's been working great. We haven't had any major outburst like that in at least a month. The teacher is totally on board with it and lets our DD "Take Two" in the hallway or whenever she needs it.

I like the idea of keeping track of the perfectionist moments. Like today she was really frustrated that her handwriting was sloppy while working on a brownie badge project. She used to have these moments during her piano practice - throwing the keyboard over and throwing the music book. However, the small challenges she overcomes with the piano practice has helped her cope in these situations. It's much better. The great thing about Piano is it's completely individualized. The instructor has no qualms about accelerating her. She's already on the 3rd book after only 6 months of lessons. It's great!

Regarding the gradeskip. The psychologist mentioned it but I'm hesitant about it because she's actually the youngest in the class. We transferred to WI last year. Technically for her age, she should be in Kindergarten this year, but fortunately, the state where we used to live had a later cutoff and she had already started Kindergarten. She does get along with older kids really well. One of her good friends across the street is a fourth grade and they play REALLY well together.

No IQ or Achievement tests yet. I do think they have them in later grades though.

This sounds a lot like my DS4 (nearly 5) who's just started school. He's also being sent home with things to read which are very easy for him to read - but he does enjoy reading them, and there are usually things in the story to talk about that lead on to interesting conversations and often to looking things up. With reading, for now, I'm taking the view that this isn't a problem, and the argument might apply to your DD too. His reading is so far advanced that he simply doesn't need help there: he can read anything he really wants to already, and he's improving the mechanics of reading just by doing that. He's obviously going to reach true adult reading competence without anyone doing anything. And after all *I* don't choose reading by whether it's at my reading level, I read things I find interesting. So I'm happy to see interest as the most important thing.

I'd be more worried about the maths, because there it's less easy (still possible sometimes, but less easy!) to find interest and development in doing things which are mechanically easy. Maybe that's the place to push for differentiation, if you don't want to do a gradeskip?

The other thing that gives me comfort for my DS is that he is doing huge amounts of mathematical and scientific things at home, and it sounds as though your DD does too. There I think our main task is to "just say no" to homework that gets in the way of more valuable learning: e.g. I will not stop him drawing nets of solid shapes to cut out and build so that he can do more of the same stuff he's been doing in school! So he is still developing in those areas. Given that and the fact that he loves school, I think we're OK for now, though I am watching carefully for any sign that he might be getting bored.

As I said on another thread, at least for young children I think there's a lot to be said for the view that *one* good challenge at school at any one time can be enough to make it OK, provided they're happy and the other areas are getting addressed at home. For my DS it's writing at present; for your DD it maybe has been her emotions, and maybe at your next meeting you need to discuss how the school can make sure she still has a major challenge there even once the basic management of her behaviour is not so hard for her?

Wow Becky C - that must have been so scary! I'm really glad to hear that things are improving.

I have some thoughts - my son (now 12) was stressed beyond his limits just from long hours of exposure to agemates, and teachers with agemates expectations, by the time he was 5. The signs were there at 4, but we always found a way to 'help him cope' without actually addressing the problem. He is a 'summer birthday' boy in a neighborhood where the boys are routinely held back a year in kindy (redshirted) - so he was the youngest male in his 21-child 2nd grade room, and he was absolutly expected to have the fine and gross motor skills of the boys who were 18 months older than himself. I hated that. But by 2nd grade he really needed a full skip to have some kind of challenge at school in addition to the challenge of caused by physical maturation which, while normal for his age, was very difficult for him to live with.

If there had been an local (enough) private school for 'beyond MG' gifted kids, so that he could have had deep conversations, and lots of relaxed penmanship practice, that would have been idea, and a gradeskip wouldn't have been even considered. Sadly, no such alternative existed, so we asked for the skip. In our case, even with test scores that got him into the YSP, the school saw him as a cranky (spoiled) bright kid, nothing unusual, and denied even subject acceleration. They really wanted him to 'behave' and believed that their role was to point out his inability to cope with the situation, and train him to cope with it.

They were also open to 'enrichment' because they believed that they could met the needs of every child in each classroom. They did a lot of special assignments for him, and he responded beautifully to each. It's really hard with one's own child not to see an improvement and be grateful and 'leave it at that.'

Anyway, but the end of 4th grade, he was totally used to not being challenged, and though it was his 'right' not to have to work hard in school. He had many friends, who he loved entertaining with is 'creativity.' He was older and better able to 'sit,' although people routinely thought he had 'something wrong with him.' He felt so allied to his friends! Yet still he was heavily masking himself to keep those friends.

