Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy I don't know where to turn - vent

I'm so upset and I don't know where to get answers. Pud's behavior has been awful. I resorted to spanking him yesterday, which I hate to do. He says he doesn't want to mind because he doesn't want to be told what to do. He doesn't want to do certain things (get dressed, brush teeth) because they are boring. I think he is not challenged at school, despite the gradeskip to 3rd. He's making a lot of 90s and 100s without much effort. He doesn't even bring his books home anymore after he brought home his math book one weekend to study for the Monday test but didn't write down what he was supposed to study. Of course, he aced the test and now doesn't think he needs to bring home his books. He fights doing his homework. He fights practicing his piano. He fights getting dressed. He is rebellious and defiant and I'm tired and frustrated and I have not clue what to do. This morning he missed breakfast because he didn't get dressed in time.

I'm trying to figure him out. I'm trying to challenge him. He's reading "The Hobbit" and was doing long division this summer. What I see coming home from school is nowhere near what he needs. He won't try hard things. He won't do easy things. I have no idea what things he needs to challenge him. I don't even know if not being challenged is the problem. Maybe 3rd grade is too much. With the behaviour problems, I can't see us homeschooling. That's just way too much together time. I can't seem to find a good childcare situation. There's a drop-in childcare place but there would be no children his age. We joined a homeschool group but that doesn't seem to be working out. He's either not interested in the events or he won't get his work done so that we can go. And, even if we homeschooled and went to all these events where he could be around other kids, I need time to myself.

I know I sound like a broken record. I just don't know what to do or where to turn. DH isn't any help, in fact, sometimes he makes the problem worse. I don't know how to help any of us. I'm not sure how we got into this situation with our sweet, happy, mellow little guy. What happened to my happy, compliant 4 yo? I know none of you have answers but maybe just getting this off my chest will help. I'm just in tears today because I can't seem to get anywhere.

I took his karate belt away from him 2 weeks ago because he has started hitting and kicking me. His teacher told him he couldn't have it back for a month. The counter starts over if he is physically aggressive again, which he was on Friday. He's very angry and I don't know why. The grade skip? The new school? Daddy and I being gone for 2 weeks this summer? Bored? All of the above? None of the above? Just his personality?

His pyschologist was not much help last spring. I called her about 8 days ago and asked for either an appointment or a name of a behavioural psych who could help us. She has not returned my call. I've read books. I ordered the book about "The Spririted Child" although I've already read it. Maybe having my own copy and rereading it will help. I've been going through the SENG "Parenting Gifted Kids" book and started a class that meets once a week. It seems to only raise more questions.

I feel guilty that I bailed on the public school and didn't push more for accomodations. I feel I gave up. I don't know what to do if this school isn't the answer. I know some of you have said the behavior problems clear up when you homeschool and the child is challenged. I don't know how to make that happen. I've had several things I've wanted to do with him in the afternoons and on Friday (he only goes to school 2 1/2 hours a day 4 days a week) but I either can't get him to mind long enough to do them or he pokes around and takes forever to do his homework (again, it's not hard for him - he's either bored or he's slow). I'm about to give up. But, that's not really an option, is it? You can't give up being a parent. AAAAACCKKKKKKKKK! I don't know what to do. Not sure I should even post this. It all just seems like too much.

Here are my two thoughts. They are just a starting point. Other people will surely have more.

First, is he able to tell you anything about while he feels so bad? Can you ask him directly? "Gee, you just seem like you are having a lot of bad days. It makes me sad that you feel bad. Do you know what is wrong?"

Second, when DS went through these spells (mostly when he was four), my first instinct was to punish and yell and reason with him. But what actually worked was to keep my mouth shut and give him a really big long hug. Lots of touching and affection throughout the day to reassure him that he was safe went a long way.

Just the first 2 things that popped into my mind....

