Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Age or Ability Specific Forums Pre-school gifted qualities vs. quantification

It seems that there are multiple (often controversial) ways of determining giftedness in pre-schoolers. Reaching milestones early is one way, but I have seen mention of other, less quantified ways of assessing giftedness, such as long attention span, memory, and following commands.

Can someone point to a list or source that talks about giftedness from that perspective?

My kids are great examples of "milestones theory" not being quite right! If you went by milestones, my kids would be in the "dumb as a rock" category
... DS4 wouldn't sit unassisted till 11 months (he was cruising before sitting), didn't walk till almost 18 months, at 2 years only had 10 words, didn't actually start talking till 2.5 years old ... yet, he was making clear eye contact from day 1, he would show you where and when batteries needed to be changed on his toys since he was a little infant, he knew names of shapes and colors before any other words, he's great with math (I posted last week about him answering my question of 6+2 equals what with the answer of "equals to 4+4) ... so, he's clearly pretty sharp, especially with anything technical and scientific.
... DS2 was a very late sitter and walker too, though he's a lot better with anything physical than DS4 was. On the other hand, you look at him and he just has this "dumb" "absent minded" look on his face ... has since he was a baby. You really have to engage him to get him out of his shell and then he's a giggling ball of energy. He was even MORE speech delayed than our older one (if that's even possible?) ... yet he knew most letters by 18 months, recognized them all (upper and lower case) including phonics sounds by 24 months, learned shapes and colors right after he turned two within minutes ... all while not being able to communicate at all (being assessed at 9-12 months comprehension level at 25 months) ... here we are some 3-4 months later and while his vocab is still limited (maybe 150 words) ... he prefers to learn to talk in whole phrases and can pretty much READ and or recognize almost all the words he knows. And he certainly "comprehends" and lets me know what he wants but ONLY when he chooses to. Not when other tell him to.

So, truly ... this whole milestones thing just isn't right for all the kids as according to the early rolling, sitting, walking, talking theory both my boys would be severely delayed!

neither one follow commands but if they find something they like, they can sit at it for hours. DS4 will be probably at some point diagnosed with ADHD / Asperger's / learning disability of some sort ... just can't figure out what it is as he's giving a lot of mixed signals. DS2 is a huge puzzle to all. But he's clearly not autistic (which we feared for a long time) ... he's just not interested in the ordinary life around him and doesn't bother pleasing others to conform to the standards but he's got the memory of an elephant!!!

Thanks for saying that MK. It's quite amazing how different they all are, but it does seem that at some point there are similiarities, but I have noticed that they are often not in the textbook milestones.

I think it's in the intensity. There's just more there there. My kids don't do anything other kids don't do, exactly. They just tend to it in 72 point, Blackadder script, in haiku form. Kind of like the 5 paragraph paper dd's teacher asked them to write describing their favorite toy. I don't think she expected to get a detailed description of the sound a stuffed snake makes when it's flung on the floor in a fit of pique.

Very interesting topic. I have been wondering about this myself lately. I have 2 boys. DS4yr10mo is PG and was the typical milestone gifted toddler. Early reading self taught at 2 1/2, counting to 1000+ at 2yr 10 mo. all driven by his own passion. Very analytical.

DS2yr9mo is a different story however. Yes, he knew all upper lower case letters and all their sounds at 2 years of age and is now pointing to and knows about 40 words by sight. He also at times will sound words out. Still, nothing like my older that would obsessively go around the house at this age reading the clocks and refused to let go of his calculator. DS2 is totally different.

It is hard to explain but he has a much more depth in his thinking pattern, incredible abstract thinking. When DS4 would just look at a picture in a book and see what it was, DS2 will go off making up a story line about that picture. What will happen if he did this or that. Amazing creativity. HE also has an almost too intense personality and compassion for others. Observes EVERYTHING and there is NO WAY you can distract him. This was something that was evident before 1 year of age.
Also his memory. The other day he recalled that his uncle had tripped on some toys in Grandad's house so "We have to pick up the toys at Granddad's house so uncle XX doesn't trip". This uncle only visited ONCE 1 1/2 YEARS ago! The attention to detail is astonishing as well.
Another interesting thing he will do is look at a word like "together". He will then put his fingers over part of the word to find words within the word, like "to", "get", "the", "he". This is one of his favorite things to do while we read....:-)

So, yes, I do think there is usually some early advancement in gifted kids when it comes to the academics. But it seems like it is sooo much more to it than just that. I am not sure, obviously, at this point that DS2 IS gifted, although I highly suspect it...

