Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums General Discussion Crying over son's behavior... any advice?

My son (3 years old - will be 4 in a couple of months) I think has me to my breaking point. I'm sitting at my computer crying because I feel so frustrated and incompetent. He's been "kicked out" of two preschools already. He's home with me for the summer and he is supposed to start a private gifted school in the fall. I have little hope that it will go well come this fall.

He is so oppositional. It feels really extreme. No matter what we tell him, he wants the opposite. He BEGGED me to sign him up for this art class. After a couple of weeks of this, we all finally agreed to let him go. We signed him up. Literally, as soon as we signed him up he said he didn't want to go. This morning, as we tried to take him to class he threw a major major fit... so we couldn't take him. (It would be physically impossible to remove him from the car seat and also unfair to the teacher and other kids to send him in there even if we could.)

I feel like such a failure as a parent. I don't understand why he acts like this. We've been to a psychologist that evaluated him and said it was a combo of his extreme intelligence and his extreme stubborness/willfullness/self-directedness. I don't know how do make this better. I've read so many books. We try to be very consistent with our parenting and discipline.

In contrast, our 2 year old daughter - who is also extremely gifted but has none of the behavior issues - is so EASY. She does what we ask. She's good natured and just... easy!

I just feel so frustrated and so at-a-loss. My husband used to joke about military school, but he isn't really "joking" about it any more.

I guess I just wanted to vent, but I'm very open to hearing any advice!!! Thank you...

I just ordered "Transforming the Difficult Child" - a 6 hour seminar on DVD. I saw it recommended by Grinity in another thread and thought it sounded promising. We'll see...

I feel so desperate for any kind of guidance. I must be doing something wrong, there must be something I can do better to make this better for my family.

I should also add that my son is a good kid in general. He is never intentionally hurtful, never malicious. He is just very very very intense. He loves to argue. He likes to be in control (or think he is). He doesn't respect authority.

Hugs. I hear you. I have one just like this. As in your case, I also have a second child who is also gifted but who is not like this. Parenting him is a cakewalk by comparison.

My DD has been diagnosed with anxiety and depression, but I am not absolutely sure the diagnoses are correct or that they are the true root of the behavior. I know how you feel and I know how hard it is. We were making the military school jokes ourselves last weekend.

I will ask if you think he could be anxious. I do think DD's anxiety causes her to want to be in control of every situation, so in that sense I feel it does influence her behavior.

My daughter was the same!! Up until she passed 6 or 7 (she's 9 now) I thought I'd lose my mind.

One example: we had a FOUR hour stand-off when she was 3 yrs old, about saying "sorry". She refused! I had an intuitive sense that this was a battle I needed to pick, so I stuck to my guns. She screamed and stomped and belligerently defied me for FOUR hours. OMGOSH. She finally realized that I wasn't going to change my mind and if she wanted out of her room, she'd have to say sorry, so she did. (I can't even remember what the sorry was for, lol).

She's still extremely intense, sensitive and reactive, but not nearly as stubborn with me. As she has aged she's also learned to pick her battles.

Hang in there. You're not alone It gets better...

My middle DS, (happy, productive 26 yr old now) was this way and my husband and I did spend many years feeling like we were going a bit crazy! He seemed gifted but finances were too tight to get him tested. After a horrible experience in one school we were fortunate to find a perfect match in a private school (on scholarship) that guided every child to their very highest academic abilities while also requiring them to develop good character. Long story short...with him he basically wanted to be treated like an adult. We tailored our parenting style with him to give him as much opened minded respect as was safe. I have to add that as soon as he started high school, the "challenging everything any adult said" attitude eased off. I always felt he was a passionate, super sensitive, gifted person who thought he was an adult trapped in a child's body! If we treated him in a way that he felt was fair, we all got along.

I also want to add that the post a couple of months ago on this board about being an introvert really made a difference in our family regarding my dear GD age 4. She also has spent her short life challenging "authority." However upon realizing that she was an extreme introvert we all changed how we interact and guide her. The difference in her ability to get along with the world is amazing! She even walked onto the stage to accept her Preschool diploma the other day. Even a few months ago this would have ended in first freezing and then a huge screaming public meltdown. Your story about the art classes made me think of her. An introvert really does want to participate, but often times physically cannot face the situation...which if misunderstood can end in a tantrum.

Overall I just want to add that I really feel for your situation, sweetpeas. But if you can figure out what works best for THIS child, then go with that parenting style. Hang in there, it DOES get better!

Hang in there, Sweetpeas! There is a long list of parents ahead of you whose preschoolers had "behavior issues". That intensity is a gift, but so challenging to parent!

