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thanks Blackcat

LouDD, the WJ-III Cognitive Abilities is an a-ok test! I asked because I think you'll find that in the US and on these forums in particular, most of our kids are more typically given the WISC, so a lot of the posts on dysgraphia and slow processing speed are referencing the processing speed subtests on the WISC. My dysgraphic ds has had both the WISC and the WJ-III Cog, and jmo I found both useful, but the WJ-III perhaps had more info in it than the WISC - yet it's been easier to find info on the WISC online.

Do you have a description of the subtests so that you understand the tasks on each? If not, if you want to post which subtest was low I can look it up for you. I think the subtest that was low for my ds was visual-auditory matching (or something like that - I don't have it in front of me at the moment). His discrepancy between that subtest and his highest scoring subtest was over 100 points on the WJ-III; on the WISC the discrepancy between high scores and processing speed scores was less (I think around 50 points but don't remember for sure). His neuropsych strongly recommended that he should never depend on handwriting to show his knowledge, and as he's growing up he's definitely agreeing with his neuropsych lol.

Was the low score on "instruction following" also on the WJ-III? I wouldn't expect dysgraphia to impact how a person takes in information. I'm curious if the instruction following subtest involved an oral question or did your ds have to read the question? And how did he have to respond - if it was a handwritten answer, and particularly if it was a timed subtest, in that case dysgraphia *could* impact the subtest score - which doesn't necessarily correlate at all with whether or not he can follow instructions. Does that make sense? That's why it's so important to look at exactly how each subtest is administered, how a child is expected to reply, and is the subtest timed.

Also curious what test they gave that assessed handwriting at 2nd percentile? Was that also WJ-III? or something else?

FWIW, I don't think there's any reason to bother with a WISC - you have all the same info in the WJ-III, just wrapped up in slightly different packages. Was the WJ-III Achievement Test battery given at the same time? That can be helpful in showing the impact of dysgraphia (and help with diagnosis of whether or not it's dysgraphia impacting a processing speed score).

Did your Ed Psych mention who *can* give a diagnosis of dysgraphia in NZ? And did she mention anything about handwriting in her report? FWIW, this may not make sense, but diagnosing can be confusing. My dysgraphic/dyspraxic ds was not diagnosed with either dysgraphia or dyspraxia in his neuropsych eval - he was diagnosed with Disorder of Written Expression and Developmental Coordination Disorder - those are diagnoses in the DSM-IV which is the standard diagnostic manual used by psychologists working in the US (I don't know if it's used in other countries). I never heard the word "dysgraphia" until after ds' diagnosis when I was trying to research accommodations online and the word kept popping up. I went back to ds' neuropsych and asked if ds was dysgraphic and her reply was "Well, yes, he's obviously dysgraphic." But she put DOWE in his report because that's how her profession categorizes dysgraphic challenges, and in her words, it's also the terminology recognized by our schools. Later on when we sought out speech therapy for ds and written expression, his slp gave him a diagnosis of dysgraphia - using the actual word "dysgraphia". I know some folks here in the US have their children diagnosed by OTs.... but when our ds went through OT he had to already have a diagnosis, or we couldn't get an appointment... hence they used his DOWE diagnosis. So I wonder - perhaps your tester can't diagnose dysgraphia, but maybe you've got the info you need already to determine whether or not your ds needs handwriting remediation or accommodation?

polarbear

ps - also just curious again about the handwriting test and what was being tested where your ds fell into the 2nd percentile - I'm asking because there are so many different ways in which handwriting can be impacted.... no time to explain at the moment, I'll be back. Just curious which specific set of skills were assessed

pbear

I think I was one of these kids; and I know my ds13 tested like that high in some areas, visual spatial (and spelling?) anyway, very low processing speed.
I was and am very slow at math computation but do great with concepts and logic. I see this same pattern with my son - math fact sheet? no thank you, we did those for a few years and finally just told the school NO. (Now we homeschool altogether so that is nice).

I think of it this way, but don't know if the physiology/growth of the brain really goes like this:
like a database being built on the fly, you might build a few of the main tables and start collecting data.
over the years (by age 6, 7, 10?)
you've built up BILLIONS of rows of records, and many more
tables.
Naturally, data is sluggish to return when queries are run,
however:
The dba (the brain) will figure out what items are to be
returned quickly, where to create short cut/reference tables
and indexing, etc.
Eventually the paths/data you love to access comes to you EXTREMELY quickly, optimized as it were, but still you might be a bit sluggish on the stuff you *know you need* but don't prefer...

this process takes time (years).

You've described my ds12. Never liked math worksheets or being made to do minute maths...yet can understand concepts quickly.

I love your analogy; it really helps me to understand my own ds.

You've had lots of good feedback. I'll just add that our ds12 took the WISC IV last year and had a large spread between his VCI and his processing speed index. Part of the issue for ds isn't that his processing speed is that low, because it's in the average range, but that his VCI is so high. Ds's tester attributed this slowness to perfectionism. Personally, I think there's more to it than that. He's a slow and careful thinker...but very deep. We have not done further testing. We're leaving that particular door open though we do wonder if the school would view asking for extra time for work and tests would seem preposterous since he holds his own academically even after a grade skip.