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I'm new here - hoping to get some advice for how to handle the situation with my two kids. My son is finishing second grade, and to be honest, is bored to tears. He adores math, science, and history. In math they are doing two digit addition (at home he is learning multiplication and division). In science they are discovering what sinks and what floats, although there is no discussion about why they do so. And the only history they have really covered this year is a bit about the pilgrims around Thanksgiving. The AIG program is once a week....and only if the teacher shows up, which sometimes she doesn't. I've raised him to believe that nothing worth doing is easy, so he is starting to get into trouble at school. Nothing serious - he hasn't been fighting or mouthing off or anything - but his teacher gets very upset when she (frequently) catches him reading books under the desk while she is teaching. When I sent a notebook of extra work for him to do in his spare time, his teacher took it from him because she saw it as a distraction to the other students. After a conference, she agreed to give him more difficult work - and she did....for about a week.
Then there is my daughter, who is in kindergarten. I thought she would be okay for now, since I see kindergarten as nine months of reading and writing practice, and little more. Then she started saying that her homework made her feel like a baby. Still, I let it go because I thought at least she was getting lots of practice on the basics. Then I got her test scores back. As of January, she was already well past the end of year goals in everything. The end of year goal for recognizing and naming letters was 27. She scored a 54. For hearing and using sounds in spoken words, the goal was 18 - she scored a 44. The librarian at school insists that she check out the "easy" books - so she checks them out, never takes them out of her backpack, and reads Junie B. Jones at home.
I guess my question is, what do I do? I don't want them to lose interest in learning. I have them in music, theatre, and karate, which they both love - but there is still the seven hours a day that they spend at school. Having spoken to a friend who works for the schoool, I've been told (off the record, of course) that skipping either of them will be virtually impossible, because the school needs their test scores at the end of the year to ensure proper funding. (Thanks a bunch, No Child Left Behind). So if anyone has any ideas, I'm open to suggestions! Thanks bunches!

Welcome, Michelle, and sympathy! What to do next depends quite a bit on where you are - on the left there's a link "How gifted-friendly is your state?" which you might like to look at. Some states give you rights, in others you have to beg... but it sounds as though you have at least some serious advocacy in front of you, and you may need to be thinking about whether there are other school options.

As a substitute teacher and mom of two gifted children in a public elementary school, I would advise you to ask for a meeting with the school regarding the gifted or enrichment program for children. You have to be their advocate and ask for challenging materials. When a child is sneaking to read a book under their desk, they're bored! BTW, the gifted kids are always reading books under their desk when the teacher is going over homework, busy work, or reviewing old material. It doesn't bother me unless it's new material that I'm introducing!

Welcome!

Depending on where you're at, the end of the year testing shouldn't have anything to do with them skipping a grade, but more when they do a grade skip. Our end of the year tests start next month (2 months before the end of the year ).

Maybe you could ask about some subject acceleration in the classes that aren't tested, or start the conversation about skipping for next year. I know it takes a lot of conversations to get some schools to agree to acceleration, so start now and see what you can get.

Have you talked to the librarian about your daughter's books? Is it possible for you to go to the school right before it ends someday and bring her to the library and ask the librarian to listen to her read and then perhaps she'd allow her to take more difficult books out.

Good Luck!

I think many are thinking the same question - what state? And then knowing what options are then potentials for advocating, you might want fuller private testing that gives you out of level information - so you know how to best advocate. "Everybody" in my district said the district didn't skip kids. But they do have a state filled policy and they did skip our kids. Sometimes I feel like school can be like playing telephone with insurance companies - you keep getting transfered and told no - until you don't. Much to discover - does your school have gifted services, acceleration policy, can you get private testing, what other school options do you have... and welcome, you are among likeminds.

I find it hard to believe that you could not advance your children a grade. I considered skipping a grade with my dd and was talked out of this by teachers because they had a "higher ability" program. Unfortunately, the higher ability program lets in about 15% of the kids and my dd is in the top 1-2%. She is still incredibly bored and I wish I had advanced her a grade. She has continued to dance competitively through school for 15-25 hrs/ week and has no problems balancing school with this schedule (she rarely has homework). She was finally advanced further in math starting in 6th grade and is now taking geometry in 8th grade- currently has a 96% while others in class are struggling to get Bs or Cs. Of note is that in activities outside of school, she mainly hangs out with kids that are 2-4 years older than her. I have found that her giftedness is reflected socially in addition to her academics. I really wish I had advanced her at least one grade because she gets along much better with older kids. She finds kids her own age to be immature, lacking in logic & sense of humor (they don't get irony), and- she said this- "less worldly" in their outlook on life.

