Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy what to ask for in K next year

I was discussing DS5 with my mom and she asked me what I wanted the teacher to do with him next year in K. I am a realist and I don't expect a lot of teacher time devoted to his very asynchronous needs. I just want him not to have to sit through letter of the week, the fat cat sat on the mat, and how to count 10 beans. The teacher will be dealing with a very wide range of abilities. They talk a big game re differentiation. However, he is reading Narnia, the Moomin series, etc on his own for an hour+ at a time.

So what am I really asking for here?

1. I'm thinking that I would like him to be able to opt out of phonics lessons and read solo. Maybe write a few little very simple book reports? Take those AR quizzes on the computer if the school has access? (I don't know if they do. DD has never done this and she attends the same school.)

2. Math...he doesn't really know money and time. He is solid on facts to 20 (addition/subtraction) and also knows a lot of his times tables and division. He can add two-digit numbers in his head. His sister taught him simple adding and subtracting with carrying at some point, but I have not reinforced this and he's likely forgotten it. He can count by 2s, 3s, 4s, 10s, whatevers, about as high as you'd like him to. He understands very high place value due to obsessive reading of high-level ocean nonfiction. I find that it is very hard to find math workbooks that work for him, but something late 1st/early 2nd is sort of right (but at the same time too slow and repetitive). So should I ask for worksheets like this? Computerized work? What sites? They may not have computers in the K classroom itself. They do have a school lab. Has anyone sent in an Ipad or something? That's nuts, I guess.

3. Writing at K/1 level is fine.

HE IS VERY FRUSTRATED with preschool and complains daily about not learning anything, not being taught anything, it being too easy, etc. I am extremely concerned about him escalating to outright school refusal. If I have to, I will pull him out next year, but this might jeopardize his chances of getting into the GT magnet--starts in 2nd grade--which is pretty much our only lifeline.

So I need a plan. I want to make it easy for the school. I am not very good at getting what I want from authority. It would be better if I came with stuff on offer and concrete ideas. What we have going for us here is 1) his older sister is at the magnet at the same school and is a high achiever there and 2) DS is not at all shy with his abilities and is likely to be very obvious.

ETA: I have considered having him tested just to see if there is a chance he is DYS level and they could help us. His sister scored significantly below that standard, although I am not positive her score is accurate (even if not, though, I do not think she is DYS). He appears somewhat more gifted but it's awfully hard for me to say. Would DYS be of enough help in this situation for it to be worth the considerable expense? The schools will test him at the end of K.

Right--there really is no realistic way to appropriately acclerate in reading that I can even think of. He needs no reading instruction at all. He could use spelling and writing instruction, though, certainly.

The good news/bad news in our case is that DS is very well-behaved, although prone to crying in frustration at times. His preschool teachers were surprised to learn that I have to work really hard to get him to school every day. But I am concerned about his psychological well-being if he faces another two years of this level of frustration.

There is a very decent chance that there will be 2-3 other gifted kids in DS's class (other sibs of kids in the magnet). So there's that.

Moomin, is your DD DYS?

It seems you both describe the second phase of the conversation and are into the business of the teacher who hasn't yet failed to achieve the first set of expectations which to me are:
* My kid loves to learn and is excited to go somewhere that he can learn all day long, please don't disappoint him.
* Like most kids, my kid seems to learn best and is very happy at the level where he is comfortably challenged.
* Though my kid can learn a lot by himself, he thrives even more with some instruction at his optimal learning level.

Skipping down to the end of your post. Yes, I do believe DYS would be beneficial in your case. I would be more inclined to test your DS to see if he qualifies in your situation because I think what you are asking for is a lot for a public school. Because he needs a lot. You would basically need a lot of individualized instruction. It is likely that the teachers and administrators are not going to be quick to offer a free private tutor to your DS. And, they may argue that that is what you are asking for when the kindergarten teacher needs to take time from the class to help your DS on his computer or book report or whatever. They may also argue that he needs to be instructed with the class for non-academic reasons. You just never know. You may need to bring in the big guns.

Maybe I have heard too many horror stories here.

