Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Identification, Testing & Assessment Help Explain Discrepancy with Processing/Wechsler?

Hello,
I am new to the boards. I came on because I am very frustrated and looking for help. My DS is in third grade, 8 1/2 years old. When he was in first grade, almost 7, we had him tested because he was under-performing in public school and also not being selected for the reading pull-out that was offered. The head psychologist at the practice where he was tested mentioned a few months ago that there is a discrepancy with his scores, the processing speed is much lower than the others, and that he'd get back to me, but he never did. His third grade teacher just told me that he is rushing through his school work and not trying his best, that he is extremely bright but he needs to demonstrate this in his class work before he qualifies to be "pulled-out". Here are his scores on the Wechsler: Full Scale IQ- 141-99.7%; Verbal Comprehension Index - 138 IQ-99%; Perceptual Reasoning, 137-99%, Working Memory, 132-98%, PRocessing Speed Index, 118-88%. For the breakdown on Processing, he received for Coding a Scaled Score of 12 and Percentile of 75, and for Symbol Search, a Scaled Score of 14 and Percentile of 91. Does anyone out there know what could explain this discrepancy? We did find in first grade after he took this Wechsler that he had/has convergence insufficiency in his eyes (one eye gets tired and goes out) and have been working on this and it's much improved. Could there be some kind of learning disability to explain the low processing? Could someone elucidate this for me? Could it explain why he rushes through the class work and doesn't like to sit and read? Help?!?

IMHO that's a good processing speed - I personally would not describe it either as low, or as significantly discrepant from the other subscores.

As far as the rushing through work, I vote for 8-year-old-itis. My 8yo is the same way. It's possible the work feels so easy that they figure they don't need to devote any effort to it, and make careless errors.

My son is so upset that he isn't being pulled out with two kids from his class for reading enrichment with the differentiation specialist. When I asked the teacher she said he isn't doing his best work in class and needs to demonstrate his best work rather than expecting everyone to assume he is bright (before he will be pulled out)....But if the in-class work is too easy, then it's a Catch-22, right?!!? But does anyone sense something amiss with the 'low' processing speed score?

Welcome M2G. I agree with AMom, I don't think the PSI is that low. And if processing speed was an issue, I don't think he would be flying through his work?

Is his eye issue still causing problems? Has he had any accomodations for that or any academic accomodations?

Do you have any other testing like the Woodcock Johnson or NWEA MAP testing or the school assessments that would show he is an advanced reader?

I don't agree that he necessarily has to demonstrate his best work day in and day out (for over 3 years) before he gets work at his level and he has already proven that he is bright by having a FSIQ of 141. However, you may need some additional scores to get around this teacher? Or, do you think you can work with this teacher? Can you go over her head? If he does have achievement scores and they don't seem to match IQ, then I would wonder about some type of learning disability (and I would wonder why the school isn't wondering about that). Determining whether there is a learning disability would likely require further assessment.

Also, you mentioned that he doesn't like to sit and read. Do you think that is because what he is reading is not interesting or challenging? Or, could there possible be attention issues?

Gah, I hate that.

That said, "doing something stupid and pointless because it's important to someone with power over you" is a useful life skill. If there's a set, objectively-measurable threshold for getting the enrichment pullout (rather than a nebulous "I'll know it when I see it"), tell him exactly what he needs to do to earn the pullout, give him whatever support he needs to develop the skills to be able to choose to earn it, and let him make his own choices. If there's not (yet) an objectively-measurable threshold, sit down with the teacher and figure one out.

Your son's scores are close to my son's(8 1/2) except his processing speed is 109 and his PRI and VCI are a bit higher. His processing speed significantly affects his ability to perform "on command" or to succeed on timed tests at his regular academic level. Other than that, we haven't found a problem with it. It's frustrating to him that he's stuck doing timed multiplication facts tests at the same time as he's doing Pre-Algebra. If he has time to be deep and thoughtful, his work is fabulous.

I would assume he rushes through his classwork because it's not challenging enough. If he has a really meaty problem how does he do? Multiple steps like a hard math problem, an essay or science research?

I don't know because he hasn't had a really meaty problem as far as I can see. He is definitely not doing pre-algebra. Did you get acceleration in math for your son and if so, how? Based upon these test scores? What grade level is 'normally' pre-algebra? He never gets to do science research. Does your son attend public school?

On Woodcock Johnson he got 98% for Broad Reading, 97 for Reading Fluency, 98 for Passage Comprehension....He is a very active kid, very into sports, but he has lots of attention when he is playing chess, for example...and likes to listen to stories (have someone else read to him or a tape)...

What is your son's reading behavior like at home?

Was a new WISC done with the school psychologist? I would follow up immediately with the school psychologist, and set up a meeting with the teacher and the SP to discuss the pull out. (are those the old numbers or the new ones?)

If the teacher wants to use the pull out as a carrot, then it's just as effective to let him in 'as a trial basis' and give specific behaviors that she wants to see to keep him there. At the very least I would set up a behavior chart for your son to give the teacher so he can know what he is being judged on. Once she sees that you are serious, perhaps she's think that letting him in the enrichment group is easier than doing more paperwork. The key is to act polite and sincere and if if the teacher has his best interest at heart and not just on a power trip.

Best Wishes - this isn't easy!
Grinity

His teacher called me today and was very nice, though said the pull-out doesn't mean anything, and that she is challenging him in the class. That she allowed him to use a computer program to do a little project on one book, and that he liked that. Said she'd let him go with the differentiation person later in the year. Part of the problem is, I think, that there is no gifted program at the school. Just one differentiation person that meets with students of all different levels. There's no set 'gifted' policy, the school, no, the district, doesn't use that word. For math, a pre-test is taken and then the top-scoring kids go into two classrooms (of approx 20 each) while everyone else goes into the other four classes. But there's no differentiation beyond that for math (which is my son's strongest subject). There is a challenge homework sheet each night which isn't very challenging, so far.