Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Twice Exceptional I think DS8 is depressed.

DS8's been having so much trouble in school that the principal felt it necessary to call and talk today. For some reason she couldn't get a hold of me, so she spoke with my hubby. He was very upset and couldn't really relay what all she said very well. But he mentioned she felt he was depressed and talked of hating himself and wanting to die.

I feel like I need a magic wand for him! I don't know anymore what is going on with him. We were certain he was just ADHD, then we began to suspect he was also gifted. Now, I'm pretty sure he's gifted, but I'm not 100% about ADHD anymore.. maybe it's Asperger's? Maybe it's something else entirely?! I have no idea. I also feel like the school situation is making things a thousand times worse - he doesn't (feel like) he has any friends, he's bored nearly the whole day, I'm pretty sure his teacher is tired of dealing with him.

I am going to talk to my hubby about taking him to see Dr Lusby. She's been mentioned on here before - she can do a full neuropsych eval. The only downside is I have no idea how we would pay for that right now!

Epoh, I think the eval is a very good idea. The full workup will tell you the full picture and probably give you some insight on what to do next. It's especially urgent that you get some help **right away** for the "wanting to die" part-- those words should always be taken seriously.

On paying: talk to the neuropsych's office about this issue. They are likely to know: (1) what billing codes are accepted by your insurance, minimizing any out of pocket costs (2) any county or state funds that can be applied for to offset the cost of evaluation. Some neuropsychs have staff that work very hard to make sure they can serve families that need them.

In our county, there are specific funds for diagnostic work-- i.e. they won't pay for therapy, but they can be drawn on for the eval. Then there's separate money you can apply for that covers some of the therapy, for certain diagnoses.

HTH, hang in there,
DeeDee

DD6 has been saying some of the same things, and we have no reason to suspect any ADHD or autism spectrum disorders... she's a very empathetic and attentive kid. In her case, the full explanation is exactly as you described... she's bored at school, and she has difficulty relating to the other kids there.

Apparently a sleep shortage was also contributing, because we made a minor tweak to her nighttime schedule, and she's doing better.

Whenever a kid starts talking about wanting to die, a psychologist is a must. We enlisted one to help DD work on her coping skills, because she's so frustrated at the end of the day at school, she bottles it up to be a good girl, and then explodes when she gets home. He's also been useful as a resource for us to advocate for her. It doesn't hurt that he's well known to the school and trusted.

Over time (and a lot of advocating) things have improved marginally for her at school, but she's still something of a social outcast... she spends two hours a day as the only 1st grader in a 1st-3rd gifted class, so the other kids are significantly further along and she feels like the resident dummy, then spends the rest of the day in a normal 1st grade class where she's way beyond her age peers. She feels like an alien in both worlds.

One interesting discovery was that DD was resenting DW and I for putting her in first grade. She thought it was our fault. Finding out different has helped her quite a bit, because while she believed that, she must have felt completely alone. Now that she knows her parents have been in her corner all along, she takes comfort in that. You never know what goes on in these kids' head sometimes. I can't imagine how she came to the conclusion that we chose first grade for her... we started pushing for second the day we enrolled her.

We went through the same thing with our DS
Who is now an adult. He was clinically depressed in the second grade. We did not find out he was profoundly gifted until high school when he started a school
Where everyone worked at their own pace.

I agree with DeeDee, call the testers office. If they can't help perhaps they know someone who can. I know how upsetting it cAn be to have a child who is in misery but just hang in there and you will find a way to help him. Keep us posted.

Hugs,
Stargazer

It is good the principal shared her concerns and I hope you'll be able to get the evaluation.

While you are checking things off the list, I would also take him to the pediatrician for a check up too. It is a good idea to rule out physical causes as well.

If your child is expressing a desire to die, you should seek help sooner rather than later. Most insurances will cover the initial visit under these circumstances, and if the psychologist determines that IQ, Asperger's, etc. might be an issue, the screening and subsequent testing might be covered as discovery procedures to treat the depression.