I have four boys and can understand your frustration maybe he needs one to one attention from you and I don't mean academicaly. Pehaps a long walk or a day at the park. I have a ten your who was so sweet and loving and yes now he too is rebellious he even yelld at me but one has to stay grounded and use discipline by that I mean take away what he loves the best wheter games,clothes, anything that will make him know that you are in control. I also feel that this is what some boys experience have you though also of perhaps having a meeting with his teacher and seeing if maybe he feels uncomable with his new peers? Keep us posted and I wish you the bet of luck!

Oh, squirt! I wish there were a hug smiley... ((hugs)).

I've forgotten how old Pud is, but I can tell you that my kids (especially DD) have gone through periods of defiant behavior that have driven me to tears and desperation. I know how it feels to be completely frustrated and out of ideas.

Number one is to make sure that you or your DH is not giving him the impression that you expect bad behavior when he's bored.

Maybe it would help to just drop all the extras for a while--no karate, piano, etc. Go into reset mode. He earns extras by doing the required stuff (getting dressed, brushing teeth, doing homework.) If he is truly bored he will want those extras. Or maybe he will want different extras.

Stop feeling guilty about the public school. You made what you thought was the best decision with the information you had at the time. The behavior issues may not have anything to do with school. Or they may be related to school but would still be a problem at the public school.

Re: spanking--we've used spanking very sparingly, too. My kids do get spanked for aggressively kicking/hitting someone. Snotty/defiant behavior results in instant banishment to their rooms followed by a lecture from me and possible loss of allowance/privileges. YMMV.

Squirt, hang in there. I said and did some awful things at that age, too. My dad was pretty firm with me, unlike my mom.

Having been around boys a lot, they can do things that are horribly destructive to things or relationships and not understand what harm they can cause.

I kept my nephews on a short leash when they lived with me ( after learning my lesson, lol) and it worked a lot better. By sort leash, I mean lists of chores and a written schedule for the week. I withheld dessert, tv, and their favorite books if they did not meet their obligations. One thing I always did and still do with them, when they visit, is workout with them each day - a walk, a run, weights, etc.

I made them clean up dinner, trash, mop, sweep, vacuum, laundry, etc. Then I had more time to spend with them or they on homework.

I love the advice others have offered (extra one on one time, asking him what's making him angry, more structure, exercise, take away extras). My heart goes out to you--time will help. One parent on another thread suggested monitoring diet & sleep.

My most difficult DS responds to one on one time, exercise, alone time (when he's misbehaving, sending him to be alone--without technology around--essentially either to lie down or read or just think/daydream..kind of like a "time out" but not labelled as such). Does your DS have his own room? I've told my son that if he behaves inappropriately, he needs to do it in his own space, not in public. He generally reappears in a little while a completely different person.

If he's underchallenged at school, steadily work to address those needs, but panicking and reacting to bad behavior (we've all done it--or at least I have) isn't as effective as reason and patience and perseverance. You may not find the right fit academically for him since he's very advanced, so you might have to supplement at home. ALEKS for math, educational videos like Planet Earth or Bill Nye, keep reading good books and discuss if you can, puzzles, board games.

My difficult DS's perfect behavior and angelic disposition appear when I devote myself to him entirely. We'll bake together, play board games, practice the piano, work on his homework, do a puzzle, etc. Of course I don't have that kind of time all the time. But if I do that every once in a while, it seems to bring the old DS back.

Lastly, depending on many other factors that I can't evaluate, you might consider ADD or ADHD and medications. It can make the world of difference to a family.

squirt - i cannot add much to the other excellent advice here, but i wanted to add my e-hugs. We are going through a spell of bad behavior here, too, though not to the extent of yours. We are blaming it on changes related to having to go to back to preschool, but haven't yet been too successful in changing the bad behaviors yet. I feel like we're always on the defensive "that behavior is inappropriate" etc. I have to remind myself to find a time to catch him being good.

OH Squirt - I want to send big cyberhugs. I went through the same thing with DS8 last year.

