Gifted Bulletin Board

Welcome to the Gifted Issues Discussion Forum.

We invite you to share your experiences and to post information about advocacy, research and other gifted education issues on this free public discussion forum.
CLICK HERE to Log In. Click here for the Board Rules.

Links
DITD Logo

Learn about the Davidson Academy’s online campus for profoundly gifted students living anywhere in the U.S.

The Davidson Institute for Talent Development is a national nonprofit dedicated to supporting profoundly gifted students through the following programs:

  • Davidson Fellows Scholarship
  • Davidson Young Scholars
  • Davidson Academy
  • THINK Summer Institute
  • DITD FaceBook   DITD Twitter   DITD YouTube
    The Davidson Institute is on Facebook, Twitter and YouTube!

    How gifted-friendly is
    your state?

    Subscribe to the Davidson Institute's eNews-Update

    Who's Online
    0 registered (), 0 Guests and 86 Spiders online.
    Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
    Newest Members
    Clara Tim, markhogue, John Henderson, wm97, oliviazimmerman
    10844 Registered Users
    October
    Su M Tu W Th F Sa
    1 2 3
    4 5 6 7 8 9 10
    11 12 13 14 15 16 17
    18 19 20 21 22 23 24
    25 26 27 28 29 30 31
    Page 2 of 3 < 1 2 3 >
    Topic Options
    #177431 - 12/17/13 07:09 AM Re: Teacher conf tomorrow- 3rd grade advice/advocacy [Re: Johanna]
    Sweetie Offline
    Member

    Registered: 06/05/11
    Posts: 669
    Oh and same goes for below level...if they are just modifying or accommodating a little bit as the IEP dictates or 504 plan or as part of RTI but the majority of instruction is on level usually that is marked "on level with modifications/accommodations". If the student is getting instruction, work and assessment below level every day then it is marked below level.


    Edited by Sweetie (12/17/13 07:10 AM)
    _________________________
    ...reading is pleasure, not just something teachers make you do in school.~B. Cleary

    Top
    #177448 - 12/17/13 11:08 AM Re: Teacher conf tomorrow- 3rd grade advice/advocacy [Re: Johanna]
    ElizabethN Offline
    Member

    Registered: 02/17/12
    Posts: 1390
    Loc: Seattle area
    The party line in our school district is that the kids are graded against the teacher's expectations for them. So if she is performing as well as the teacher thinks she possibly can, she gets a 3. If she were performing better than that, well, the teacher would have higher expectations of her, and she would still get a 3.

    Top
    #177450 - 12/17/13 11:19 AM Re: Teacher conf tomorrow- 3rd grade advice/advocacy [Re: ElizabethN]
    doubtfulguest Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/15/13
    Posts: 429
    Originally Posted By: ElizabethN
    The party line in our school district is that the kids are graded against the teacher's expectations for them. So if she is performing as well as the teacher thinks she possibly can, she gets a 3. If she were performing better than that, well, the teacher would have higher expectations of her, and she would still get a 3.


    yikes - that would be a one-way ticket to apathy for my kid...
    _________________________
    Every Sunday it brooded and lay on the floor. Inconveniently close to the drawing-room door.

    Top
    #177482 - 12/17/13 03:58 PM Re: Teacher conf tomorrow- 3rd grade advice/advocacy [Re: doubtfulguest]
    indigo Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/27/13
    Posts: 4292
    Originally Posted By: ElizabethN
    The party line in our school district is that the kids are graded against the teacher's expectations for them. So if she is performing as well as the teacher thinks she possibly can, she gets a 3. If she were performing better than that, well, the teacher would have higher expectations of her, and she would still get a 3.
    To state the obvious, this is highly subjective. A more objective means is needed for communicating how much of the standards or objectives for the grade level the student has mastered, whether the curriculum and learning environment have resulted in incremental progress/growth (or stagnation), and identifying the appropriate curriculum placement to facilitate growth.

    It sounds like an indefensibly un-informative grading system. How do they explain it? Do they cite a research study or empirical evidence which has named this as best practice?

    Top
    #177484 - 12/17/13 04:28 PM Re: Teacher conf tomorrow- 3rd grade advice/advocacy [Re: Johanna]
    Loy58 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/11/13
    Posts: 816
    I was as grade-conscious as they come when I was in school, but DD's "3s" in 3rd grade (she has quite a few 4s, too) for the first part of the school year are not bothering me one bit. Grades are subjective and as others have pointed out, teachers often like to leave "room for growth" in the first grading period, even if your child is above average.

    DD8 also had very high MAP and CogAT scores. Her primary teacher feels she "pushes herself" and goes "above and beyond" and that means more to me than the small number grades. DD also got some 3s on her report card, and I am not even certain she is being appropriately challenged at school. Still, these are not grades for college (nor will they particularly count for anything in the long run), and I think it is actually GOOD for DD to feel she might need to WORK for 4s in some areas (penmanship, effort in gym wink ).

