So in my ongoing quest to "guess" about my daughter's abilities and wonder and wait what her educational future might look like I am starting to think we might find she is quite gifted verbally -- reading, writing, spelling, vocabulary, etc. and maybe quite "typical" on the non-verbal side. First, is that possible, and second, given that would mean she will NOT qualify for her school's gifted program, what would you recommend to enrich a brilliant little reader, writer, author and extremely thirsty learner? She's 6. Thanks!

I know another child that is accelerated several years in reading yet is has to work at grade level math. Wasn't Einstein the opposite? Being so advanced in physic and math yet ordinary in verbal?

Ren

My son is highly gifted verbally but has disabilities (problems with visual processing, visual-motor coordination, AS/NVLD) that impact his non-verbal domains. If you see a really big difference between the two areas, it might be worth it to have her assessed by someone who is used to working with 2-E kids just to be sure that there is not a hidden perceptual/visual/motor disability that is affecting her non-verbal skills.

Wren -- that sounds right -- I think Einstein was a late reader?

Aculady -- What were some of the things you noticed? I've never noticed anything like that -- in fact, her MAP scores in math were in the 98th percentile, but her teacher mentioned something about problem solving worksheets that she wants to look at when we have her conference (which is Thur.)

I am not sure (in fact I am pretty sure they will not) let my daughter accelerate in just one area. Is there anything I can do as an aside? I just am not sure what to make of this. We should know in the next month or so if they plan to test her this yer or not. They are extremely particular about who they'll test and she's young so I'll be surprised if they want to. Hmmmm....

I think this happens alot- kids who are gifted in one area but not in another.
In our local GATE program, which is a full-time program, there are a number of kids who are bellow grade level in math and need extra tutoring, although they are gifted in reading/verbal. There are kids obviously who are more globally gifted.

My ds6 is the opposite, his verbal skills are not as great as his non verbal skills. He scored much higher on PRI than on the VCI. This profile seems to have a better chance at making it into the gifted program here. My dd7 is very advanced verbally, and can read several grade levels above, BUT is not very advanced when it comes to math. DS6 is in the gifted program this year, but DD7 has not made it in yet.

We noted relative difficulty with puzzles; trouble with figure/ground or hidden picture/Where's Waldo kinds of tasks, including finding objects in a visually cluttered space; difficulty throwing and catching balls; clumsiness; difficulty drawing and doing fine motor tasks; odd head posture when reading, watching television, or trying to perform visually complex tasks; problems recognizing people from their appearance; and problems reading social cues/body language, among other things.

He had a lot of different things going on, so it is not terribly likely that another child who had fewer issues (but might still have NVLD, or visual processing problems, or another disability that would depress non-verbal performance) would present the same way.

Artsmartmom, you haven't said how old your daughter is, and we don't have enough of a background on her exposure to make any reasonable conjectures here. Some here have postulated reasons why your daughter may have a deficiency in the area of math, but maybe she has no deficiency at all. How much exposure has she had so far to math versus verbal skills? And how much has math captured her attention when she has been exposed?

My advice would be, don't "guess" about her abilities. Have her formally tested.

And it should be possible for acceleration at specific subjects... at least it has been in my experience. I showed up at school an early reader but with no exposure to math at all, so there were some early accommodations made in first grade where I could go to the second grade class to do reading and spelling lessons. When my daughter showed up at K, and she couldn't qualify for the gifted program right away (deliberately draconian qualification requirements for 5yo, but very reasonable for 6yo), so they sent her off to a first grade class for reading and spelling as an accommodation.

Of course, in her case, it should have been first grade all day, because she had already been heavily exposed to math as well, and kindergarten had nothing to teach her, but I'll refrain from indulging that rant yet again.

This is definitely possible. I have two examples in my own home. I'm only gifted in math. While my math scores are 99%+, my verbal scores are only a 90-93%. (Which made me often declare that I was "no good" at writing/reading when I was growing up, so watch out for that.)

My wife is a gifted artist, but while she is smart, she isn't gifted in other areas.

I think that this is a very interesting question and goes beyond the OP's child to the very heart of how one defines the term "gifted." Gifted is defined in many circles in a much broader means than it was in years past and, within school systems certainly, definitely includes people who have strong abilities in one domain and average abilities in others.

Ultimately, it probably comes down to whether one considers gifted to include people whose composite IQ (FSIQ, GAI, etc.) is not in the gifted range but who have some subtests that are gifted. And then it is further muddied by how high those highs have to be and whether an average overall score with just one high spike is gifted or whether the overall score needs to be above average or whether it needs to be an entire subtest (PRI, say as opposed to just one piece of PRI) that is in the top 2% or so...

I imagine that varying opinions exist even amongst experts.