Squirt, I am so sorry! I went through a very similar experience for about 9 months with my dd6. I knew she was not challenged enough in school, but we were doing lots of other activities, but she still seemed so angry a lot and we couldn't figure it out. She wouldn't tell us what was really going on and we were having lots of behavior problems and outbursts at home; she was fine in school. I was so exasperated and felt like I was failing her and then I read a book called "The 5 Love Languages of Children". It was a real eye-opener to me on how I interacted with my daughter. We were speaking different "love languages". Sounds kind of cheesy if you haven't read the book but it makes sense in context. Her love language is touch and mine isn't. Once I learned that and learned to include a lot more touch during the day it really made a huge difference. And also I learned that spanking for her was the worst thing I could do as a punishment because touch is such an important way to communicate for her, so a negative touch is like saying I hate you. Just another suggestion. I hope everything works out soon for you and your ds.

I wonder if more gifted kids have touch as a love language? Someone mentions more hugging, and the love languages (actually I like those books). My son - he needs a great deal of "touch". I had to put my foot down last year because he wanted to sleep in my bed every night and he's just too old you know?

At age 10, he still comes and snuggles in my lap when we watch TV! I'm certain that's his main one, he also has another language of encouraging words. I try to do a lot of both with him.

I feel for you Squirt. We also go through phases of defiant, negative behavior. I've found that it's helpful for me to have a concrete "plan" when disrespectful defiant behavior rears it's ugly head. Otherwise I become emotionally reactive, which just escalates the problem.

Has your DS gone through defiant periods like this before? Take a step back and think about what has worked so that you can come up with a plan and gain control again. Only you and those close to your son can really say what will work for him. For my DS, my plan is based on the book "How to Behave so your Children Will Too" by Sal Severe. Each time we go through these phases I make DH and I review this book. DS needs very clear-cut expectations and consequences written down in a chart form. Pick something that has worked for your DS in the past and stick with it - then tweak it if it doesn't work in a couple of weeks.

oh, I feel for you - we've through some really rough times, too.

Our DS8 also really respond to touch. If he is really at his worst (and he can be baaaaad) and I just stop everything and let him sit on me while I wrap my arms around him, it's almost like he re-sets himself.

hugs to you, too.

Oh Squirt, I have had just a wee bit of experience in the joys of parenting, as you describe them. <heavy sigh>. I don't remember the age of your DS, but I can share a story with you. One day I dropped DS off for school. I was bleary-eyed and frazzled to the core by his defiant behavior. He was seven and had skipped to third grade in mid-year. Another mom, who looked equally tired and frazzled came up and started talking about her 7 yrs old son who was suddenly on a terror. We had a good laugh about how something must have been in the air, since one after another, other moms of seven yrs olds started to come over and voice the same complaints. It was if they were all going through the same phase, at the same time. <God pity the poor teachers, to have a room full of them!>

All I can say is that DS seems to go through one of these phases whenever he is passing some form of cognitive/learning/growth milestone. I read somewhere that when a child learns something big (learning to walk, learning to read, etc), then the entire brain get rewired. It is almost as if the brain has to adapt to learning something so fundamental, that it has to reorganize and link this new information to all of its previous data. I wish I remember where I read this (it was at least 5 years ago, so hopefully it is not out-of-date). But I remember going "Ahhha!" when DS was 4 or 5. It seemed like anytime he was on the cusp of learning something or even just a hugh growth spurt, he got emotionally all out of sorts, as well as needing extra sleep to process it all.

Give it a month or two, which I know is hard when you are close to tears and pulling your hair out. Do all of the things that others have suggested; the extra hugs, the exercise, the talking through it all, the setting of boundaries and discipline. All of this is important for learning how to deal with anger and frustration. But also just try to ride the storm out. This too shall pass. <hopefully>

FWIW, my DS8 has grown 2 inches in the last two weeks. He has been an absolute pickle to be around for all of this time. I keep asking him if he has been bitten by the snarling spider that I have seen hiding around. I have been feeding him mountains of food, putting him to bed early at night, and taking him out to play in the creek beds (catching crawfish, building dams, and finding fossils) for long hours on the weekend. He seems to need extra time outside in the peaceful outdoors to just be with his thoughts. (plus DH loves to build dams and I love to collect fossils, so it is an activity that the whole family loves!)