It just depends on the K class. How many kids? How many teachers? Is there a reading specialist? How much focus on reading and math? How long is the day? Is there a lot of free play time? recess? art and other specials?

I think I have already told you what we are expecting from K. We specifically sought out a school that was not explicitly teaching reading in kindergarten (truthfully, because most kids are coming in reading or will learn on their own), offered a lot of differentiation, and appeared really fun. We passed on the more academic private school because I did not want to have to battle the school on what the proper academic level was for DD. I am hoping to put that off for a few more years at current school. The school gets quite academic by middle school, and the students are quite high achieving.

Maybe summer will help him de-school a bit. What will he be doing this summer? If he was a happy guy, then I would not worry.

To be clear, I'm not going to go in right away with this. We'll see how it goes for a while. But I'm not going to make the same mistakes I did with DD. "Oh...we're only 4 weeks in...oh...we're only 6 weeks in...oh...well...they're busy with the holidays...well..."

Class size is below 20. Many kids will be at a very basic level, though--learning letters. It is a weird demographic mix. They do have a reading specialist, but she is paid for with Title 1 funds. There is recess and specials but not a lot of free play time, I suspect. Due to it being a Title 1 school and the demographics, a lot of time will be spent trying to get kids up to state standard.

I am totally NOT expecting a free private tutor!! I just want some ideas for things he can do while other kids are doing stuff he really, really, really knows how to do so that he does not comletely lose his marbles. He is highly self-directed and has a beautiful attention span. He can easily sit by himself and read or work on something alone. I will take that. I want to make it easier for them by having some ideas of what to suggest.

I'm sure their are others that can offer more advice. I will offer the advice of NOT doing what I did- which was rely on the school to recognize ds abilities and challenge him, even when I spoke to the teacher, things didn't get better. However, will black and white numbers, the principal is fully onboard with being helpful. I don't think the principal would have heard me otherwise. (Btw, I had emailed the principal before school had started, but I think she only saw thatds would act out if not stimulated.

I do know every situation is different. If you get a good teacher, it could be fine. It could be ok with new environment and learning social stuff.

For my ds, the teacher continually tried to make him fit into a kindergarten mold and didn't like his personality. It was a bad situation. Ds has definitely suffered emotionally because of it.

This may not help much, but that's our story (thus far). Good luck!

I understand. I am just playing devil's advocate. A teacher or an administer might view this as a lot of work and as a detriment to the class as a whole. But, if your DS needs this to keep happy, than it is so important, and worth fighting for. DYS would help I'd think.

Yes, and follow this up with specifics re: quirks and hints about level re: things that your child IS currently doing, or fairly recent/germane anecdotes that demonstrate the speed at which he learns.

Those things were key for getting DD's first teacher to understand that when we said she wasn't like most kids-- we meant, no, REALLY, she isn't like other students.

It's a good way to forge a partnership.

Second thought-- is it possible to "homeschool" Kindy/first in a combined year?

If that is a possibility, I'd strongly encourage you to think about it before registering him-- the reason is that this locks him into a cohort year, and you're right-- at that point, this becomes a two-year slog until the gifted school possibility opens up. If you can find out what the policy is re: admission of homeschooled children, I'd do that.

Moomin's observations are exactly what we also observed-- and learned from my mother, who also had decades of classroom experience.

I can't/won't homeschool unless I really have no alternative. Work and finances make it highly undesirable (I would have to quit a job I really love).

So far, we have had no issues with our kids going unrecognized in any school environment (though math skills have been a bit less recognized). I let them speak for themselves at the start and they have always "outed" themselves rapidly. (Both DD and DS are very outgoing, hand-raising types; they are also fact-memorizing types so they tend to spout a lot of information.) So that part isn't a concern for me, although it's possible that a very stretched or unobservant teacher could miss some of his abilities. I'm more worried that he will "seem fine," because he's sweet-natured and a pleaser. To be 100% clear, I don't actually care if he learns anything in K. (Well, better penmanship would be nice and completely on-target in terms of what I woudl expect.) I just don't want him to be miserable.