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    Joined: Apr 2013
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    Abigail Offline OP
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    Hello. I had my son, who is 9 and in the 4th grade, tested recently and just got his test scores back and I'm just wondering what people who have gone through this before would recommend. I thought having him tested would give me answers but really it just created more questions. He took the WISC-IV. Here are his scores:

    Verbal Comprehension 150
    Perceptual Reasoning 127
    Working Memory 110
    Processing Speed 106
    Full Scale IQ 133

    I don't know exactly where this puts him in the scope of being gifted, but I know he needs more than his normal class room can offer him. I gave the report to his teachers and to the director of the highly capable program for the school district. I also sent it to the principal of a local private school for gifted children. He is really happy at his current school though and I know any change will upset him, I just don't know what would be best for him.

    I also read the article someone else had posted about slow processing speed and the gap between his verbal comprehension and processing speed has me concerned. Does anyone here have any experience with that or any other information on it?

    Any advice or input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

    ~Abigail

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    Welcome! That is a very high VCI. I would be curious to know if extended norms might be relevant here, and I would also ask about having a GAI calculated. As for the lower processing speed, my daughter has a similar discrepancy.

    You mention he is very happy at school. What are you seeing that makes you think his current school isn't an appropriate fit?

    By the way, his VCI qualifies for DYS. You could apply with qualifying achievement scores or a portfolio.

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    My daughter's processing speed was a lot lower than her VCI (148) and her PRI (153) but her tester told me it is common and she believes it was due to perfectionism. So I am not to worried. I would asked to have the GAI calculated. GAI uses VCI and PRI and takes out working memory and processing speed because I believe VCI and PRI are better indicators of giftedness. DD's GAI is a 160 but her FSIQ is only a 144 since it is brought down by the processing speed and working memory scores.


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    Abigail Offline OP
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    Thanks for the replies! His doctor and the psychologist who did the test said the the processing speed could be an indicator of ADD/ADHD. What would the benefits be of having his GAI calculated?

    His current school is not meeting his needs... his reading and math level are wayyy beyond that of his peers and he is already in the highest level groups.

    I'm also having a hard time getting the people in the highly capable program to consider him because his cogat scores do not meet the cut off. It's very frustrating.

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    The GAI will gave a better understanding of his abilities, where the FSIQ can be pulled down by the lower processing speed or working memory. This link shows how to calculate the GAI from his subtest scores.

    http://www.pearsonassessments.com/N...DA-05888C7CC082/0/80720_WISCIV_Hr_r4.pdf

    Also, check this link for a good explanation as to why the GAI is a better measurement for gifted kids: http://www.nagc.org/index.aspx?id=2455

    I'm curious - do you mind sharing his CogAT scores? I am having the same problems with access to HC for my dd9. I have heard anecdotal evidence that the CogAT can be an unreliable test, but I am still looking for hard evidence!

    -Tricia

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    I have discovered that large variations in the scores can indicate 2E issues. My son has scattered WISC scores and we finally figured out that he has visual processing problems. That was why his processing speed was so off his other scores. It might be worth looking into ADHD or other things like learning disabilities, etc.


    Mom to 2 kiddos - DS 9 with SPD and visual processing issues and DD 6 who is NT
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    Abigail Offline OP
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    I do not have his cogat scores for this year, yet. When I get them I will share them with you, but I do know that in 2nd grade his cogat score was in the 83rd percentile and he needed to be in the 85th percentile to be considered for the highly capable program in our district.

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    Do you have the subtest scores? I am curious if there is scatter, particularly if there is one subtest under PRI that brought that score down - reason being it's a test that relies heavily on vision, which processing speed subtests also rely on. If you saw relatively low scores on all three of those subtests, you might want to look into possible vision issues.

    I would also *love* to have whoever has mentioned here in the past a link re CogAT not being reliable as an indicator of true intellectual ability for HG/HG+ kids ... please please please share a link or cite the source. We were once in the very same situation - we're long past that at this point in my ds' school years, but I would so love to send that article back to his elementary gifted program teachers because I truly suspect there are quite a few kids missed for gifted programming in our school district every year due to CogAT.

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    http://www.hoagiesgifted.org/tests_tell_us.htm

    "Group intelligence tests are commonly used as screening measures, to see if the child should move to a full gifted assessment. They are commonly administered by teachers. Group tests are generally normed on populations of all children, with relatively few gifted children among the mix. When taking group intelligence tests, gifted kids often "over-think" the questions, and perhaps make wrong selections. And since there's no individual tester to clarify unusual answers, the gifted kids often score lower on group intelligence tests."

    Also, this, though it mentions OLSAT not CoGat. I imagine they're similar but I'm not an expert:

    "The most common group intelligence tests, OLSAT and CogAT, are used in districts and programs across the country. Notable gifted professionals recommend them for screening potentially gifted children. However, a small study noted a potential problem with the OLSAT and very gifted children. While the correlation between group and individual intelligence tests is quite high for average scores, in this study that correlation almost disappeared for gifted scores. This means that while an average child will score very similarly on a group IQ test and an individual IQ test, a gifted child may not score similarly at all. And the study suggests that this group test may even result in a negative correlation for some gifted children: the more gifted the child, the lower the group ability test score! ["Investigations of the Otis-Lennon School Ability Test to Predict WISC-R Full Scale IQ for Referred Children" by Anna H. Avant and Marcia R. O'Neal, University of Alabama, Nov. 1986, ED286883] Though this study is no longer available from AskERIC, it can be obtained on microfiche from most education university libraries."

    Last edited by KADmom; 05/11/13 02:21 PM.
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    Abigail Offline OP
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    Here are his subtest scores:

    Verbal Comprehension
    Similarities: 19
    Vocabulary: 19
    Comprehension: 17

    Perceptual Reasoning
    Block design: 15
    Picture Concepts: 17
    Matrix Reasoning: 11

    Working Memory
    Digit Span: 12
    Letter-number sequence: 12

    Processing Speed
    Coding: 10
    Symbol search: 12

    I asked the psychologist if there could be something to his VCI and PCI discrepancy and he said he didn't think so. That usually it evens out as the child gets older.

    On another note, I finally got a hold of someone from the highly capable office for our district and he didn't make the cut off for either of the full day gifted programs (according to his cogat scores, which I haven't received) and there isn't any openings in any of the full day programs anyways... How convenient. I'm not sure what my other options are.

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