Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy help with ammunition?

Hey there,

I'm looking for anything anyone can give me, advice or literature out there to reference.

My district is denying my kid acceptance to their gifted program. I've posted in here before about identification, but I don't have any question about her giftedness anymore.

Stats:

IQ (WPSSiii): full 141 verbal 143
processing was 125, which the ed psych told me was due to perfectionism

OLSAT: below 50% verbally, 80% math

CoGAT: 127 verbal, low in nonverbal and quantitative (The district doesn't actually give us the scores, but gives us a matrix with the scores represented. She didn't get points for wither of these areas, so I don't know the score, but that means under 90 percentile, I think.)

MAP Reading for beginning 2nd grade: 214 (99.9%)
MAP Math: 195 (92%)

Teacher evaluation: Highest points possible. Can not believe that she didn't test in. Wrote an appeal on her behalf.

Gifted specialist's evaluation: Can not believe that she didn't test in on the CoGAT. Says, "There are some kids who I can't wait to get the scores back on because I know they will be so high. She was one that I expected to be high." She says that my DD is so bright and does such a great job iwth inferential thinking and abstract thinking.

In house reading assessments: Tested the highest in her grade for three years. (This may not be so impressive, but I think that it's worth noting that even by local norms, she is ahead of her peers.)

So, the district still says, sorry, she is not "gifted" because of those lower CoGAT scores.

I inquired as to why they will not consider the private testing. The answer: "We want to be consistent and treat all of our students in a similar manner so they are all on the same 'playing field'." I find this repulsive. It implies that this is a competition. I don't care if every single kid in her class tested as high! Just give her the appropriate level of challenge and support.

The reality is that my daughter tested into a gifted school that we can not afford and I an wracked with guilt over it. She is a happy child overall, but she comes home from school in tears some days because it was so boring. I have seen the work. She's doing stuff that is painfully simple, even in math for her. She was reading at a higher level than what they are doing with her in class before she was in Kindergarten!

I also know that she REFUSES to be herself at school. The class looked at life cycles last year -- frogs, toads. She came home and said, "I want to write the life cycle of the pheonix." I told her to do it! I could see the little wheels moving and she said, "No. I don't want to bring it to school." She did a science fair project last year about what conducts electricity. We have a snap circuit kit and she had already mastered it on her own. She took the notes on her own and figured out a bunch about conductivity. She REFUSED to write up the report. I thought it was sort of cute, but I think that it's part of the socialization of a smart girl not wanting to be seen outside the norm. I don't want my kid in the gifted pogram to be ahead of anyone. I just don't want her to not be comfortable being smart!

1. If anyone is still reading, do you know anything about the levels of CoGAT? I've read that higher IQ kids need to be tested with a harder version of the test? Anyone know anything?

2. Do I appeal based on anecdotal evidence or do I bring in research about the unreliability of the CoGAT? I don't want to insult the people that I want something from, right? But, I think I could make a very strong case for the fact that they are doing a great deal wrong.

3. Anybody have any good research about girls hiding their giftedness? The interesting thing to me is that the two tests that she underperformed on were group tests. When she's on her own with the computer or a researcher, she's scoring very high.

4. Anyone with advice for dealing with upper administration who have never nor will ever set eyes on your child (and who are in the way of your kid receiving services even though every educator to run into her thus far tells you that she is clearly gifted)?

Thank you. I'm sorry to be so long winded.

Sally Reis has written a lot about gifted girls. You could start with this article. http://www.sengifted.org/articles_social/Reis_SocialAndEmotionalIssuesFacedByGiftedGirls.shtml

I don't have any ideas for your other questions, sorry. I haven't heard of outside testing not being accepted before. That doesn't make a lot of sense.

With those scores, a number of public schools around the country will let her in immediately. A lot of privates would as well and depending on your financial circumstances, she would get full tuition assistance.

You can expend all your energy advocating. So, another option is to move where you can expend your energy being the great parent you are.

We've been told by two PG kids parents to not do ANY school-based testing as they would use those scores for and against our son. You also have to make sure the school does not assess your kid on their own. Our private school recently assessed Mr W without telling us. The scores stay with them, but we've heard of some publics doing this as well.

All this stuff above is what the school needs to see. maybe she isn't gifted, maybe she doesn't belong in their Gifted Program, but they are professionals and there must be some way to solve this real problem your daughter is facing.

Is the Gifted Program even worth fighting for - (not if it's less than 3 hours a week, not really) but it sure isn't the only way to accommodate a kid who is academically strong. There are grade skips, subject accelerations, mentorships. Start asking for bigger fish, and maybe they'll try throwing you the gifted program bone to see if you'll be put off.

You can ask for partial homeschool where you do her favorite subject at home with her and she goes to the gifted specialist while the class does it and gets one to one with her 2nd favorite subject.

It's time to start asking for the moon, because I don't think a gifted program by itself is going to solve her problems.

And cry. This is super upsetting, and they won't care how much you know, until they know how much you care. Keep documenting and going up the chain of command until you find that ally. You need help! You need the school to do it's job, which is teaching your child, and giving her an opportunity to learn how to learn.

With MAP testing you can ask for her to be placed with kids (of any grade) who are at the same readiness level for Math or Reading, because all kids in every grade have the same chance to answer the hardest questions.

Love and More Love,
Grinity

Don't forget to apply to DYS!

http://www.davidsongifted.org/youngscholars/

Another idea is to send the IQ scores to Mensa. I suspect they will qualify. Then go back to the school with her Mensa acceptance letter! Although DYS ia a great program, we have found that no one here has heard of it- but they have heard of Mensa.
How can they not accept a kid into the gifted program who is a Mensa member?

THANK YOU! I have yet to act, but am going to. I'm still getting my ducks in a row. I really appreciate the friendliness and good advice though.

How old was she when the wpsii was completed? Scores from under 6 are generally not as reliable.

From the scores you listed (other then the wpsii), they are all above average but not necessarily gifted. The MAP scores fall (on the 2011 norms) math 88th percentile and reading 98th percentile for fall second grade.

My dd has very similar MAP (just switch the math and reading scores) and CogAT scores as yours. She didn't qualify for district GERT either. I will say in our district, its not even worth fighting for the one hour a week pullout. She IS receiving acceleration in math (in class push in to third grade math) and language arts. Guided reading is used here so she gets that on level.