Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Identification, Testing & Assessment unexplained discrepancies

i am currently a ninth grader who took a practice SAT test, and a practice reading portion of the ACT test. Along with statewide tests.

SAT:
CR: 620
M: 570

ACT:
R: ~24

New York State ELA (NCLB):
Medium/Low 3 (reading on level)
Approximately 70th percentile.

Can anyone explain to me the large discrepancy presented here? My SAT scores definitely fit CTY criteria, and my ACT reading probably does too.
Also, does only doing one portion of the test inflate the score? For that reason, I am slightly unsure of the legitimacy of my ACT score.


Thanks,
a

Also, my integrated algebra regents is a score around the70th percentile

Did you take an actual SAT and ACT or just a published practice test? Were you hoping for the Intensive Studies program or the Academic Explorations program, which has lower cut scores? The CTY qualifying scores change by grade, and your math score doesn't make the cutoff for Intensive Studies, although it does meet the criteria for Academic Explorations. The CR makes the Intensive Studies cut by only 10 points. The ACT reading score is significantly below the Intensive Studies cut of 27, but still above the cut for Academic Explorations. If you haven't taken either real test yet, I wouldn't be overly confident that you would make it into the Intensive Studies program, because there are lots of things that can affect your performance for better or worse on test day, and your score is close to the cutoff. (If these are real scores, then, congratulations!)

Since the SAT and ACT measure different things than your state NCLB test, there isn't necessarily a discrepancy between the college admission test scores and the state testing.

ETA: A 70th percentile score on the Integrated Algebra Regents is not in any way incompatible with a 570 SAT math. There is little to no advanced math on the SAT, and performing that much better than average at algebra would be enough to make that happen.

The SAT practice test was a collegeboard test on their website, and the ACT score was from an ARCO book, which I now know from forums to be significantly harder than the real ACT.

About the academic explorations and intensive studies programs: what are the corresponding cutoffs of the programs. I was led to believe A.E. was a 95th percentile program. I'd probably be going to extensive studies if I could.
My individual SAT scores may be barely cutoff, but my combination score brings a higher probability.

Thanks.

The math scores are about as incompatiable as the reading scores actually. Both compare a score most likely in the mid90th percentile to a 70th percentile score.

Even then, I wouldn't count my chickens. Some people do better on the real thing than on practice tests; some people do worse. Take the test, see how you do. (And take it before you're technically a 10th grader, when the cuts are higher, or be prepared to meet the higher cuts. ETA: looks like that would mean registering by tomorrow for the ACT, and by Tuesday for the SAT.)


http://cty.jhu.edu/summer/docs/intensive_eligibility.pdf

IE cut for humanities / writing is 610 or 27 for 9th grade testers, and 660 or 29 for 10th grade testers. For math, 680 or 1240 for 9th and 730 or 1340 for 10th.

http://cty.jhu.edu/summer/docs/academic_princeton_eligibility.pdf

AE cut for humanities / writing is 510 or 21 for 9th grade testers, and 560 or 24 for 10th grade testers. For math, 530 for 9th and 580 for 10th.

FWIW, my usual suspects for accounting for the score differences you see would either be, "you're someone who tends to do worse on the actual test than the practice test" (an unfortunate problem that does afflict some very smart kids), or "those tests have similar names, but don't actually assess similar skills" (which I believe, based on my own kid's NCLB and EXPLORE experiences, to be true).

thanks!

i was also wondering by cutoff scores, what would be the corresponding national percentiles to the A.E and I.S. program?
for example, to qualify for the talent search via an achievement test, a child should score at least at the 95th percentile nationally. To get into academic explorations, would it be 90th national percentile on the SAT/ACT? (of course for the grade the student is in)

I think the math doesn't work out the way you're looking at it.

First, yes, most talent searches use a 95th percentile cutoff. But that doesn't mean that only 5% of the population is eligible, because you only have to meet the 95% cutoff once, on one of multiple acceptable tests. (And then there's parent recommendation, a whole 'nother thing.)

Second, the pool of "who actually takes the test" is further skewed. I'd guess at least 5% of my kid's school would be eligible to test, but she's the only one who actually did. Some schools sent most of their GT-identified kids. So not only are the percentile reports by grade not based on "all kids," they aren't based on "all kids eligible for talent search," either.

Third, there's no national reporting of talent search scores. Each search reports its own scores, and some of the searches are a lot more competitive than others.

For NUMATS, a 9th grader with a 21 Reading ACT would be 27th percentile, SAT-CR of 510 would be 33rd percentile, SAT-M of 530 would be 32nd percentile. A 9th grader with a 27 Reading ACT would be 65th percentile, SAT-CR of 610 would be 75th percentile, SAT-M of 680 would be 91st percentile, SAT combined of 1240 would be 77th percentile. (In the past, I've been able to find at least one other search's scores online, but no luck today!)

ACT Reading of 24 is 47th percentile; SAT-CR of 620 is 78th percentile; SAT-M of 570 is 48th percentile. (Notice there's also a large percentile discrepancy between the reading scores on the ACT and the SAT. I'd lay that on "those tests don't test the identical thing.")