Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Age or Ability Specific Forums Elementary School Does Dreambox Learning give accurate assessments?

How have the rest of you taught your young mathematicians to WRITE THINGS DOWN? DS wants to do everything in his head (and is pretty darn good at it), but then he'll make silly errors that he wouldn't have made if he wasn't trying to play "human calculator"?

So if you have a young kiddo, who ENJOYS math - what's the best way to branch out into more "paper math"? We briefly did SM (before DB), but it was slow going (I probably started at the wrong level, and I didn't feel confident enough to just SKIP chunks, because it is DIFFERENT than how I learned math) and I stopped so as to not kill DS's enthusiasm for learning. Dreambox got us moving again. But he needs to learn to write things down!

Would BA make more sense for a mom enriching at home who grew up with "old school" math? If so, how do you figure out what level/where to start? Or would you suggest supplementing with another program?

I am LOVING hearing what others have tried/what has worked - THANKS!

I have a couple of those, too. I didn't really stress making them show work until algebra, as long as the answers were right, but I did model for them, and also explain the value of communicating your thinking to other mathematicians. Math is a language, and it's good to be able to learn to read and write, as well as speak it. We've also talked about 1) the massive inconvenience of having to re-work an entire multi-step problem in order to find and correct an error, vs being able to check steps that you have already written down, and 2) real-life consequences that ensue from minor calculation errors that could have been prevented by the engineer/scientist/architect/etc. writing down calculations so that errors could more easily be caught. And, incidentally, that some day they may want the partial credit that classroom teachers will award only if they can see your work. One of mine has an interest in teaching, so there is special value in emphasizing the power of mathematical communication.

Some children find their hands to be too slow and awkward to keep up with their thought process, which is why my #2 prefers not to write things down, if it can possibly be avoided. When we did SM primary, I scribed almost everything, down to "four, carry the two", to separate fine motor development from mathematical development.

blackcat- I would describe Beast Academy as "nice to have" but it's not for everyone. In fact, some parents of gifted kids say that they don't like it at all. I always plug Singapore math only because it hits the sweet spot for my particular DS.
My thing with math (as a former math student with some serious math anxiety) is that both the hard skills and analysis should be present in elementary school math. I developed math anxiety from what I realize now was a "logic leap" into middle school algebra. If a program has both the calculation and applied problems *and* is challenging (the applied problems actually require some thinking) then it's probably a good curriculum. For me, that's Singapore math supplemented by ixl/Kumon.

The only way that I have ever found to get my DD to write more things down is to have her work on a tablet device, or to use dry-erase markers on a HUGE surface like a sliding glass door or large picture window.

That seems to have been very satisfying-- though I must say that my DH was often unimpressed that math was all over our living room picture window while I allowed dd to stand on the sofa to reach higher. LOL!

Our method was much like aeh's-- I modeled and scribed, and did "I'll do a step, then you" with her. It just depends on the kid, I think, but for DD, the social component was the reward for doing things this way.

Ha! I am definitely going to let ds write on the picture window with my dry erase markers! And yes,he will also be standing onthe couch. Fun!

That's a much better price! I'll maybe buy one book and see if he likes it.

Loy, we have the SAME problem with DS. When he did the WJ math section he refused to write ANYTHING down except for the fluency section where he had to write his answer. He would rather do long division in his head than write down the problem. And of course this leads to silly errors. Kids this age don't have good enough working memories to do multi-step problems in their head and not make mistakes.
DS's last teacher basically MADE him write things down. If he did it without being reminded, she gave him a WOW and starbursts. He has problems lining numbers up, so she gave him graph paper with large squares, and sent it home with his homework as well. The funny thing is, is that Dreambox seems to actually encourage them to do it in their heads. DS did units on "addition and subtraction strategies" which actually discouraged the use of the "regular algorithm." Since he is dyspraxic, that makes everything worse in terms of writing. It's really hard for him physically.

I wanted to re-visit this as my son has gotten further along in Dreambox and I'm starting to wonder exactly how much I should be adding to it. (We homeschool.)

He's just about "finished first grade" according to the parent dashboard. A lot of it, I can see that he gets the concept, but could probably use more practice. These areas are getting marked off as "100% completed". With each game, the number has only gone up to maybe 6. (where each number is a little harder) He's rarely had to repeat a section. Do you think that kids who don't "get" it repeat each level more? Do their numbers go up higher than 6, showing they've done a lot more repetition?

For example, when it comes to using the math racks and making equal equations where you show that 7+8=10+5, my son was able to do it, but I'm not sure that he was full grasping that you're manipulating the math racks (adding 3 to the top bar and simultaneously taking 3 off the bottom one to get 10 and 5). Instead, he was adding 7+8, then building 15. Does that make sense? His method works in the cases where he'd memorized the math facts, but not when he didn't already know the answer. It's clear that he needs more practice doing that, but it's now marked as "completed".

A lot of math is putting stakes in the ground. Since DreamBox is an adaptive learning system, the reasonable expectation is that a key piece missed will be detected down the line. If a student errors on a few problems that are rooted in this math racks concept, then the program should roll back into a remediation mode on that topic. I'm not specifically familiar with DreamBox, but know a bit about the design of adaptive learning systems.

One of my frustrations with it was that if they pass a unit, it might (or might not) stay there for further practice, but after a few days it is gone for good and you can't go back. I don't know why they can't have a list of topics completed and you can click on it to do it again later. But they don't, as far as I can tell. Which reminds me, I think that I'm going to cancel our subscription and maybe pick it up again next summer. It seems like it's good for the lower grades (maybe up through 5th or 6th grade material)...after that it kind of fizzles, I think, getting more bizarre in terms of how the concepts are taught. For certain topics, you really need more than pictures in order to understand. It might be good for reviewing concepts, but then the lessons drag on forever--much longer than what would be needed.

I agree that it is probably better for the younger set/lower grades (I thought DD was too old for it last year at age 8), but it was a nice start for DS at age 5. We also use it as summer/after-school enrichment, though. Right now, DS still likes it and has been pretty busy with the start of school (and has less time for extra-curricular math). I am thinking we might not need it anymore by the time we are up for renewal and we might try Beast Academy or something different. DD9 has a subscription to EPGY right now (and we'll have access to algebra for a bit longer, which is no longer included under the new plans), but I am not sure about the changes they have been making lately...we might be ready to move onto something different when our subscriptions are up.