Thanks Ruby for the book suggestion. I will have to look that up. It would explain many, many things in our household! My DS get very huggy whenever he is in this state. I feel like he has been velcro-ed to me for the last two weeks solid!!

Hi Squirt,

You sound just like I felt not so long ago. We'd never had anything like that before and it was devastating. I'd start crying just telling people about it.

It seems to be behind us now, but I'm still not sure what caused it: I suspect it may have been a combination of things.

Like you I went back to smacking, which I hadn't done in ages. I went through all sorts of angst after the first time I did it, but came to the conclusion that in this instance it was necessary. He was violent to us, was damaging the house and putting himself in danger. So it became a regular response to certain kinds of behaviour, and although I felt awful doing it I really think it helped. I think that having a consistent and immediate consequence perhaps gave him more faith in me as a maintainer of limits. It would always be followed by lots of affectionate cuddling, confirmation of love, confirmation of expected behaviour, talking through of emotions. We often couldn't talk to him at all until spanking - his face would glaze over and he would scream to cover up our voices if we tried to speak.

Other things that may have helped... A lot more physical affection - even more than usual, because we're quite keen on that anyway. His teacher called us at home a couple of times to talk through what was happening - I think he appreciated the concern. I changed my parenting approach to give him more responsibility for managing himself: he has seemed to respond really well to that, and the plus side for me is much less nagging! Should have done this ages ago. I also tried to talk him through issues I think he may have been having with his school group - to confirm with him that it's fine not to play with people if you don't like the games they play or the way they behave to you. And that if you like playing with the girls then that's fine too. I arranged some play with non-school friends to take the focus away from the school group, particularly with his besty from kindy who, now I think about these things, is probably GT too - we didn't appreciate how lucky we were at the time. Walks in the forest have always helped to restore his equilbrium. And more adult conversations - eg about the relative merits of systems of government, whys and wherefores of terrorism (he likes contemplating political/moral issues) - engage him with us and I think help him in the process of sorting out his view of the world and his place in it. Sorry - that last isn't put very well at all - hope you can salvage some sense from it.

I sincerely hope your troubles don't last too long - it's an awful place to be.

Regards
BK

squirt, sending hugs your way. I'll commiserate with you. The kids were crazy when they got home from school today, and I just don't know what to do with DS5 (this is the one without the LDs). He thinks it's funny to push my buttons and to tease everyone around him. He knows when he's behaving badly and does it anyway. He called me something like poopyhead, and then laughed when I got angry (after I had yelled at him for calling someone else a similar name). Grrrrr... Usually these things happen when I'm holding the baby and trying to get a thousand other things done. Then when I tried to sneak off and get the baby to bed quietly (which took longer than I had hoped), chaos reined in the other room - I had wanted them to take baths. DS2 was supposed to be in the bathtub with DD7, but instead he was naked sitting on the wet counter playing in the sink, DS5 (one with LDs) was playing in the other sink, and DS5 (the one pushing my buttons) wanted to make his sister mad so while she was in the tub he took all the books off her bookshelf and put them on the floor of his room, running back and forth with that evil giggle (I heard it while I was trying to get the baby to sleep - I knew it was a bad sign). It was a huge mess. I could not put into words how mad I was. He did get a spanking, and he did put the books back in her room after getting yelled at, but I had to rearrange them on the shelves. Spanking doesn't seem to do much to him (and time outs are useless). One thing I happened upon, almost by necessity to drag him to a time out when I'm holding the baby, is that I pull him up by his very short hair - I started doing that when he refused to stand up and I couldn't bend down. Now he knows what's coming so at least I get a limited amount of obedience when I threaten to do that. The shame of this bad streak is that often times he's my most helpful child. I can't figure it out, but in his case it's a very typical boy thing - I remember my brothers teasing alot. I can't believe I even threatened to wash his mouth out with soap...

