Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Learning Environments Montessori vs. Project Based vs. STEM vs...

We have just begun this journey, and these boards have been tremendously helpful so far. Our DD6 is not meeting her potential in her current environment, but we live in a district that offers school choice. I would be ever so grateful to bounce some ideas off of the more experienced parents here. Tons of info- sorry so long!

The Background: We have three programs to choose from for next year for our child. When you hear about the programs, everything sounds marvelous, but in reality, we are in an average performing district in one of the lowest performing states. So, take it all with a grain of salt. Our DD is currently in a K class with age peers, and the entire class is working ahead of grade. The top 10% of her entering class (based on K screenings) were put together in her class. DD is still working ahead of these students, up to 2 grades ahead. She is having problems at school refusing to do work, selecting the least amount of work possible, behavior regression, and just generally checking out. She tells me she is purposely working to match the other kids in her class. She is very well liked by the other students. We are frustrated (teacher too) that she isn't working anywhere near her potential. We are workind toward getting her a complete assessment by a psych that specializes in gifted. Shcool did a KBIT2, but scores didn't really match what we see. She fits the profile of someone who is mildly gifted. Personality wise, DD despises being told what to do/ how to do something with a high perfectionist streak. She seems to be happiest when she is leading a group, or working out of the traditional classroom model. So what type of environment is best for a kid like this?

Montessori? I think the multi-age classroom could be a huge benefit for a child who is trying to "match" their classmates. At least in the beginning, when they are working up. There may be benefit to modeling ideal performance for lower level students?? But how does this method work for kids who don't seem to have a lot of intrinsic motivation?

Project Based? One of the schools is offering a project based, leadership type program, where all of the curriculum is presented through pre-designed projects for the students to complete in teams. I liked all of this as a concept. But for my DD specifically, I am worried about moving her from an environment of higher performing students, to a mixed ability environment, simply because she already feels the need to "hide" her abilities.

STEM/Tech based? The last option we have available to us isn't a true STEM program, although I would love to hear anyone's thoughts about STEM. Instead, we will be offered something that is mostly tech based. 1 to 1 iPad ratio in the classroom (I am told they will actually be made to write with a pencil 1 day a week, so they sort of learn how to do it) and the curriculum is presented through coding, app development and playing minecraft, I guess. Very, very few details, so if anyone is doing anything like this already, please share your experiences! The only benefit I can see to this option for us personally is that DD will keep the same class of students from this year (high performing, lots of friends). The teacher, however, will be the one and the same who kicked her out after one day. Yes, that is a chip you see on my shoulder, although truthfully I hear she is tough, but very good.

Ds7 says stem first(I don't think it would be good for him though), Montessori second if he can work at his level in each subject (it wouldn't work when he was the oldest though), the existing set up third and anything involving mixed ability groups very much last.

I think the set up you have now sounds great but maybe a grade skip or SSA since the school seems to admit one size does not fit all.

Montessori has its advantages but in your shoes, I'd dig deep into the school's curriculum. Maria Montessori lived many decades ago and the world has changed a lot and we now know a lot more about how children's cognitive development than they did back then. Who exactly is in charge of the school's curriculum and how it is being developed? How can they meet the needs of a gifted learner?

I do like project-based learning in theory but in practice, it'd take an amazingly gifted teacher to make that work in a classroom with 20+ children. Your child would need an extraordinary amount of luck to have such a teacher year after year.

STEM school...I'm not so sure about that option. A lot depends on the school culture. One of the private schools we applied for DD is STEM heavy but by the end of the school tour, I started to wonder if it's better to send DD to all girls' school that has a STEM focus since I saw zero girls in their advanced STEM classes.

This won't be a true Montessori setting. It is a state school, so the curriculum is a mash-up between meeting the state standards by using some Montessori methods. So what they are really doing is picking and choosing. The students will also have break out tie for "specials" daily- PE, Technology, Music, Art, and possibly Dance but tht hasn't been decided yet. I had a chance to visit the classroom in an existing school where they have already implemented the program, and talk to the director. (The montesori we are looking at is going into a new school that is being built now- not sure if I mentioned that. So some of the faculty will be moving to the new school, and the director of the program is one of them. She would be DD teacher)
I asked her these same questions,and spoke with her about my concerns for DD. Each child sits down on Monday and is given a few items that they must work on for the week (different from traditional Montessori, but this is how they keep the kids on target with state standards.) The children must also choose items that they want to work on for the week, they can still only use materials they have been given a lesson on, etc. If a child chooses work they have already mastered, they will be directed to select something similar that they have not mastered yet. I think this could be good for DD, because at least she will have some control over what she works on, but there will be clear parameters. It will be a lot herder for her to pick the easiest thing available because she doesn't want to work. The lessons will begin at the level of the student, so for example, my DD can read, so they won't waste her time teaching her how to read "the montessori way". At least, this is what the teacher tells me. They will use adaptive testing at the beginning of the year to determine where the student is working. The only problem here is that the tests only go up through the next grade. They will brush her up on how to use the materials if needed for a new lesson, but they won't make her go back to the beginning. This is different from a Montessori Charter school that said they would make her start at the beginning, even though she is reading chapter books.
I asked about acceleration, and what happens if a grade 1 student burns through all of the grade 3 materials in a subject by mid year. She said they bring the higher level materials to the student from the upper classroom, not send the student to the higher class. Although, I think if I wanted to make a fuss over it, they would allow her to go to the other class instead, especially if she were ready for multiple pieces of "work". Not for the whole day, but likely for part of the day.
Miraculously they all seem to be very flexible. Her current school has been, my only complaint is that small problem when they sent her to the 1st grade class and the teacher refused to have her back because she wasn't working. (Hello? Did no one explain to you that this is a problem we are having with her, and sending her to you class is the solution? Also, I'm not a teacher, but I probably wouldn't have chosen the week of Christmas break to try something new. Just sayin')