    Oddly (for me, the former uber-grade-conscious student), the 3s are not a worry at all. It sounds like your DD is doing extremely well, and I would just bet those 3s will become 4s in future semesters.

    How did the meeting go?

    Top
    #177492 - 12/17/13 06:46 PM Re: Teacher conf tomorrow- 3rd grade advice/advocacy [Re: Johanna]
    indigo Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/27/13
    Posts: 4292
    I share the OP's concern. Another poster once described that their child's interim grades at an online school could not be calculated as the term progressed: The school's grading algorithms were not programmed to compare points earned to-date to possible point values of assignments for material covered to-date. This precluded the computation of grades until the term was complete.

    This masks measurements and denies the child the opportunity to have information they may need to fully take ownership of their education... for example acquiring skill in time management and prioritizing:
    Which subject(s) may require more effort and attention?
    Which subject(s) have they mastered allowing them to shift study time to the subject(s) where it is most needed?

    Similarly, giving children a grade of "3" (proficient) when they may be working above and beyond seems to be a discrepancy in the feedback provided, masking the truth. The recorded grades and the grading system need to be trustworthy in order to be trusted. Trust may be an underlying issue: Expressing concern about grades may be a proxy for expressing concern regarding the trustworthiness of the system.

    Originally Posted By: Loy58
    ... these are not grades for college (nor will they particularly count for anything in the long run)...
    It is my understanding that student data is being amassed in longitudinal data systems. Grading practices described in this thread seem to indicate that what is recorded may not reflect student learning, and may be arbitrary at best.

    Top
    #177500 - 12/17/13 08:18 PM Re: Teacher conf tomorrow- 3rd grade advice/advocacy [Re: Johanna]
    ultramarina Offline
    Member

    Registered: 08/24/10
    Posts: 3423
    FWIW, my child is in 4th grade at a gifted magnet and gets and has gotten straight As from the start. AFAIK, these are based entirely on tests, assignments, and HW--the teachers give out the calculations, like in a college class, occasionally. We did experience the "meets expectations" going up to "surpasses expectations" phenom at her previous school.

    DS5 is in K and is getting the "meets expectations" grades.

    Top
    #177502 - 12/17/13 08:27 PM Re: Teacher conf tomorrow- 3rd grade advice/advocacy [Re: Johanna]
    Mk13 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 07/20/12
    Posts: 761
    I don't look at them as "grades" anymore. It has everything to do with how the child is doing in terms of common core standards but nothing to do with how the child is actually doing on a daily basis on assignments, tests, homework, class work. The only grading system that has any meaning to me is the one where I get rewarded for the work ... on the spot. There is no motivation for me (and my child) in doing my best job, completing 100% correctly and still only get 3 on a 4 point grading scale.

    Top
    #177509 - 12/17/13 08:56 PM Re: Teacher conf tomorrow- 3rd grade advice/advocacy [Re: Mk13]
    indigo Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/27/13
    Posts: 4292
    Originally Posted By: Mk13
    There is no motivation for me (and my child) in doing my best job, completing 100% correctly and still only get 3 on a 4 point grading scale.
    Unfortunately, the powers-that-be are counting on that. They did their research, knew their desired outcome, and chose results among several studies to attempt to illicit their desired response on a broad scale. One antidote may be for parents to keep accurate grade records, copies of test scores, and a portfolio of student work at home. An electronic spreadsheet may prove helpful. Bolster and motivate. Fight the urge to slip into complacency.

    ETA: Interested parents may wish to review research related to "locus of control".


    Edited by indigo (12/18/13 07:05 AM)
    Edit Reason: ETA: locus of control

    Top
    #177512 - 12/17/13 09:04 PM Re: Teacher conf tomorrow- 3rd grade advice/advocacy [Re: ultramarina]
    indigo Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/27/13
    Posts: 4292
    Originally Posted By: ultramarina
    ... straight As ... based entirely on tests, assignments, and HW--the teachers give out the calculations, like in a college class, occasionally.
    So glad to hear there is still some grading which is supported by measured results. smile

    Top
    Page 2 of 3 < 1 2 3 >


    Moderator:  M-Moderator, Mark D. 
    Recent Posts
    The Politics of Gifted Education
    by indigo
    Today at 08:25 AM
    Full time in person learning-accommodati
    on for ADD

    by aeh
    Yesterday at 12:28 PM
    Grading practices
    by aeh
    10/18/20 12:49 PM
    How can teachers challenge a more academically adv
    by Kai
    10/17/20 07:16 PM
    Montessori vs. dedicated gifted school
    by ojojojoj
    10/14/20 09:28 AM
    Davidson Institute Twitter