We actually just had his yearly with his pediatrician, everything looks good there.

We stopped both the meds he was on starting last night. Tonight before bed he was having one of his exceptionally silly periods... Something I hadn't seen in at least two months! Here's hoping getting those meds out of his system lifts his mood!!

So, wow! We had a GOOD morning. No waking up growling and upset. He woke up in a perfectly good mood, took his shower, ate breakfast. The only time a voice was raised was when he yelled as his sister to get out of the bathroom when he was getting dressed.

I know the original issues are still there, but I am so happy to see my son be NORMAL (well, his personal version of normal)!!

Thanks - He says he has no friends, but I also hear stories about playing with the same group of boys pretty much every day at recess. More than once he's gotten upset because he thinks the other kids in class are laughing at him, when the teacher swears no one was even looking at him - they were just sitting at their desks not paying him any mind. I think a lot of that is negativity run amok in his over-active mind.

I've got him scheduled to take the WJIII on the 31st, and I'm waiting on a callback from a psychologist I found who appears to take our insurance and can do a full neuropsych eval. The waiting is hard though! Two weeks is a lifetime for him.

We've also had several talks with him about what makes him upset and what he wants and what would make him happy, etc. He's said before he wants to have friends and he wants to be 'normal.' He's smart enough to know that the things he does in school, especially, are not normal - specifically how upset he gets at little things, and his tantrums, but he doesn't seem to be able to control them much.

I've got a friend who lives about 45mins away who has a little boy only like 1 month younger than DS. The boys get along REALLY well, but we don't get together very often due to the drive. (Plus, she is not a confidant driver and as a result, hates driving and tries to limit it, so it's me driving to her for visits.) I am going to try plan visits with her more often so the boys can play. She also has a DD the same age as mine, so it really works out well, the boys play legos or video games and the girls run wild (lol) while we chat and have a drink. I think spending more one-on-one time with another boy his age (who is also wicked smart) who has similar interests will help.

Epoh, did you talk with the ped. before stopping the meds? Some meds are better weaned off than stopped suddenly. I would definitely recommend relying on expert advice for this sort of thing rather than tweaking on your own.

Now that he's feeling better, is he still having tantrums? Did the ped. have any suggestions about the tantrums/behavior issues?

DeeDee

We were told by the psychiatrist who prescribed them they could both be stopped without weaning.

He did still have a tantrum yesterday - but he was having them before we ever started meds. That's what led us to seek out a psychiatrist in the first place. However, the tantrums were different before than what they've been recently.

Our pediatrician referred us out when we brought up the behavior issues. It was clear to the Dr that his behavior wasn't just 'normal' kid stuff.

Epoh, I'm glad he's under the care of a psychiatrist-- puts my mind at ease about the meds. And I'm very glad you're getting the referral. It sounds like the right thing.

DeeDee

I think time with a peer will help and do encourage you to do the drive. Maybe your friend can help out in some other way to compensate for you doing more of the driving? Gas/Car Wear Money? Cook a few family meals that you can heat 'n serve to make the rest of the week go easier?

But I'm worried about the Tantrums - good for you for getting the evaluation appointment all set up - it's hard to wait! And one doesn't usually get an answer right away either - to make matters worse. In the meantime, I'd suggest reading
'Transforming the Difficult Child Workbook' by Lisa Bravo
so you can start 'accentuating the positive' and also giving him safe places to practice being 'in control' of his strong feelings.

Keep us posted!
Grinity

We have an appt with the psychologist! Sadly it isn't until May. But at least we are on the schedule. Our next appt with the counselor isn't until the 31st - hopefully she returns my voice mail soon and we can get him in quicker.

ETA: @DeeDee - None of the pediatricians at my kids dr office would prescribe these types of meds - they always refer out. I *heart* them so much!

Oh, it's really more just me not allowing myself to be lazy more than anything! The time/gas isn't an issue, my hubby and I just tend to be super lazy on the weekends when we aren't doing kids sports (we both have fairly stressful jobs) and we just need to stop that!