When DD was about that age, her psych sat with her and together they made a workbook that she would fill out a page of each night. Essentially it was a scale from "happy to sad" and she would have to reflect on how she had felt at different times of day, about 3-4 times a day. This morning I was really happy, so she would circle that end. "tonight I was really mad that I had to ...." so she would circle that end. She would also have to write down what had happened with the associated feeling. I did it with her. It helped us talk about things, pinpoint things that made her angry/anxious/sad, and it helped her understand herself. Sort of like a diary, but more structured.

Oh my goodness!! I just re-read the part of your post re: the art class. My daughter was THE SAME! In her case it was skating, and she begged and begged (and would become FRANTIC if we mentioned cancelling it). She was desperate to skate! Once we got there, however, she wouldn't go on the ice. The teacher would give me this nasty look, like "why are you forcing her?" ...it was so frustrating!! We finally found a solution: we would arrive at least 20, 25 minutes early to give her time to adjust. She had a specific routine that she had to go through each time (ie. walk to the vending machines, sit and sip water, walk to the notice board, etc etc) before she could skate... very OCD-like. She doesn't have OCD, but she does have anxiety.

What if you brought your son early to art class? Allow at least :30 to ease him into the building. It's maddening... but it worked for my daughter. I was so frustrated/exhausted, looking around at all these "typical" 4 year olds who walked quietly in, 5 minutes before class... meanwhile my amazing daughter who had all those early milestones and is so advanced... was SUCH a handful!! sigh.

Ultramarina has a good point - anxiety can cause defiance as they try and obtain control. My daughter's grade 2 teacher was the first one to point this out to me, and I think she hit the nail right on the head.

My daughter's anxiety issues have dramatically improved as she's aged. Suffice to say there has been a direct correlation between her level of anxiety and her level of obstinance and volatility, all of which have decreased as she's matured.

At nine, she's happy, well adjusted, the second youngest in a gr. 4/5 French Immersion split (there are kids in her class almost 2 years older), and she's in the gifted math program. She's finally happy She still has intensity and hyper-sensitivities, but they resolve SO much faster now. She also has moments of atypical anxiety, but they're isolated and situation-specific, rather than being a constant "dull roar" of nerves.

One more thing - don't ever blame yourself!! Look at it this way: your son has his intelligence "volume turned up" ...unfortunately this means that other "volumes" are turned up as well. These kids are highly reactive, sensitive and intense simply because they have more neurons firing. It's not your fault.

Good for you sweetpeas, I think you'll get a lot out of the DVD. I would caution that the DVD is from 2004 and their idea of 'time out' has evolved quite a bit since then, so I would recommend to order Lisa Bravo's 'Transforming the Difficult Child Workbook' to have on hand as a way to get caught up on the 'how to's of the new time out system.

I'd also caution that as much as I love those folks, I don't love their 'anti-medication' perspective. As far as I can tell, some kids use this and don't need medication any more, but other kids benifit tremendously from a combination of this approach and medication.

Anxiety can certianly go hand in had with a lack of recognition of athority. My son just hated being treated 'like a baby' right from the beginning. It does get better in part because once kids grow to middle school age everyone expects them to be moody and have 'minds of their own.'

As to why your dd has it easier, remember that 1) she has 'girl biology' which is often (not always) easier going and also less 'into' confrontation. Keep an eye on her. She may want what she wants just as strongly as her brother, but may be better equipped to go behind your back (at some age) to get it.
2) She has her older brother to 'go to the trouble' of creating excitement in the house, thus saving her the bother. When you start the approach outlined in 'Transforming' be sure to include her, to prevent her from feeling that she has to act out to get back to what she is used to.

It will get better!
Grinity

Yep, I just had an "art class" moment with a friend at swimming lessons. Her DD5 and my DS5 are friends from preschool and were excited to be in the same swim class. However, the first day of class her DD5 became instantly overwhelmed, cried and refused to participate. My friend was furious because she felt her DD was being defiant. As an outsider (it's easier to be more reasonable with someone else's kids :)), I suggested DD was overwhelmed to the point of shut-down, which is defiant as a means of self-preservation. I suggested it would be a success even if her DD only set with her feet in and watched. Luckily, the next session was much easier with her DD...and we just hot home from lessons where she's thriving!

Your DS may need to observe classes before participating, even for many sessions . The workbook you ordered is great, as is the book it's based upon by Howard Glasser. I thinks it will help take a new approach with DS' scting out. Don't blame yourself ...kids can be truly awesome and horrifically terrible all independent of their parents.