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    Joined: Aug 2010
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    Just curious about the mechanics of this. DD is at a new school where I think they will make a good effort to get her reading books on the right level. However, she has two tendencies that I wonder about in terms of how they affect reading level determination: 1) she sometimes skips or changes small and unimportant words, though not in any way that affects the sense of the text, and 2)she mispronounces difficult words sometimes, even when she knows what they mean. So let's says she reads a page of a text and skips two words and mispronounces two others--is the text then considered too hard? Do they ask comprehension questions? Is it all scored strictly by the rules or is there wiggle room?

    Last edited by ultramarina; 08/24/11 11:40 AM.
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    I'd say that reading assessments vary widely by district. For instance, our school district uses three different assessments, each up to three times a year: MAP testing, DIBELS testing, and Running Reading Records. MAP testing asks comprehension questions and vocabulary questions, but also requires students to know the meaning of words like "synonym," "antonym," "homonym," and "homophone" when answering comprehension questions. DIBELS testing, as I understand it, is primarily about fluency and accuracy, and is done with a student reading directly to a proctor of some sort. And Running Reading Records involve the student reading directly to a teacher with the teacher, subjectively, recording accuracy and the student's ability to answer questions about the test.

    So, IME, a student's reading level as tested in school can be an inaccurate measure of what a child is actually reading, understanding, and enjoying outside of school. I know this definitely happened to a couple of my kids. And, btw, I remember hearing somewhere that's it's a pretty common thing for advanced readers to substitute similar words or to skip over some less important words when reading for pleasure. Perhaps for school purposes it's better to be 100% accurate and fast, but in real life, maybe not quite as much.


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    I'm not an expert, but I can tell you what I've observed. Our schools test with DRA and Lexile. Lexile scores (at our schools) are done on a computer only in the upper grades and seems to be about reading comprehension. There's no reading out loud, so any issue with misprounciation or skipping words shouldn't be a problem. DRA testing is used in all grades. Changing/skipping/mispronouncing are tallied, the reading out loud is timed, the child has to orally answer comprehension questions, and - at higher levels - the child has to write answers to comprehension questions. (My dysgraphic ds is allowed to do this part orally per his IEP.) All of that info is compared to charts. A child is at a given level if he/she reads the passage without going over the allotted number of mistakes or time, while proving he/she understands what was read. IMHO, it's somewhat subjective, with some teachers rigidly following the rules and others letting things slide. Also, when teachers make up reading groups, they may include more than one level in a group because they don't have enough kids reading at a particular level to constitute a group.

    When they talk about "just right" books, a lot of times that's more than reading level. My ds, for example, would not enjoy a book about princesses and unicorns whether it's on his reading level or not. Usually, to help a child pick a just right book, they teach the kids to look at the book (covers, blurb) and see if they're interested in reading it. Then, they have them read a page. If there are 5 or more troublesome words, it's too hard. If the child is making the judgement about troublesome words, mispronouncing wouldn't make any difference. If the teacher is listening, misprounounciations would possibly count against them. Usually, if the teacher is listening, the child is picking books that are too hard.

    Hope that helps.

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    My general feeling is that if she voluntarily reads a book all the way through in her spare time, it probably isn't too hard for her. (Some such books are likely too easy, while others are at a level where she's running into new words and hopefully, learning.) I guess it's not that simple, though. I know she will put books aside that she isn't really clicking with or following.

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    Errors such as the ones you describe would be tallied in any of the assessments that involve reading out loud while a teacher takes a running record. In order for a text to be at an instructional or independent level, a student would have to pass both the decoding/fluency and the comprehension questions. If a student scores too low on either portion, that is considered the frustration level and testing would stop.

    If you feel that the level is not reflective of your child's reading, you might ask whether she frustrated on the decoding or on the comprehension. If it was on the decoding, you could direct your specific questions to the teacher--a running record will mark the specific errors and will include any substitutions she made.

    Something to keep in mind re: the comprehension. On many of the oral assessments, the student is not allowed to refer back to the passage. IMO, this can be misleading since some questions are recall of specific picky details and do not really reflect general level of understanding. Students who are quick silent readers sometimes struggle more because reading out loud forces them to process the text too slowly.