There is a textbook that can be found on Amazon that has specific information on assessing a child for grade advancement. I forget the name of the book. I do remember that it is somewhat pricey- over $30?? School systems should be using this manual to assess grade advancement. However, I think they really do not make much effort to truly assess a child or are frequently ignorant of this resource. Good luck!!! Please do not give up on advancing your children. There are many negative consequences to a child not being challenged in school. Your children might have significant problems later in life if they are not challenged in school.

I'm seeing that the conversation in this thread has turned toward skipping your children a grade. I'm generally in favor of that (I have a grade skipped kid myself), but don't necessarily think that it works for all gifted kids. I'd definitely get a hold of a copy of the Iowa Acceleration Scale if you want to consider a skip and do think that subject acceleration is a reasonable compromise if it isn't a good fit for your particular kid (we've gone that route with my other child for whom a grade skip isn't the right fit). A couple things to consider if you are considering advocating for a skip:

My dd who is skipped is like JLC01's. She is just older in many ways than her years. She hangs out with older kids by choice when she can in extracurriculars and adults even in some of her extracurriculars (like SCUBA diving). We've always called her our old soul. Kids who are socially mature and who fit well with older kids without standing out as younger seem to be better accepted when they are placed academically with those older kids from what we've seen. (There are a few grade skipped kids in dd's grade and we've seen both and had teachers comment to us about the difference.)

Academically, the child should be well, well above grade level in pretty much all subjects when s/he skips. I'm not positive if I am reading your post re your dd here correct. Are you saying that she is supposed to be naming 27 English letters by the end of K and can name 54? I'm assuming that they're looking @ capital and lower case letters in this instance. I can see as how this would be boring if they are working ad nauseum on learning those letters she already knows, but I don't know if this is enough proof of significant advancement to the extent that she needs to be skipped. (Again, I realize that you're not the one who raised this possibility.)

For instance, I recall that both of my girls had met end of year goals on everything for K by the first time they were tested at the end of the first quarter. It wasn't a big issue for them b/c their K teacher was good and they had fun singing and coloring even if they didn't need the song about "Ms. V the vegetarian" to learn the letter V or the sound it made. They also weren't held to reading simple early readers they had mastered.

With your daughter, I'd start with trying to advocate for more complete testing to show how advanced she really is as it sounds like her reading is more advanced than the testing they are doing is showing. Then I'd work on having the limits lifted on what they're letting her check out from the library. I'd be inclined to push pretty hard for subject acceleration in language arts in 1st grade for her as well b/c 1st grade language arts/reading classes are pretty darn boring for good readers (unless their writing is well behind their reading abilities).

As to whether I'd look at a grade skip for either kiddo, I'd see if you can get IQ testing and above level testing done or at least one or the other to see if that seems to be a good fit academically. Then I'd take a look at the IAS to see if the other pieces seem to be in place (social, etc.). Can you set up a meeting with the GT coordinator at the school and see if s/he can help you get the ball rolling on some of this?

I know that you may get what JLC01 and many people hear -- GT doesn't start until [3rd grade, 4th grade...], we have a good GT program that will meet his/her needs at that point... I agree, that if you have children in the top 1% or so of ability with no major twice exceptionality issues, GT programming doesn't often meet the need. Like JLC01, we have a lot more than 1-2% of kids in the GT programming and it really is geared more toward meeting the needs of kids who are in the top 10-15% than the top 1-2%. If that's what your GT programming looks like, I think that it is well within reason to ask for more (subject or grade acceleration).

I'd also say to take comments like 'the reading GT class serves kids who are in the top 5% and the math GT class serves kids who are in the top 5%' with a grain of salt b/c what that often looks like is kids who are in the top 5% after being tested on multiple measures to hit that top 5% in something. There is also a big difference btwn a kid who is in the top 5% of achievement and ability in one area and nowhere else and a kid who is in the top 1-2% composite. I'm one who will also maintain that kids who hit the top 5% on one part of a group ability test are not necessarily kids who will hit the top 5% on any part of an IQ test b/c I've seen that happen too often (and the converse, kids with high individual IQ scores and lower group test scores).

If you want a grade skip, for either child, the thing that I'd focus on is getting data. Do you have IQ tests for your children? Achievement testing at a higher than grade level? Evidence of higher than grade level work at home (it sounds like you may have this for math) - and have you compared it with your school district's curriculum standards as a benchmark for equivalent grade level?

I'd also recommend the IAS.

And... I have a few thoughts.... just for what they're worth (which might not be much!)


