Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Twice Exceptional School services for Dysgraphia?

[quote=blackcat] I'm not sure if they need to fill in a bubble sheet, or write things down on scratch paper or anything, but if there is any chance he will be at a disadvantage due to not being able to write (or slow), I don't want him given the test. /quote]

Since these are concerns, I think it's really important that you get accommodations for them written into his IEP now - these are concerns that don't only impact whether or not he takes the CogAT - they are going to come up again and again with testing both in the classroom and on state/etc testing and eventually college board exams.

pb

Thanks polarbear. I'm not sure why the school psych seems so insistent on not giving her the WISC but I assume it's because of time or funding. Since she's so against it, I'm not sure I trust her to even give the test in an appropriate way if she finally agrees to it.

DS has never had any sort of cognitive testing with the school. Just speech assessments (articulation) and very brief fine and gross motor evaluations.

Here are his WISC scores if anyone can make sense of them or what they mean in terms of being 2e:
Block Design 13
Similarities 12
Digit Span 10
Picture Concepts 19
Coding 10
Vocabulary 13
Letter Number Seq 14
Matrix Reasoning 18
Comprehension 13
Symbol Search 13

DS was very squirrely during the testing according to the report, and there are concerns about ADHD. I noticed when he did a perceptual vision test with the OT (which I was allowed to watch), he was at times impulsive with his answers and kept changing his mind after she had recorded his answers. Since he has always had speech output issues (similar to apraxia) I'm not sure if the verbal subtests are valid, reliable scores of his verbal ability or not. His verbal comprehension score is only 114, while Perceptual Reaonsing is 141. That's a huge gap. I'm not sure if I should bring up this issue with the school or demand any other testing because of this gap. His working memory is 110, and processing speech is 109--so all the scores are in the average range except for Perceptual Reasoning at 99.7 percentile and neuropsych said that's an underestimate because of block design, which involves fine motor. He noted in the report that there are large discrepancies between scores. Full scale IQ is 126 and GAI is 133.

Is block design a test of visual spatial ability? Because when the OT did visual testing, he scored above the 99th percentile for visual spatial ability and visual memory. For that test, there were no little blocks to manipulate, he was just looking at a book.

The school pretty much dismissed the IQ testing and the entire neuropsych report. They do admit that he is 2e, and are now looking at the recommendations because of the special ed director getting involved. But at ths point they are totally focusing on the disability and not the giftedness. DS's teacher finally said she would give him third grade level math instead of first grade, but I'm not sure how that's going to work. Is she planning on teaching the math or just giving it to him? I'm also very worried about the writing that will be involved.

Blackcat, I apologize - I misread (misunderstood) your note about the discrepancy between subtests, plus... I hadn't had my morning caffeine yet when I answered! 3 pts = 1 SD on a subtest... I was thinking VCI vs PRI vs PSI cum scores, not subtest scores when I made my totally incorrect remark!

9 point differences on subtests are significant. Absolutely And the difference between his VCI and PRI is really large. I am guessing that, like many of us 2e parents, what you are embarking on is a journey that isn't going to be magically resolved or understood overnight (as you have already found out!). It usually means simply moving forward, making the best decisions you can with the data you have, advocating, seeing how it all works out, then tweaking and advocating all over again.


(VCI vs PRI)

If you are seeing impacts at school or at home in homework etc that may potentially relate to the gap in PRI vs VCI, then yes, bring it up as a concern - but don't just mention the IQ, bring up the concern via the academic examples and then have the IQ scores as the backup for your concern.


Our school also did their best to dismiss the neuropsych report, and there are a ton of different reasons school staff might appear to be dismissive of outside testing -from not wanting or being able to provide needed services to needing to validate what they do provide within the school to egos to not understanding to simply not wanting to bother to read it. And lots more. Not one of those reasons means that it's not a valid data point and it isn't a reason to not keep mentioning it whenever you find it's a good backup for what you are advocating for at school.


While this may not sound encouraging, this has been the experience of many of us here with our 2e kids - and even though it's not what we see as ideal, it can work out ok. The reality is often that our kids *do* need to focus more time and energy on remediation, learning how to use accommodations, getting used to being comfy in their own skin, during those first years of elementary school. It's tough to race ahead in math or whatever when you can't easily use handwriting to show what you know (this is just one example grabbed out of the air, that impacted my ds in a huge way those first years of school). Try to focus on knowing that all the hard work you put in now advocating for accommodations etc and all the hard work your ds is putting in now just going to school and getting by and learning how to use his accommodations, going through OT/PT etc - that hard work *is* going to pay off in a large way once he's further along in school and able to more easily show/share his knowledge. Our ds really didn't get any type of true differentiation until he was in middle school, but the flip side of that is - if our primary focus during elementary school hadn't been on understanding his disability and how to accommodate for it he would not have had access to accelerated courses in middle school, and if he'd been allowed in, he most likely would have fallen hard and quick due to lack of being able to keep up with *output* (not lack of ability to comprehend). So yeah, it was beyond frustrating and yes, we after-schooled a bit, but it is what it is. It sounds like you are way ahead of us in success with at least getting your ds' school to acknowledge he needs differentiation, so keep at it!

Best wishes,

polarbear

Good points. As long as he is not complaining about school, I'm not too worried about it. He's just happy to be there with his friends and is willing to put up with some nonsense. For the last month of school he has been bringing home 2+2 homework for math--number partners up to 6. It has been painful to see when he already knows all the multiplication and division facts and can add and subtract negative numbers, understands fractions/decimals, etc. I am opposed to subject acceleration in math (as in, actually moving him to a different grade for math), because of my worry about the writing and that there just won't be enough time for math after being pulled for speech, OT, Adapted PE, etc (assuming he gets OT and physical therapy). So I just want the teacher to differentiate the best she can, working around the handwriting issues. I told her I want him to work to his ability level in all areas and not be held back in certain subjects just because he has a disability. I suggested iXL on the computer in the classroom to do while the other kids are listening to the boring number partner lectures, and gave her his password but so far he has not been on there. We'll see what she comes up with in terms of math and what he brings home. If it seems too difficult for him, I'll ask her to give him less or a lower level.
The neuropsych did write in his report that DS's perceptual reasoning is so advanced that he processes information differently than other people and is at risk for not doing well in a traditional school setting. Gifted services should be considered. I'm not even sure what he means by that (how he processes information differently? Is this like saying he is a divergent thinker? Visual thinker?). But he has a point on not just neglecting that side of him and I'm glad he put it in the report so I don't look like a crazy pushy tiger mom.