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    In our case, I think our oldest would have loved to have -more- siblings (more rugrats to boss around, yk?)! Actually, quite seriously, #1 attracts children of all ages, but younger ones swarm. If we spend any significant amount of time in a place with some young children in it, an entourage will collect around #1. I think that affinity would have been well-met with a few additional younger siblings.

    There is also value in contemplating the difference between giving your kids the same attention, and attention of equivalent value. We try to give our kids what they -need-, which isn't necessarily the same for each child, because, hey, they're different people. And we've also tried to instill in them a value of kindness and compassion that starts from our family, and extends to the family of humanity. Where kindness does what is in the best interest of the recipient, and not just what the giver perceives as being nice, so that it is entirely individualized, begins from principle and not simply pleasing, and also respects the agency of the one served. We don't want those who need more of something to feel defective, helpless, or entitled, nor those who need less of it to feel neglected or superior.

    These compromises, balancing acts, or, as I prefer to view them, complementary relationships, are key to a civil, compassionate society. Sibling relationships, and the parent-child dynamics of a multi-child family, are a terrific sheltered, facilitated workshop in which to learn how to develop them.

    Sorry, I seem to have wandered a little off-topic. And, of course, onlies can find relational networks in which to learn these skills as well. Mainly, I mean to say that this view of family has made it--I won't say not a sacrifice to parent multiple children, but--of much higher value to do so than anything we may have given up.


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    Originally Posted by apm221
    We spend a lot of effort trying to help the kids learn to be kind and encouraging them to work together. We do a lot of things together as a family and encourage shared interests; my family comes with me on most business trips even though it would be far easier to go by myself (it gives the kids many opportunities to travel). Both kids are very empathetic in general. I can give you a long list of examples of considerate things they have done. For whatever reason, though, they just have trouble being friends. I don't think the fact that kids are not friends means their parents didn't teach them to be friends; some kids just have very different personalities and that can be challenging with two intense kids.

    I'm sure parents can increase the chances that kids will be friends versus resenting each other and feeling unfairness, but they can't guarantee it.

    Every one of us is a work in progress...and that they show compassion, and can be friends with other people, means they've absorbed the principles you've taught them. It's so much harder to be gentle and considerate with those closest to you...


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    I think being very empathetic and intense can even make it difficult to be as kind to siblings as one would like. My daughter gets so tense after school (from being a perfectionist all day) that I think she feels like she can relax with her brother and take out her frustrations with someone who will put up with it. She knows intellectually that it's wrong and we have tried a wide range of coping techniques, but it's very difficult when she has had a stressful day (and something we work on every day).

    I think I did something similar to my parents as I didn't have siblings; it can't have been fun for them.

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    Originally Posted by aeh
    In our case, I think our oldest would have loved to have -more- siblings (more rugrats to boss around, yk?)! Actually, quite seriously, #1 attracts children of all ages, but younger ones swarm. If we spend any significant amount of time in a place with some young children in it, an entourage will collect around #1. I think that affinity would have been well-met with a few additional younger siblings.

    There is also value in contemplating the difference between giving your kids the same attention, and attention of equivalent value. We try to give our kids what they -need-, which isn't necessarily the same for each child, because, hey, they're different people. And we've also tried to instill in them a value of kindness and compassion that starts from our family, and extends to the family of humanity. Where kindness does what is in the best interest of the recipient, and not just what the giver perceives as being nice, so that it is entirely individualized, begins from principle and not simply pleasing, and also respects the agency of the one served. We don't want those who need more of something to feel defective, helpless, or entitled, nor those who need less of it to feel neglected or superior.

    These compromises, balancing acts, or, as I prefer to view them, complementary relationships, are key to a civil, compassionate society. Sibling relationships, and the parent-child dynamics of a multi-child family, are a terrific sheltered, facilitated workshop in which to learn how to develop them.

    Sorry, I seem to have wandered a little off-topic. And, of course, onlies can find relational networks in which to learn these skills as well. Mainly, I mean to say that this view of family has made it--I won't say not a sacrifice to parent multiple children, but--of much higher value to do so than anything we may have given up.

    Not at all off-topic. Perspective taking from the point of view of the multi-gifted child family is the central focus of the thread. I value your points that you've shared. Fundamentally, the family is like a lab school for the wider world in almost every way.


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    Not really at all. My older DD is not my gifted child, she had MANY health issues as a baby/toddler. I had reasons I waited and had my DS 4 1/2 years later. To be honest my non-gifted child was a lot more difficult to handle those first few years.

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    I noticed this thread last night and didn't have time to get caught up before I posted. Many more posts tonight! smile

    For us, giftedness did not impact our plans, although it certainly has changed our experience, just as other special needs of friends' children has changed theirs. I was in my mid-30s when we married, so our plan was to get started quickly and have several, which we did.

    We had our three within 3.5 years... and it was exhausting, all-consuming. I am a baby-wearing, nursing, very intentional parent and I have often marveled at how those first five years of parenting took everything I had. (Having said that, as others have noted, it did become remarkably easier once they hit certain milestones, such as sleeping through the night... dressing themselves... and when they were all potty-trained, what bliss!)