I recently started a chart of points for computer time (I think someone on this board suggested it?) and it worked great the first day. Unfortunately, the magic has worn off when it comes to getting points for getting ready for bed. For the second night in a row, DD7 was the only one who got points. DS5 won't even do piano for points - I will have to drag him to the piano tomorrow and stand there the whole time he practices.

The physical affection suggestion sounds good; I'll try that, though it might be tricky - for DS5 the timing will have to be right, I think (he's the type to push me away).

Speaking of which, tonight's bedtime exhausted me and I need to get some sleep...

You've all given me a lot to consider. Pud is 7 and is an only child. He gets a lot of my one-on-one attention. I would guess his love language is touch; mine isn't. He seems to be getting along fine at school. The only comment I've gotten is that he "dominates" the class by blurting out the answers before others have a chance to "figure it out". The math teacher told me he is very smart. They were doing fact families the other day (5+0=5, 5-0=5, etc) and the teacher was waiting for someone to tell her another fact. Pud told her 0-5=-5. Well, of course, they haven't learned that so she told him he was right but they weren't going to study that yet. She told me not to let him do too much math at home because then he'd have nothing to learn at school. I didn't tell her about long division!

I am thinking about what someone said about "minimums". If I could just get him to get dressed and brush his teeth and do his chore (it's been to unload the dishwasher every day but maybe I could find a different one since he is so resistant). I don't know how to get him to brush his teeth - short of holding him down and physically forcing the toothbrush in his mouth and scrubbing (which my husband can do but I don't know if I could, strengthwise). The teeth-brushing is a priority right now because he went to the dentist for a cleaning about 3 weeks ago and his teeth were awful. The hygenist and the dentist both emphasized that he HAD to do a better job brushing.

It's frustrating because we've tried rewards, consequences, taking things away, sticker charts, time-outs, everything we can think of. Nothing seems to reach him. I'm thinking of two strategies for the teeth: brush them for him every night or put him in the bathroom at 8 pm and tell him he has to stay there until he brushes. If that means he falls asleep in there, then I guess that's what would happen. I don't know. He seems to be one of those kids we read about in the DNA article that doesn't learn from consequences.

I've asked him repeatedly what upsets him, how he feels when he hits, what is going on in his head when he acts up. I get: "I don't want to do what you tell me to do".

I got this question on the spanking: "how come it's okay for you to hit me but it's not okay for me to hit you?". Umm, well, because I'm the parent?

Thanks for all the suggestions. I'll have to think about it and decide what to work on specifically first. Figure out what are the most important things? And, I'll work on more touching. I know he's almost always in our bed or on the floor at the foot of our bed in the mornings. He says he just wants to be close to us.

I'll have to reread all of these posts several times and learn from your experiences.

Re: toothbrushing. I would have him practice brushing while a timer runs (and you supervise) and then brush them for him. Our dentist said that kids don't have the motor skills to do a good job until they're at least six. I still give DD9 a touchup, especially because she gets more tartar on her teeth from wearing a retainer.

If he likes to sing, he should sing through the alphabet song twice (we did it in German or French, isnce I know those languages, and it made it more entertaining), or happy birthday twice. That's always worked to keep my kids brushing long enough.

HUGs to all of you!

We too go through those phases with DS now 9. It seem like the school may not be advanced enough for him but I'm not sure you are going to find one that is. Pud is a very quick child

I dont' have anything to add except on the teeth brushing issue. Could there be a sensory issue there? I know that even today, I have to brace myself and just get through brushing my teeth. I really hate the feel of the brush. I've tried all sorts of different ones, but all of them feel like nails on a chalkboard to me. Even though there might not be a solution, if he really hates the sensation, it can help to understand why it isn't getting done. If this is a morning activity, it might be playing into everything that happens the rest of the day. Chewing those colored tablets before I brushed helped as a child. At least I knew what my goal was and when I was done. A drink of Ice water after helped too take away the sensation.

