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Joined: Apr 2011
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Chicken or egg?
My eldest DD, 9yrs old, is mildly, or perhaps moderately gifted, with diagnosed retained reflexes, sensory issues, CAPD and as yet undiagnosed dyslexia and inattentive ADHD.
I have known about DDs retained reflexes for 2 years but I had not really understood the possible import of them until, well, today.
I am wondering what more experienced members thoughts are with regard to the significance of retained MORO, ATNR and STNR reflexes (the report does not say whether they are mildly or strongly present). The OT report noting these doesn't mention much more than that they are retained, indicating nervous system immaturity. There was so much else in the report that we thought "well that explains why she wouldn't sleep" and then we focused on other things... There was plenty to focus on and I had hypermisis at the time..
But a bit of googling today reveals multiple different sources all suggesting these reflexes when retained create a picture that looks just like my DD. I am just wondering why though, if that is the case, more wasn't made of them at the time? And why didn't the neuro psych we saw today know anything about retained reflexes (and he was otherwise very up on every other issue I raised)? What is the likelihood of fully integrating these reflexes and what is the likelihood of that appreciably reducing dyslexia/CAPD/ADHD type issues? Are retained reflexes really causal or are they co-morbid?
We are currently considering a course of neurotherapy for DD and I am wondering do we try to re-mediate the reflexes first, if so how, or do we consider that the neurotherapy may help integrate the reflexes?
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Joined: Dec 2005
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I have often wondered about this myself, especially after hearing dire warning that 'crawling is a developmentally necessary stage!!!!' I have no reason to think that my intuition is correct, but since you asked - I think it's comorbid in all, and causative in some! I think you have to try a few different things and see what works for your kid (sorry!) I've been curious about: Pedagogical eurythmy
When the first Waldorf School was founded in 1919, Eurythmy was included in the curriculum.[9] It was quickly recognized as a successful complement to gymnastics in the school's movement program and is now taught in most Waldorf schools, as well as in many non-Waldorf pre-school centers, kindergartens and schools. Its purpose is to awaken and strengthen the expressive capacities of children through movement, stimulating the child to bring imagination, ideation and conceptualization to the point where they can manifest these as "vital, moving forms" in physical space.[2]
Eurythmy pedagogical exercises begin with the straight line and curve and proceed through successively more complicated geometric figures and choreographed forms, developing a child's coordination and concentration. An extensive set of special exercises has also been developed for pedagogical purposes.[2] These include many geometric or dynamic movements (such as form metamorphoses), exercises with (usually copper) rods to develop precision in movement and expand the experience of space, and exercises with (usually copper) balls to objectify the movement experience.
There are post-graduate trainings for eurythmy teachers; however, pedagogical trainings are increasingly being incorporated into many colleges of eurythmy.
[edit]Therapeutic eurythmy
Eurythmy is used therapeutically, normally on the advice of a physician, to compensate for somatic or psychological imbalances; the aim is to strengthen the organism's salutogenic capacity to heal itself.[10] Case studies suggest that therapeutic eurythmy may be helpful for children with attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD).[11]
There are post-graduate trainings in the therapeutic use of eurythmy. But we went the Occupational Therapy route and saw lots of improvement over time....I don't think DS had retained reflexes, just generally floppiness, and to aware of possible dangers for his own good. Best Wishes, Grinity
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MumofThree,
Who does "neurotherapy"?
If an organization claims to offer fixes for a large number of disorders (ADHD and retained reflexes and autism and processing disorders and and and), usually they are selling snake oil. If there was an easy fix for these things, the neurologist would have told you so. There are lots of these outfits out there now.
I think skepticism about what's on offer is in your DD's best interest.
DeeDee
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Thanks Grinity! I have often wondered about this myself, especially after hearing dire warning that 'crawling is a developmentally necessary stage!!!!' Mmm, yes well I had heard this prior to my DD not crawling. And yet I still, oh so naively, told myself "It's not that she can't, it's just that she doesn't want to because she doesn't like hitting her head! That, and she likes to see where she is going and to be able to carry with her hands while she moves." All of which was true. But retrospectively I know she has trouble crossing the midline, so either she couldn't cross crawl or her failure to do so has caused problems down the track. So when my youngest started "crawling" with a symmetrical drag that looked more like a sea lion heading for water than a baby crossing the floor I had her into OT quick smart. We saw the OT at 6 months and he agreed with me that she was days from getting up and walking, but I got her cross crawling within that week and then she crawled for over 6 months. She was very, VERY like my eldest but now I think their developmental paths are diverging. In a good way. And at least in part because of the crawling.
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A Neuropsychologist provides neurotherapy. They aren't claiming to cure all things! I think something must have come out wrong in my post there. The neurotherapy we would be considering for ADHD. I am wondering if we should separately be trying to address the retained reflexes first, and how likely that is to be effective.
We are considering trying the Cellfield program for the dyslexia, but not until after various other things and only if it still seems necessary...
So yeah, no one stop shop easy fix.
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All of which was true. But retrospectively I know she has trouble crossing the midline, so either she couldn't cross crawl or her failure to do so has caused problems down the track. DS did crawl eventually, for a bit, but crossing the midline was an issue later in OT/PT. He was on the swim team for 2 years and I saw a big boost in general coordination after that. Lots of crossing the midline while swimming!
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Make sure that you get an audiology exam. The hearing screening at the pediatrician's is inadequate to pick up many hearing losses. Hearing loss causes ADD/ADHD (or contributes to it) and CAPD.
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Grinity - She's going back to the OT tomorrow for a re-evaluation. So it will be interesting to see what a big improvement in her swimming and piano have done for her.
Jack's mum - thanks for that suggestion, her hearing is abnormally good, particularly in the lower register, and was last checked a month ago by the audiologist who diagnosed the CAPD. The auditory OT, who picked up the extent of what she could hear in the lower register, suggested that hearing so much more low noise than other people might be contributing to her inability to distinguish what she is actually supposed to listen to.
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Grinity - She's going back to the OT tomorrow for a re-evaluation. So it will be interesting to see what a big improvement in her swimming and piano have done for her. Good luck tomorrow. Also got me thinking about depth perception. DS's was 'slow to develop' I'm not sure if this is normal, but when he was little I would try to 'play catch' with a koosh or other specially designed ball. It would always end with me throwing it and smacking him in the middle of the forehead. Is that normal in a toddler? If I had known then what I know now, I wouldn't have given up, but it was so discouraging! Later, DS got 'interested' in a schoolyard game called 'wall ball' which involved pink balls, and well, a wall. He basically cured himself of his late to mature low depth perception in one year of intense play. Good luck, Grinity
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My younger child (3y4m) was diagnosed with retained reflexes at one point. He also has benign hypotonia that has improved greatly, but is still present. He was also diagnosed with failure to thrive as an infant, with very low oral motor tone that contributed to nursing issues. He actually still has head lag, something that should disappear in infancy.
They were really freaked about him when he was tiny--we had an MRI, tests for muscular dystrophy, CP was considered...but he seems to be fine now. In fact, he appears far more neurotypical than his sister, who has looked SPD-ish, ASD-ish, and ADHD-ish in her time, and has met all his milestones and then some despite a slow start (didn't sit alone till 9 months or crawl till 11 months; we had him in PT till age 1ish).
I don't know what the deal is with these odd signs of his and I suspect we never will, though there is a family history of "floppiness." I do notice that there seems to be a strangely high # of gifted kids with hypotonia.
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