Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Identification, Testing & Assessment School GT testing for an ADHD child (need help)

We just received the CoGat results for our 7 yo son who is now in 1st grade.
I would be grateful if anyone could help us with a few questions we have about the upcoming post-Cogat process, during which he will be tested for "gifted"-ness.
If he passes these further tests/evaluations/assessments - which are very fuzzy to me at this point - he will be placed in a "gifted" program which is supposed to deliver services by taking children out of their regular classes once a week for a special, more "advanced" type of curriculum.

His Cogat results were:

Composite SAS 127

Age adjusted percentile scores:
- 92 percentile verbal
- 86 percentile quantitative
- 98 percentile nonverbal
95 percentile composite

Grade adjusted percentile scores:
- 95 percentile verbal
- 91 percentile quantitative
- 99 percentile nonverbal.
98 percentile composite

I should also mention that he was recently diagnosed with ADHD and we are in the very preliminary stages of pursuing a 504 plan with the school.

I have always known our son is a very intelligent little boy (exhausting too, because of his attention issues) but I never really thought of him as "gifted". In fact, even his CoGat scores indicate that he might be somewhere at the borderline between "very bright" and "truly gifted". Either way, labels don't interest me because they are, by definition, simplistic, reductionistic and often just plain wrong.
The only thing I care about in this world is the well-being and security of my children (present and future). Without going into much detail, I believe that he would benefit, in more than one way, if he was accepted into this program. Socially, he might get a chance to find a more compatible pool of potential friends, as social skills are not his forte. Academically, he would be challenged, if only one day a week. I find the regular public school curriculum to be generally weak, even in "awesome" public schools such as the one my son is going to; so anything extra that he would do in a more "advanced" class would be more than welcome, as he is easily capable of handling more and we just don't have the money to pay for fancy private schools.

At this point, I am not exactly sure what the next stage will involve.
The school has 2 paths for qualification. Option A, which requires a 99 percentile composite score on Cogat (does not apply to him); and Option B, which is based on multiple criteria:

- 96th percentile on Cogat - Component or Composite score.
-Creativity: 90th percentile / 90th percent on a creativity assessment
Motivation: 90th percentile / 90th percent on a motivation assessment.

Because he scored over 96 percentile on the non-verbal component, this helped him made the cut to be considered for gifted testing. I am curious, however, whether they usually take into account the age-adjusted score or the grade-adjusted score. I would assume the former.

The school also specifies that the assessments used for the 2nd and 3rd criteria above are:
- The Renzulli Behavioral Rating Scale for Creativity (1-12), Torrance Test of Creative Thinking (TTCT).
- Renzulli Behavioral Rating Scale for Motivation (1-12), motivation portfolio (1-3); Children�s Academic Intrinsic Motivation Inventory(CAIMI) (4-5).

Here are some of my questions: how exactly will these motivation/creativity assessments be done? Are these ratings the teacher will complete? Will there be any additional creativity/motivation tests administered directly to children who had the minimum Cogat score required?

I have heard that a portfolio will also have to be put together, which will include work done by the child over time - but mainly in class. Parents will be able to add to the portfolio some additional work done outside the school by the child, but in-class work will weigh the most.

His teacher is convinced that he belongs in the gifted class, so if she will be completing any questionnaires, she will probably be giving very favorable ratings. He also has several nice, outside-of-class accomplishments and lots of work to add to the in-class portfolio...
However, I am not sure if there will be any additional standardized tests on motivation/creativity that he will have to take.

The trouble is that, due to ADHD, he can seriously under-perform under distractable conditions or if someone is not there to keep the pace, keep him on track, remind him to add details, etc - which is what we are trying to help him with by going for the 504 plan.

My ultimate question would be: is there anything in particular I can do to help him make the cut for the gifted program at this point?
He seems to be very close but you just never know, considering this school has a high percentage of over-achievers.

If anyone is familiar with the post-Cogat testing process, as described above, I would appreciate any input about how exactly the children will be tested for motivation and creativity.

Finally, do you think we should hold off the 504 process until the "giftedness" issue is clarified, or you think it is better to go in parallel? Is it possible that the ADHD/504 request could somehow affect his chances to be accepted into the gifted program, even if only indirectly or tacitly?

Thank you so much for any advice/input you might have for us.

I agree. Don't wait to pursue the 504. I don't know about the tests you reference. I'll just add that if the school is willing to test him, let him take the tests and see what happens. It sounds like it's a program that would be interesting but it's not a programs worth getting either of you stressed over if he doesn't make it in. He does look borderline based on the scores above but that doesn't mean anything. I was told when my son was 6 that he was "barely gifted" (by the GT coordinator) and he eventually qualifed for DYS.

I'm also guessing that if he doesn't do well on the testing this year, he'll have the opportunity to take it again next year when you have the 504 in place.

By the way, what types of things are you asking for in the 504?

I absolutely agree - get that 504 in place, and continue to work on understanding how your ds is impacted in school and in testing by his ADHD - that would be my #1 priority; I have two 2e kids, and getting them accommodations and remediation *early* was extremely important; they missed out on some early opportunities for gifted enrichment because of it, but making sure they had their accommodations and remediation and that I understood their challenges well enough to advocate for them made it possible for them to be eligible for and truly benefit from g/t and advanced programs on down the road.

You can work on the g/t side at the same time. No one here is going to be able to explain in detail the next steps of the process in your school district *unless* they are also in the same school district - the process for id'ing g/t kids and the programs vary tremendously in different areas. We can tell you a few things though - the first thought that comes to mind, for me, is that the CogAT is not the most reliable id test for g/t kids. A lot of the EG/PG kids here (including my ds12) did *not* score in the g/t range on the CogAT. It's what can be referred to as a "learned" ability test as opposed to an innate ability test (IQ tests such as the SB and WISC), so school experience/exposure can influence results as well as sometimes EG kids who think way outside the box just aren't going to use the same thought process as expected by the test in answering the questions.

The next thing - you need to understand how your ds' ADHD impacts him in the classroom and in testing situations. Does he need a quiet room? Does he need extended time? Does he need someone to read the questions to him (I think they do this anyway on the CogAT at his age but I'm not 100% sure)? Does he need breaks during testing? Any of the types of accommodations that he needs for regular classroom testing should be included in his 504 plan, and they would then also be included in G/T testing (if they are listed as testing accommodations in his 504 plan).

I would try not to worry too much about the g/t testing at this point in time - let it take place and see what happens. There is usually room for appeal if he doesn't get in, and because his teacher thinks he belongs in the program, I am guessing there's a good chance he'll get in - teacher recommendations often carry a lot of weight. Lastly, if it's a once-per-week pullout and he doesn't get in this first year, he most likely can try again next year and chances are with the typical pull-out programs he will not be behind in any way and he's also not missing something that will negatively impact his life in a huge way. I'm not saying that to say the program isn't worth being in, just that my local experience and the experiences I've heard from other families are that typically once-per-week pullouts are bandaids put in place to make a small effort toward helping g/t kids, but to truly benefit the kids need to be in every-day g/t programs.

Good luck!

polarbear