    Different teachers/schools recognize and accommodate these quirks differently. If you are seeing a mismatch between reported level and functional skills, you might request that they allow her to read the text silently and do the running record after she's answered the questions (she still gets the same number of reads as other students, but is able to process the text at a speed that works for her).

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    Thanks! I don't actually have any test results back. Her new school has her read aloud to me 20 min a night as homework, so it's just that I am noticing the errors she makes and wondering what they mean for assigning reading level. (Normally I only hear her read aloud to her younger brother, so that's generally picture books. It's sort of new to hear her read aloud at her level.) The skipping words one I think is because she skims ahead. She reads with awesome expression and verve and gets into that part of it, and I think it means reduced attention to detail sometimes. I don't know if she skips words when reading silently. She likes to take the book quizzes on this site: http://www.bookadventure.com/, which features those annoying tiny-detail questions ("What color was Jennifer's sweater in chapter 2?) and generally scores 9/10 or 10/10 without referring back, on books I consider at her level (about 5th/6th grade). However, these books would contain probably 2-3 words per page she'd stumble on in terms of pronunciation.

    She does now attend a gifted school so hopefully they will be pretty familiar with how to assess kids who are strong readers.

    Last edited by ultramarina; 08/26/11 06:07 AM.
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    Originally Posted by mnmom23
    So, IME, a student's reading level as tested in school can be an inaccurate measure of what a child is actually reading, understanding, and enjoying outside of school.

    I think interest level is your most important indicator. What does your child choose to read and stick with? When my oldest was in school, it became my responsibility to keep him in books. The school "assessed" him at the same reading level all year as a 1st grader. Found out later that particular level (4th grade) is just at the ceiling of what the teacher could deal with. He was selecting reading material above that level at the beginning of the year. If the number doesn't reflect what you expect, don't panic. You may want to keep a list of what your child is reading at home or ask if you can send in reading material.

    My oldest is just not the best at jumping through the hoop of reading assessment/comprehension. That is a skill he actually could practice - he assesses well above his grade level, but not where we'd expect. He also would do similar things when he was younger like mixing up short words and mispronouncing longer words even when he knew what they meant. He still will do that on occasion. I can tell when he is using vocab he learned reading. grin

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    I just got a lexile score for my 6th grader. His range was 1526-1676 and his RIT score was 257 (btw this is in MD). It looks like this is pretty good, but what worries me is that he had the exact same score last year in 5th grade. In other words it seems like he is stagnating... How reasonable is it to expect year over year increases at this level? He is a voracious reader and reads (or re-reads if he is particularly fond of a book) probably a book a day (maybe more). He currently is into Enders Game etc. (btw is that appropriate it appears there is a fair amount of violence it these books) Thanks in advance.

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    Hi Marisa,

    I read just the other day (and I wish I could think where so I could link to it for you) that Lexile stops being very useful as a measure once it hits those mid 1000s (just because by that point they're basically reading at an adult level). I don 't know anything about RIT so unfortunately I can't comment on that.

    My daughter is only 5 so I don't know the books you mentioned, but I guess if he is not concerned by them, but you are a little, perhaps you could just have a chat with him about the violence in it and its appropriateness in the context of the book vs the real world? I tend to think your gut instinct is a pretty good measure in these kinds of situations so if you're more than just a little concerned maybe suggest he put them aside for now? I feel your pain - finding appropriate books to match both dd's reading level, and yet also what she can cope with emotionally, is an endless struggle in our house.

    No doubt someone more knowledgeable in these areas will come along shortly!

    Last edited by Giftodd; 10/26/11 12:13 PM.

    "If children have interest, then education will follow" - Arthur C Clarke
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    Originally Posted by Marisa
    I just got a lexile score for my 6th grader. His range was 1526-1676 and his RIT score was 257 (btw this is in MD). It looks like this is pretty good, but what worries me is that he had the exact same score last year in 5th grade. In other words it seems like he is stagnating... How reasonable is it to expect year over year increases at this level? He is a voracious reader and reads (or re-reads if he is particularly fond of a book) probably a book a day (maybe more). He currently is into Enders Game etc. (btw is that appropriate it appears there is a fair amount of violence it these books) Thanks in advance.

    It is not reasonable to expect year over year increases at this level. Your child is testing near the limit of the test. Has your child participated in any of the talent searches? With a MAP score like that, qualifying should be a breeze. Is the school doing appropriate acceleration for your child?

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