Again HUGS

Kriston, how does one sing while brushing teeth? I've never been able to figure that out

"Ahh, baah, cahh, dahh..."



Seriously! It actually leads to laughing and longer brushing. All good!

When they were young and I was still brushing teeth for them, I did the singing. Maybe that makes a bit more sense...

a motor toothbrush can be useful, too - one with a timer?

except, of course, our dh was mesmerized by the movement of the brush and then took to using it in other ways ...

We have a simple rule for brushing. Either they let me brush their teeth (they are 4 and 6) or there are no sweets, juices and such next day. Of course, they still have to eat, but they are not allowed anything with sugar in it. I make sure they understand it's not a punishment but a consequence. Since the bacterias feed on sugar and if they don't want to clean their teeth it's better to stay away from all sugar to keep their teeth healthy

I don't recall the last time I had problem with their teeth brushing

This is what we do too - it works great!

Toothbrushing thoughts: DS hated mint and all the strong flavors or normal toothpaste. Once we found Tom's of Maine Silly strawberry, things got better. Do you know how hard it is to find a non-mint toothpaste?

DS has sensory issues and the only thing he hated more than brushing was going to the dentist. I finally told him that the natural consequence of not brushing was going to the dentist more for professional cleanings. Then I let him choose. And he chose to brush!

I think if there is an area that you have completely locked horns on, I would probably actually just take a break, give up on it since the ongoing battles tend to entrench people deeper in their positions. Once things have calmed down (after a few days) go over the situation. One of my favorite phrases with DS is "if you were the mom and I was the kid and I wouldn't brush my teeth, what would you do?" That puts their considerable brain power to work on your side!

And remember, he probably will start brushing his teeth eventually, at least by the time he has a girlfriend

We have that rule, too, but it hasn't helped. Not even when he knows he is going to the baseball game with Dad and won't be able to have ice cream. I've also tried the threat of the professional cleaning once a month. He doesn't mind the dentist doing it one bit.

I hadn't thought about sensory issues. But, if he doesn't mind the cleaning at the dentist, I wonder. We tried the SoniCare brush with the timer but it just made a mess because he couldn't hold all that in his mouth and the dentist told him not to swallow flouride toothpaste. We've also tried the stuff that turns your teeth red, or whatever color. He did let me brush them this morning but it took a long time and I had to stop after each section (we do quarters of the mouth) and let him spit and rinse. It worked okay so maybe we'll try that again.

[quote=acs]

I think if there is an area that you have completely locked horns on, I would probably actually just take a break, give up on it since the ongoing battles tend to entrench people deeper in their positions. Once things have calmed down (after a few days) go over the situation. One of my favorite phrases with DS is "if you were the mom and I was the kid and I wouldn't brush my teeth, what would you do?" That puts their considerable brain power to work on your side!

[quote]

Good idea about the being entrenched, I'll have to give it some real thought, acs.

Keep the ideas coming as long as you want, I'm listening and hopefully learning.

The electric toothbrushes clean much better than manual ones. If he's not doing a good job, I would switch him to one. I wouldn't have him hold it all in his mouth. Just have him spit/rinse as needed. My Braun one goes for 2min and vibrates to let you know when time is up.

My DS8 had issues w/ the toothpaste. We went through 3 brands/flavors before I found one he could tolerate. It's still a batter to get him to brush long enough. What toothpaste turns red?

If only they were all like my 5yr old. He's been solo brushing since 4yrs old and always has 5star reports from the dentist. They could never believe that I don't brush his teeth for him. he is the only one where i actually have to replace the toothbrush on schedule. i don't need to replace DS8's nearly as often as DS5s and he's the one the dentist talks to about brushing longer etc.

FOr my DS, I finally had to stand in the doorway while he brushed his teeth. And if he doesn't brush long enough, he has to go back and do it again. It's been a long battle.