Thanks. I was actually looking through my bookshelf for something and saw a copy of Transforming the Difficult Child! I have no idea where it came from - I guess my husband? It sure hasn't been read yet, but it will be soon.

Just wanted to let you know you're not alone -- DS9 goes through the exact same thing, kind of in waves. He gets to a period where he just melts down at bedtime and says all of those things, and it just breaks my heart. I wish there were some kind of medication that I could take him off of to make it stop!

And my hubby just got a call from the asst principal. Apparently DS hasn't been doing his work for the past couple of days, hasn't been listening to the teacher, and today when she called the counselor to come get him (apparently the administrators were busy) he ran off from her. They finally got him into the asst principal's office and he was screaming and kicking the wall. Neither he nor the principal could calm him down. So now my husband has left work and is going to the school.

AAaaaaarg! Why have I not heard any of this from his teacher?!

DS has so many triggers it can be hard to keep track of them. And it seems to just depend. Sometimes it's like he can handle things, and other times, just the sight of something can send him over the edge.

Apparently this morning he was busy playing with an eraser and pencil, and then realized he had fallen behind with his work and then freaked out and started screaming and flailing his arms around, etc. The teacher then called the counselor. My husband went to the school and talked to him and calmed him down. DS said he could handle the rest of the day, etc. So they sent him back to class. He was fine during reading time, but after, when he went back to his desk and saw all the papers he'd missed while he was in the office, he freaked out. Apparently he started taking everything off his desk and dropping it on the floor and yelling.

*sigh* He freaks out about stuff at home, but it's like at school it's dialed up to 11. The school counselor recommended two places to my husband, he was under the impression they were schools, but when I looked them up they are out-patient psychiatric centers.

He hasn't had any IEP or 504 with the school. Up to this point we've always just worked with his teacher. Shortly before the holiday break she basically told us she was done trying to work with him and was just going to strictly follow the rule book... and here we are. I'm pretty annoyed/angry with her, but at the same time I can kind of understand. She's got 22 kids in her class, and she cannot spend any significant part of the day dealing with a single child.

The counselor at his school is pretty lame, sadly. We've spoken with her before, and she's super nice and clearly cares about our son (and all the kids) but I'm not sure she really has much experience dealing with kids with behavior problems.

The husband took DS into the psychiatrist we've been taking him to and he recommended a place that does full-on evaluations. We'll take DS there every day for 2 weeks instead of school. He'll have class there and will be monitored and evaluated during and also some sort of testing outside of that. We go tomorrow to talk to them and see what the deal is.

I'm emotionally all over the place right now. On one hand I want to rage and scream and insist there's nothing that wrong with DS, and yet at the same time I know in my head that there IS something wrong with DS, and I'm a little relieved he's going to get evaluated.

ETA: Off to look for that Xanex!

Let's hope she stopped 'going the extra mile' because she had a deep knowing that it was time to really look at what is going on with your son, and stop with the stop-gap measures. I have know idea if she is right about this or not, but school seems a very negative place for your son right now, and sometimes it is better ... time will tell.
Hopefully this will include the IQ and achievement test.
Hopefully the folks will have the open-mindedness to seek to understand the ramifications of those results
Time to read 'Misdiagnosis and Dual Diagnosis....'
http://books.google.com/books/about/Misdiagnosis_and_dual_diagnoses_of_gifte.html?id=NQrtt-peg5AC

here's a similar article -
http://www.sengifted.org/archives/a...nal-looking-beyond-psychiatric-diagnosis

take a look at
http://www.sengifted.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/SelectingAMentalHealthProfessional.pdf

I like the book Transforming, although I think the workbook is better organized...but I usually recommend the workbook because the version I read of Transforming was very anti-medication, which I think is too bad. Since you have Transforming, if possible I would recommend to read it, as long as you can keep yourself from feeling badly if you decide that medication is a thing to try for your family. Salt needed!

Love and More Love,
Grinity