Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums General Discussion New . . . need guidance please?!

I will preface this with the fact that I am a teacher in my son's school district. He does, however, attend Kindergarten at a school different from the one where I teach. This was our choice based on his needs and one that we've been very comfortable with so far. Being a teacher, I feel like I might be worried more about all sides of this "issue" than I need to be, however that is my reality and we all know how hard it can be to "turn off" worries . . . right?!

My son is 6 and 11 days away from finishing Kindergarten. He entered Kindergarten a strong reader (had been for quite some time) and has always been called "mature" . . . "smart" . . . "a quick learner". My husband and I always felt like these things were true, but we really had no idea where he was in terms of our district Kinder curriculum, etc.

He took the NWEA MAP tests last week and today. His scores are above the 99% for both reading and math. (both reading and math RIT scores were 193)

I'm suddenly feeling presented with a huge responsibility. I know it was there before, however I feel like now that we have more knowledge of his skills and abilities, I need to move to ensure that his needs are met next year. This year has wasn't particularly challenged. He has read different "take home" books than his peers, had a self-created spelling list, etc., however no true accelerated or even more challenging curriculum of any sort. This is a short-coming in our district and I feel it as a teacher . . . now I am feeling it as a parent as well. I know how hard *I* work to differentiate appropriately for all of my students, including my more accelerated learners, and I also know that not all teachers do that . . . unfortunately.

So I guess I'm looking for suggestions about where to go from here. I really want to have a conversation with his school principal about our expectations for next year (differentiation, etc.), but I guess I'm looking for suggestions about what to ask, how to guide that conversation, and even what to expect as a parent. I know intermediate levels well, primary grades are a different world in a lot of ways!

He reads chapter books that my fourth graders read. He is constantly thinking and talking, asking questions, never settling for an easy answer. He is very well behaved, especially in school, and I fear that he'll sit back and do what he is told, while never really pushing himself or asking to be pushed. Obviously then, especially at this age, it is my responsibility as his parent to help make sure that happens. We also challenge him at home, but I work hard to find a balance between "fun and being a kid" and "challenging him to grow" in every way too.

I'm rambling. Really I just need someone to help me think this through, figure out what to ask for from his principal / first grade teacher, and maybe even tell me whether I need to 'worry' or 'push' with this scores or just relax and see what happens when they take the NWEA test in the fall. I just really don't want his time in school to be a waste.

Help?! Many, many thanks if you got this far!

Welcome! Let me start by saying that I'm not familiar with the US system and I'm sure someone who is will be along in a minute... However, a quick google took me to this report and if it's relevant and I'm reading it right, your DS is not only above the 99th percentile for K, he's also up there (90s, anyway, depending on exactly which table you read) for end-of-1st graders (and still looking pretty good compared against 2nd graders come to that). Of course what you really want to know is what the 1st graders at his school are getting; but if he's really already mastered the reading and maths they're expecting him to learn in 1st grade, it's possible that a grade skip is more workable than differentiation (where it's easy to promise, and hard to deliver, as you know). How's his writing? That's often the limiting factor.

I agree with Collins Mom. Are there kids at the school with subject accelerations (go to a room with older kids for a subject or two) or full grade skips at your school? As a teacher you know that half the fun of school is having a handful of kids to compete with. The other half is learning stuff that is new enough to be challenging so one can slowly develop good work ethic about new challenges.

Certainly kindy isn't supposed to be hugely mental heavy lifting but you can see already that you child has fallen a little bit behind in getting his toe wet in experiencing the normal amount of learning struggle.

How you get your child with learning peers and in rooms where his-level learning challenges are offered is another story. There are several options that you can explore with your school. But the first thing to do is to ask for help in evaluating the magnitude of the problem.

How? Schools will often administer WISC IQ test to see try and measure if you child is advanced in a temporary way because of the extra work you have done at home or some unconsious teaching you have done at home or if yor son was built that way at 'the baby factory.' If the schools won't, you should pay out of pocket so you can gain a professional ally who can help you talk over your options. This can help relieve the 'round and round and round we go' that can preoccupy a mommie's brain.