I switched him to private school, hoping for an increased challenge, and got the gradeskip within a month! He had the intellectual skill, but not the organizational skill or work ethic. He played catch up for two years. The teachers worked really, really hard with him. It was very intense, and expensive.

I guess I would say that if your professional suggests that a gradeskip is nescessary, then doing it sooner rather than later is better. You daughter may need a gradeskip AND subject accelerations in various subjects. At this point my son is back in public school, summmer birthday + redshirting + gradeskip and has a nice bunch of friends to hang with, is doing well with academics, and happy.

It's been beaten into our heads that all children develop at a particular rate, and that to be happy, one has to be with agemates. We adults don't only choose to be friends with other adults who are within 1 year of our age! Why? Because we adults are presumed to already be developed. I'm here to say that our kids are a whole lot of different ages, and will need to be friends with many many kids of many different ages.

I would suggest spending time reading the posts here, where lots of kids need 2 or more year age gaps to find normal classrooms where they can face the normal childhood challenges.

I would suggest spending time inside a 1st grade, 2nd grade and 3rd grade classroom, perhaps an hour each, and observe the children and the teachers, just to assure yourself that the child you know so well wouldn't be 'swamped' with the older rooms.

Remember that schools aren't often aware of the difference between a bright child who is strong-willed, and a child who is beyond the average 2/3 of gifted kids and acting out due to having to put up with the abuse of not really ever having to work hard enough to develop work ethic. School won't ever be like piano lessons, but many have found that with some flexibility, grade skips, subject accelerations, afterschooling, that the fit is 'good enough.'

Smiles,
Grinity

Thanks again everyone!

I know that it's going to have to be my job to get my DD placed in the right environment. I always had a feeling that the Teachers would just simply bring it up and know what to do, but I know now that is not the case. Also, It's hard to talk to other parents about this and search out advice. They think you are bragging or something. I only have a few very good friends who know my situation. I was in a state of discouragement, but now I'm glad to have found this message board for support.

I am finding it somewhat surprising, that we're falling into that "text-book" case. My DH and I also realized that when we were her age, there wasn't these extra support and resources for gifted kids. Him and I have both had conversations about how ridiculously easy we we though school was; it was effortless. Even for myself, I would show up in to a HS AP Physics class one morning and the teacher would put an exam on our desks. I would think to myself: "Oh, we have an exam today? Oh ok." and ace the test. I never studied in school and always excelled. It was when I reached my college engineering courses that caused the breakdown for me, because I had no idea how to study. My DH went the opposite, he checked out at about 6th grade out of boredom. Also, we both had emotional issues with our peers as kids. I feel like I see what "could" happen to our DD if we don't intervene. I guess I was in a state of denial that it would all just "work itself" out with the teacher providing all the answers. Nope...I'm starting to realize what I need to do.

Becky,

Don't be afraid of gradeskips. I had several then they were taken away when we moved to a less tolerant school district. It was not until I got into my teens that I could advocate for myself. I was always happier around kids 3-6 years older than I.

My DW was successfully gradeskipped early and then they moved as well. By 8th grade, despite clear indicators of her abilities, she was ignored, and she began to focus on sports and social things, and did not pick up her stride until the last few years.

Your DD is fortunate to have a mom who is aware of and advocates for her as is your right to do so.

Yeah, I still am amazed after a life time of being a 'leftie-outie.' ((tears welling up))

And I tried so hard to believe that 'gifted doesn't matter.' Anyone want to buy some used clothes? Once worn by an Emporer?

I told myself that I couldn't be so very smart - look at my spelling ((blush)) and handwriting?

Anyway - since being with agemates is unsatisfying, and doesn't teach good work habits, and isn't fun, is there any reason NOT to try 'something else?' It may not work, but I think you do get points for trying...

Grins

Agreed, Grin. And those points for trying matter! To kids, often just knowing that parents care enough to do SOMETHING is enough to solve a lot of the problems, even if the attempted solution doesn't actually work out.

Definitely try something to solve the problems!

As for not wanting to be "that mom," I realized at one point in my son's school career that I'd rather be "that mom" than have him be "that kid." I can take it; he can't. Be as cooperative and easy to deal with as you can, naturally, but I say advocate and let the label they pick for you fall where it may!