    We had no family nearby, but you find a way. They are all incessant talkers -- which DH would say is because of the steady stream of conversation I kept up before they could talk. smile because of this, I used to have our oldest call my parents when I needed a moment. At 18 mos, he could happily talk to my mom non-stop for 45 min or so, which thrilled her and which gave me quite the mental break! Since I had him dial, he memorized the number without me realizing it and then he called her early one morning before I woke up and talked with her for an hour before waking me up. (I then realized I couldn't let him dial any other numbers lest he dial those homes at 5 a.m.!) It has been 6 years since this started and I still have them call my parents when I need a quiet moment!

    And, by the time our third was born, our oldest could sit near me when I nursed and read to our middle child... and there were many other unexpected helps. (I sent our oldest to a wonderful play-based preschool, because I knew he needed that time with bigger kids and I had my hands full... and I kept the second one home, because with her sensory issues, she needed that and my hands were not nearly as full. And I had an amazing offer to work in my field 10 hours/wk and bring each of the babies with me for their first 9 mos, so I had a bit of a break, meaningful work and time with each of them with me in a sling, which helped me refuel.)

    I know yours would not be nearly as close as ours, but I thought I'd post just to share our experience, which -- though not without its share of chaos -- has been such a delightful one. I have learned in a deeper way to trust that "all will be well." There have been many challenges we never anticipated, but so many unexpected blessings from our trio, too. Whatever you decide, trust that it is what is right for you.

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    Originally Posted by apm221
    I think being very empathetic and intense can even make it difficult to be as kind to siblings as one would like.She knows intellectually that it's wrong and we have tried a wide range of coping techniques, but it's very difficult when she has had a stressful day (and something we work on every day).

    I just wanted to clarify that I didn't mean to imply in my previous post that if parents just told their kids to be friends all would be well, or that kids' "niceness" depended solely on parenting. Firstly, my perspective is from the parent of (at least several) grown children, so obviously, life has gotten much easier! Just like in pregnancy, one forgets (thank goodness!) some of the really tough times. But, I would also encourage all parents of intense, prickly, hard-to-be-friends-with-at-times gifties that it DOES get better. I think all the parenting pays off eventually, but believe me, our oldest dd also could be very challenging for both us and her siblings when she was younger. Just like your dd, my oldest knew intellectually how to treat people, but was often overwhelmed by her emotions (and often felt terribly guilty afterwards when she didn't act they way she knew she should). However, it got easier and easier every year and as a 20-something, she is a lovely, empathetic, and emotionally in-tune woman. After reading some of the comments, I was afraid that I gave the mistaken impression that my children were best friends from day one who never had a moment's disagreement. I'm not THAT delusional, even if each of the four kids has killed a few brain cells. smile

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    Fascinating discussion (that I missed while on vacation).

    Giftedness didn't factor into family planning. We wanted two or three children close in age. We were lucky, and we have DS6, DD4, and DS3.

    My eldest, our DYS, has been challenging in virtually all areas since he arrived (actually, before he arrived). I had a traumatic delivery as well... several life threatening events all at once.

    I was afraid to get pregnant again and go through it all again, but I wanted more than one and I wanted them close so we went for it. Nineteen months later, DD was born. Her delivery was a dream. She slept through the night her first night on the planet. She is calm and sweet and easy going. Like someone said earlier, I don't know if she is pg or not but she's definitely bright and her EQ is worlds above most adults I know.

    Then we had my youngest 22 months later. He's the most charismatic and easy going child.

    Yes, I am just now feeling like things are getting easier. I'm coming up for air, but I'm happy with our choice. We have three smart, interesting, and entertaining little people. They have a blast together and their conversations are incredible.

    My eldest remains a challenge, but he would have been a challenge without his siblings. At least now he has companions who are likely gifted as well.

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    Originally Posted by aquinas
    Originally Posted by Dude
    Originally Posted by Bostonian
    To raise to 50% the chance that each child will have a sister (or in other words, to have two daughters), you need to have three children smile.

    Every time a parent tells me they're going to have another child because they always wanted to have a [gender], I always get this image of them standing at a craps table, shaking the dice fiercely, and saying, "Come on, [gender]." Usually, followed by, "Doh!"

    To extend that further, I have no preference. We didn't find out DS' gender until he was born because we wanted to bond with our baby as a human, not as a gendered individual.

    It drove people crazy when they asked, "What are you having?" and I replied, "A baby." wink

    I never found out what we were having while pregnant with all 3 of mine. And if I am lucky enough to have another, we won't find out with that one either. People would always ask us the same question, "Do you know what you are having?" And we'd always reply, "Yes! We know 100%, it's either a boy or girl!" :-)

    Last edited by somewhereonearth; 09/17/14 04:46 PM.
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    This question made me laugh! Our children are somewhat widely spaced due to how exhausting child #1 was. Also, we're not having any more, but that's also a function of house size and financial carrying capacity. My two kids are SO different in personality that I do sometimes feel a twinge of sadness that there won't be a third, just to see what the mix would be.

    I do sometimes wish I'd had them closer (they are 4ish years apart) but given how things were, it's okay. They act closer in age than they are, with my oldest acting young for age (emotionally) and my youngest acting old for age. I think this often happens.

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