I have to admit the awful truth... I still brush DS8's teeth. He has enough plague buildup over 6 months on the back of his front bottom teeth that the dentist has to use a special tool to get them clean (I don't know if it uses sound waves or water pressure, but it blasts the tartar off in record time.) So DS usually has his nose buried deep in a book when I brush them. I know that he has to do it himself eventually, but it is just not a battle that we can fight right now. His teeth are clean, no cavities, and when he gets tired of his mom doing it for him, he will one day just decide to do it himself.

We tried an electric toothbrush, but the noise from the motor was way too much for our sensitive ears. If they could make a whisper quiet one, then that would be the way to go.


See, this is us exactly to a tee. Only child with lots of one-on-one attention. He is constantly hugging us (deep, pressure-filled hugs) and clinging to us, whereas I am extremely sensitive to touch, enough that even gentle hugs can be painful. (and I wonder where he gets his sensitivity issues from???) We don't set an alarm clock in the mornings because he wakes us up by flying out of his room at a high rate of speed and pouncing on us in a way that would make Tigger proud! I've also noticed last year that he needed to constantly be in contact with his friends at school, and the gentle hugs and arms around shoulders were not appreciated by the other boys. I look forward to reading the above book suggestion in order to understand this particular issue.

The only other thing that I can add about discipline is that we finally found DS's weakness. He is very into earning money these days by doing chores. He volunteered without prompting this weekend to mop the kitchen floor for me in order to earn some money. We don't give him very much money, which he is starting to realize by having discussions with other kids about allowances, but we give him a quarter here or there for a chore. So when we get tired of a particular behavior, we inform him that the next time he does it, it will cost him a quarter. We have been battling with him for quite a long while about... hummm, how should I put this delicately... leaving Lake Erie on the bathroom floor due to aiming issues. Finally, I told him that the next time I had to clean the bathroom floor, it would cost him a quarter. He never missed again. I also made a habit, when DS was about 5, of charging him a quarter anytime he was disrespectful, i.e. calling me a poopy-head, or other such name. That phase vanished instantly. It is equivalent to the change jar that people used to use for breaking the habit of saying a four-letter word. I still have to remind him that snarky behavior will cost him every once in a while, but generally he knows that it is just not worth it. It is one way to use these kids great math skills to our advantage. DS could calculate how fast his piggybank would go down if a particular behavior continued.

Math skills => Discipline => Happy Mom! What could be better?

But really it is about finding the one bit of leverage that your particular child will respond to.

Same here for DD8 and DD6. I let them brush their own teeth and they ended up both getting a cavity. Now I brush either at night or morning and supervise them flossing and rinsing with ACT.

Thanks, 'Neato. Now I don't feel like the bad mom who is creating a totally dependent kid!! I almost went back and erased that confession, just because I was so embarrassed. My in-laws give me all kinds a grief about how DS8 is too dependent on us for some things. I think it is just part of his asynchronous development. If he is a teenager and I'm still doing things for him, then I will worry. But he is already focusing on how to learn to cook dinner and such for when he goes out on his own. For some things, he is more like a teenager than a small kid. And for other things, he is more like a four-year old.

I just have to remind myself of that some days, and let him be who he needs to be. That may be part of where any of his frustration and emotional meltdowns come from. He has one foot in the big-boy world and the other foot in the little-kid world. Sometimes, even he doesn't know know which world he belongs in. That would go with my theory of higher frequency of meltdowns after major developmental or physical growth. He keeps reaching for the stars and is so frustrated when he lands ungracefully here on Earth.

Absolutely.


Me too! I think a lot of us feel that way at times.





Well, independence can be fostered over time and you two have lots of it! You only get one set of teeth!

Our pediatric dentist actually told DH and I to brush the kids' teeth for them until they are 9. Apparently most kids don't have the fine motor skills to be able to do it correctly until then. So Ebeth, you were just following ADA guidelines!

Yeah, but one only lasts you through, what 9 or 10?