My kids are just really different...I do think it's hard to look at the early end of the spectrum and make assumptions. Easier to look backwards after one has been identified as advanced or gifted.

My DS did not talk much until he was about 2.5...but he knew all his letters at 2 and started reading about the same time her started talking. He was average with crawling, sitting, walking...nothing special or behind. He could hold a pencil and utensil very early though, and we knew he was left-handed well before his first birthday.

My DD, OTOH, did most 'classic' milestones early: smiled early, sat up early, crawled early, walked early...even pretty much skipped baby food and went right to table food (attributed this to bigger brother). She also started talking very early and was speaking in well-developed sentences by 15 months. Now at 2, she doesn't know a single letter like DS or read a single word...but she can count well over 20 and can do puzzles amazingly.

I have chalked up some of the differences we've seen to gender (maybe erroneously so). I guess it remains to be seen if my DD has the drive to learn and ability to synthesize information quickly the way her older brother does.

Looking back (my DD is 13 now) the milestones thing partly fit and partially didn't.

Mostly it was, as eldertree notes above, just more there there.

It was easy to ignore if you only spent time with her in a superficial manner. She was excellent at 'cloaking' by the time she was two or three. But her memory was uncanny. Not only that, she would come up with things that required: a) phenomenal recall of complex information, b) manipulation of that information, and c) expression of that information with obvious evidence of synthesis. Context-appropriate expression, I might add.

So she might use parts of a phrase from a book or television show to make a joke about something that she found funny or strange.

You know how adults who are fans of, say, The Princess Bride may use the meme "This word... I do not think it means... what you think it means"? Like that. Obviously, she hadn't read TPB or seen the movie. But she was lifting content from books and media that she HAD seen.

It was very disconcerting, because it was these very mature phrases that she wouldn't otherwise use-- she was lifting the entire phrase contextually the way some children lift single vocabulary words, for lack of a better way to explain it. It was a little freaky, though, because it was so much like echolalia. You really had to be paying attention to know what she was doing, and she never did it in front of people she wasn't comfortable with-- or, for that matter, in front of age-mates. Well, she did, a few times. With them she used more juvenile material (Barney, Mr. Rogers) but quickly gave even that up since they still didn't 'get' it.

She also recalled the 9/11 footage that she'd seen for only a few minutes on TV (live). She was just about 29 months old then, and she talked about "when the buildings fall down" and was fearful of airplanes when she was nearly three. In between, not a peep. It was as though she was processing what she'd seen and absorbing additional (adult) conversation snippets to put it together.

Looking back, those kinds of things and her extraordinary awareness of things and people around her are just so different from other children that age. Radically so. We had no idea at the time. I was having 'car conversations' with her when she was still in a rear-facing carseat. When I think about some of those conversations, they were about topics that no child under four ought to even have a concept of.

Evemomma, at the testing for DS4 this past summer they also told me that usually the second child will "choose" a different route than their sibling. It is almost like they try to be their own person by finding their own path. This is very much true with my kids.

I would think the little brother would want to be JUST LIKE his big bro, but not so much....:-)

Thank you everyone for contributing to this thread. It is such interesting reading!

I agree that it is obvious that there is more THERE there. From birth, my DS was like that. He came out alert and "knowing." Although I have talked to people who's kids were working with letters and talking early like him whose kids turned out not to be gifted, there is much more going on here.

Recall is a big one, and his humor is blossoming overnight. Yesterday, he picked up some sheet music and was intensely studying it, like he does books and other printed materials. He is different. It is clear.

Thanks so much for all of your insight.