You may have read this elsewhere on the forums...

Perfectionistic tendencies may be a sign of developing a fixed mindset rather than a growth mindset. One aspect or application is that gifted kids may stop taking appropriate risks in order to always be "right" or always be "smart" or never be "wrong", and this may work against them. The concept is nicely summarized in these youtube videos:
Ashley Merryman & Po Bronson: The Myth of Praise (link- )
Teaching a Growth Mindset (link- )

Parents may wish to read the book Mindset by Carol Dweck for tips on promoting a growth mindset.

A book which seems to understand perfectionism very well and which many find supportive is What To Do When Good Enough Isn't Good Enough. Another book you might like is Perfectionism: What's Bad About Being Too Good. While insightful, these are written gently for kids, in a style that is fun and engaging. With any of these books it may be wise for a parent to pre-read and decide if it seems to be a helpful tool to use in guiding their child.

Procrastination can be closely related to perfectionism.

A child considering "worst case scenario" and finding various work-arounds to keep moving forward may in some cases help reduce anxiety and add an element of self-confidence, even a sense of looking forward to taking on the challenge.

You may wish to read all you can about underachievement, and successful approaches to advocacy, to acquire foundational knowledge for negotiating with the school system throughout your child's educational journey.

If I could have found the right Montessori school for DD, I'd have chosen that for her when she was 3. Back then, she was very much a Montessori child. She no longer is though. She would not choose to do academic things if she can create social alternatives for herself. Maybe we pushed her too much into other directions but for social butterflies who are very clever and persistent about procrastination, I do wonder if behavior management could become an issue.

It's not that I don't think the Montessori school could work for your DD. We have a couple of Montessori options but we chose not to go Montessori mostly because SO isn't a big Montessori fan and we both think DD at this point in her life needs more structure if she's going to go to school full-time.

ETA: If we can find a school that blends the child-centered Montessori philosophy and projct-learning curriculum led by a teacher with strong and positive behavioral skills, that would be my first choice. Still waiting for such a school to magically open near us.

((Big sigh)) Well, I have now toured all of the available schools and spoken with the teachers. I have come to realize (at least in our situation, maybe not for everyone) that the individual teacher is as important, if not MORE important than the learning environment.
Today I had the chance to visit the classroom where DD would be placed next year if she stays in her current school. This would be an "advanced" 1st grade class, with a tech focus. 1 to 1 iPad ratio, some coding and animation design work fused with the regular state standards. Looks great when you are there. Kids all working quietly on high level stuff for their age. I spoke with the teacher about what she does with a child who may be hiding their abilities, or refusing to work. Whether that's because it's easier to refuse to work than try and make a mistake, or refusing because they think they have already mastered something, or just out of a need for control... Anyway, her opinion was clear, you do as you are told or you get out. While an authoritative style may be helpful for some students, I know for my very independent daughter it is a recipe for disaster. Teacher is talking to me about the grade levels the kids are performing at- which are truly impressive- but if you have to sacrifice a student's independent nature to get there, what is the point? My DD already reads well above grade level, but she is still not reaching her potential. Telling her she should read at a higher level "because I said so" is not the inspiration I was hoping for, and it's also laughable. As if she will miraculously decide to comply. Lets all hope our transfer request is granted!

I know that this is an older post. But I actually found this site through finding this thread searching Montessori and project based and stem...
Jodie, I would bet money that we are in the same school district after reading through your posts. I would love to hear an update, as we are at a crossroads and the school choice deadline is approaching. We are in the STEAM school boundaries for this district but my kids are in private school. I think my youngest would flourish in Montessori at RRA but you're probably aware that the school choice for that school EXCEPT for choosing Montessori is pretty much closed. We would move if I thought it was worth it.
Again, I would love an update. My oldest has been identified as gifted. He is very self-motivated but having been in traditional school longer than his younger brother I wonder if it is the right thing for him. The STEAM school is SO much bigger than their little school - I worry about that as compared to the Montessori - plus the Montessori they can stay there through middle and they have had plenty of school changes already. But there is no enrichment in their current school. Thank you.