((BTW - I'm not getting the idea that you've been hanging over the crib with flashcards at all. I'm not for or against what get's called 'hothousing.' It depends on the circumstances. I'm just thinking that you want to get a picture of your child's 'factory defaults' and a child who figures out reading totally unassisted probably has different learning needs than a preschooler who could be taught to read with much prompting.))

How else can the school help you evaluate the magnitude of your problem? At your school, does MAP testing service provide information about what an individual student would be expected to need to learn next based on the questions wrong on the MAP? If not, then request this info from MAP. You compare this info to the scope and sequence for various grade levels to see where the challenging learning might be and where the peers might be. You can also ask to see MAP results for other classrooms with names blacked out. Where would your child need to be sitting for math and reading so that he could have a handful of academic peers and in the sites of where the teacher is aiming to provide instruction.

The point is to use the resources flexibly so your son can learn at school and play at home.

Welcome...So glad you are here. How did you find us?

Smiles
Grinity

The only difference in PMAP and MAP is the headphones. There is no ceiling. I think the difference you see in the scores tends to be the gifted kids tend to like reading to themselves and working at their own pace better. For non gifties there tends to be a drop in their scores when they switch.. the opposite for gifties. IN PMAP the questions do get harder, just as MAP, when the questions are answered correctly. The more correct the more test questions there will be.

wow - I am so glad to hear that. Those MAP people are amazing!

Take a look at this site.

http://www.educationaloptions.com/

I'd do a lot of reading first, and get your son tested by a specialist in the field who can give you advice. All before you approach the schools. A lot of people on here love DYS, too.

We read the entire forum and did a lot of reading and talking to people. It has helped a lot to prepare us for getting the best for our son.

Many thanks for your thoughts! I plan on talking with a first grade teacher at my school tomorrow and am going to take it from there.

I'm sure I'll be back with another 3289 questions.

I would recommend achievement testing for your son. If the test results come back showing that your son is functioning several grade levels ahead of where he is supposed to be by age, then skipping becomes a much easier option to consider.

Something that has helped me enormously is to educate myself regarding all of the legislation in place in my state regarding gifted education and what's allowed. I've yet to find a principal that knows the laws and statuates better than I do. Often the administration is afraid to make a decision as they aren't clear what is allowed. When they understand that what you are asking for is within their ability and scope, it makes life easier.

Get the elementary standards for your state and turn it into a checklist. What does he know and what does he still need to learn? Start in first grade and work your way up through the grades until your son would have things to learn.

Be willing to agree to trial periods for any acceleration, subject or full grade skip. Explain to your son that it's a "test drive" to see how it feels. It gives you an easy out if the fit isn't what it should be.

Get a copy of the Iowa Acceleration Scale and go through it. The IAS takes all of the emotion out of the compatability of your son and a grade skip. Emotions often make it hard to make any choice, let alone the right one.

Ask thousands of questions, digest, ask thousands more!

Last but not least, flexibility is the key to sanity! Be willing to re-assess any time you feel like the situation isn't working. There is definitely no roadmap for these wonderful little people. Even in a population as small as this group represents, there is no one right way.

I'm glad you found us, it's an interesting road to travel!

Just wanted to clarify for the OP- there is a ceiling on PMAP/MAP testing :-) It is just way out there so you don't really need to worry about your K student hitting it just yet. The reading ceiling is somewhere near 260 I've been told by our school and this makes sense because 99th percentile for 11th grade is 252 in the national norms. Math supposedly stops at 280 according to our school.

I've been told by others outside our school that all the tests go to 300 but it seems like the ceiling is 11th grade either way. Growth goals get smaller as the scores get higher. You would expect a 1st grader to make larger gains in a year, score wise, than an 8th grader.

Welcome! You've gotten some really great advice about achievement testing and getting a copy of the IAS. We were able to use our son's MAP scores to get a full skip last year and it was by far the best thing we could have done for him. His MAP scores were in the 96-99th percentile for the next grade up so it was an easy discussion to have.