To be honest, the first thing that ran through my head when I read this was -your ds is probably not the only child in class who is bored. That doesn't mean he isn't the farthest ahead in IQ or achievement, just means that what you've described doesn't describe the typical 2nd grade classroom in my children's school district. I wonder if some of what your ds is experiencing is due to an unengaged teacher? I've had three kids go through second grade plus know a TON of kids over the years in early elementary and most crave the "why" discussion even if they aren't craving it at the level of HG kids. Please note - if it's an unengaged teacher, I'm not saying that your ds doesn't need a possible acceleration or grade skip, but I think it's important to have the data to back it up, and it's also important to thoroughly understand for your own insight what's going on in the classroom.


Another piece of data that would be handy to have is - how unusual is your dd's achievement? It sounds like you have a school situation that is highly geared toward teaching to standards, and that's the feedback you're getting. That doesn't mean that the vast majority of kids are at that level - there may be quite a few students who are where your dd is at (or beyond) or she might be the only one.

Another thing that happens with kids in early elementary - some of the kids who don't appear to be early readers catch up quickly by the time they're in first or second grade... so I think it's difficult to look at our kids reading levels in K or first grade and know for sure they will always be at the same place relative to their peers simply because reading development can be very scattered among their peers.


My 2nd grader is in a school that does this - if you feel like fighting the good fight, I'd advocate for the right to check out above-level books for *all* the kids in the school. The schools my other kids attended never had a policy like this - instead they had librarians and teachers who would help them find books that fit their level if they asked about it, and there was general oversight to help make sure very young children weren't accidentally checking out books that might be disturbing, and books were grouped generally into early vs later reading sections, but that was it. Any kid could check out any book.

FWIW, I haven't made waves at dd7's school that has this policy - at her school it's completely tied to making sure kids have what are considered age-appropriate books. I was pretty sure when I asked about the policy that it was set in stone and no amount of noise I made would make a difference. *However* my dd has successfully advocated for herself to check books out that are beyond her level - she finds the book, she takes it to the librarian, and she tells the librarian why she wants to check that particular book out and she explains that she's capable of reading it, and the librarian lets her check them out. Might not work with all librarians, but you could consider having your dd talk to her teacher or the librarian - they might listen to a child more than to a parent about it.

In the meantime, at home, let her read the books she wants to and that challenge her.

[/quote]Having spoken to a friend who works for the schoool, I've been told (off the record, of course) that skipping either of them will be virtually impossible, because the school needs their test scores at the end of the year to ensure proper funding.[/quote]

I wouldn't listen to just one person's opinion. That may be correct, or it may be completely uninformed. Take it as a data point for one person and focus on what you want for your kids. If you want to accelerate, gather your data, make a game plan, figure out who you need to present your advocacy to, and go for it.

If you want to, or need to do, something outside of acceleration, try to think of ways you can enhance the school experience. Would it be possible for you to volunteer in the school? Our kids have been in a school that didn't believe in acceleration but did welcome parents in the classroom to help differentiate - I volunteered in one of my kids' 2nd grade classrooms during creative writing - all I did was provide an extra person in the classroom to talk to kids about their ideas, get them excited about their writing, give them help with skills etc. I was working one on one with lots of different kids - that helped out both the gifted kids in the classroom and the kids who weren't gifted at writing. Another friend volunteered during math by pulling out the group of top math performers in the classroom for accelerated learning. My dh and I sponsored an after school science club for a few years. Another friend started an after-school Spanish program. These aren't suggestions that are going to help make the entire school day better for an EG kid who needs to be among peers, but they are positive things that can help fight boredom during at least a part of the day, and one thing I found in our school was that it was easier in general to advocate at school when we were seen as active involved parents working with the school.

Best wishes,

polarbear

The Iowa Scale is the textbook I was referring to- recognized this once I saw it referenced in Cricket2's post. I read the Amazon reviews and other reviews and it seems to be a very comprehensive guide on placement. Grade acceleration is a decision with serious consequences for your children. I think investing in this book and then following its guidelines on testing and placement would result in the best possible decision you could make. If you use the book and the school fights you on what placement you want, you can use the book as a reference tool to substantiate your request. The book is geared towards educators- so I think it would be difficult to argue about placement if you follow their recommendations. I believe the book will take you through an assessment of all areas of your children's lives so that every aspect is considered before you find the recommended placement.

This sounds a lot like DIBELS or some other equivalent. At our school which has a lot of kids from highly educated households and where most kids attended preschool, these are pretty typical scores. I've had three kids go through kindergarten, including a gifted dyslexic, who still scored very well on these tests. I've been told that they are only used to determine if kids are at grade level, which quite frankly is pretty darn low in kindergarten. They may help isolate problems but do not indicate advancement.

That said, I agree that something needs to change. Your kids are not being appropriately challenged in school. What has been the teacher's response? Have you asked him/her to intervene with the librarian? If the school is not responsive, I agree with others that you may need IQ and/or achievement testing to get the school to change their position.