She might qualify anyway based on her composite score. I have always tested very well on verbal measures, but my math skills are pretty average (I was demoted from honors math to "regular" math in junior high) and my spatial skills are below average. (Actually, I think I have an unrecognized LD--I have no sense of direction, did not learn right from left till about age 10, and also am pretty "face blind.") I still tested into the gifted program.

I have read here and elsewhere that global giftedness is actually more rare than not, though my husband and daughter both seem to fall in that category.

Yes, you can be only "partially gifted".

I don't have any intellectual weaknesses (according to my IQ testing report), but my level of artistic talent/skill with respect to drawing things is approximately zero.

And I have no sense of direction, but I am extremely good at reading maps. Go figure.

I have been trying to urge DD (3y4m) to puzzle more. She still struggles with 24 piece wooden puzzles, and it is just odd how she goes about them.

I bought her a new puzzle where there is no wrong answer. It is a ring of children from around the world holding hands. SHe STILL has trouble getting that thing together, yet, after only playing with it for a few days she has memorized where each of the 32 kids are from. I don't know how. I really didn't think she was reading them.

I watched her yesterday calling out, "Estonia! Estonia! where are you? You are going to be late for the party." Then she found him. I was shocked. I did not even think there was an Estonia. (shows you how much I've looked at it.) I just thought that was weird.

My DD7 also has noticeably stronger language skills than math skills.

However, when she was tested in first grade, her scores in both subjects were high enough to qualify her for the gifted program.

In our district, if a child scores extremely high in one area but low enough in another area that the composite score makes the child ineligible for the gifted program, they still do "cluster grouping" in the regular classroom.

Right now, DD can do only a one day/week enrichment program. (The full-time program isn't available until third grade.) The other two kids who qualify for the gifted program are in her regular classroom with DD. Also in the classroom are a cluster of kids who were strong in language arts and a different cluster of kids who were strong in math -- but not strong enough overall to qualify for the gifted program.

The result is that DD is much more challenged in her regular classroom this year than she was previously.

Ellemenope - I am pretty sure that doing 24 piece puzzles at 3yrs 4months is about 2 yrs advanced. My kids are all puzzle doers and I only just learned recently how abnormal their puzzle skill is.

When I hear that someone has "more talent in his little finger" than someone else does in his whole body, I assume that all the talent is concentrated in that one finger.

Thanks everyone -- this is an interesting discussion. I do think (from what I've read) things are changing a bit maybe toward accepting a gift in one area as giftedness. I, too, am talented (some might say gifted) in art and creative things, but not so much in math, etc.

I did mention that DD is 6 -- she's in first grade. They are currently pulling her out of a class with a small group of first graders and assessing her trying to make a recommendation on whether or not they want to test her. They'll give her the WISC-IV (if they decide they think she'll test quite high -- she needs a 140 to get into the program, and that's on everything -- just one will not do the trick). When I ask her about the class she says that they "do puzzles" so I think they are really looking at this part closely. Her reading and writing abilities are more obvious.

Both my hubby and I work for magazines -- he in editorial and me in art -- so she obviously has that tendency as well as that exposure. She's not been exposed to math (except the very basics) but I think she'd like it!

So until we know if we're testing or not I guess I will continue to guess.

I know that there are different thought processing modes involved which can play to various strengths and weaknesses, but on this subject of different levels of giftedness, I wonder how much different levels of interest play into it. After all, isn't it the sharp levels of interest in different kinds of learning that drive gifted learners to their achievements in the first place?

A few years ago I'd have agreed with JonLaw, that there was no artistic ability in me whatsoever. Then came DD, and I'd sit and do different artsy things with her because that was what she was into. And while I wouldn't submit any of it for awards or anything, there were some things I created that made me say, "Huh. I didn't think I had that in me."

Then again, many of the works of art that win awards make me shake my head, which just goes to show how completely disinterested I am in the whole thing.

I've found this to be true as well. My daughters test gifted in writing, english, lit but not math, my son is stronger in all subjects, exceptionally strong in math. I've heard that is how it is most of the time. One subject peaks more than others.
There are also different levels. My daughters tested gifted but my son tested exceptionally gifted. I didn't know there were levels at first so it was surprising. My son is as far above his sisters as they are above the norm. They usually come from gifted parents as well but my husband and I are not gifted. So, you never know why or how it all happens. I've noticed my son is strong on whatever area he is into. Your children might pull a 180 on you half way through their schooling. That is always fun. You are convinced it's math until they get into history. Then pow, change of direction.
My son seems to exhaust areas and move on and my daughters seem to have leveled out in their teens to one subject area. So, you never really know.


DUDE:
I know that there are different thought processing modes involved which can play to various strengths and weaknesses, but on this subject of different levels of giftedness, I wonder how much different levels of interest play into it. After all, isn't it the sharp levels of interest in different kinds of learning that drive gifted learners to their achievements in the first place?
I agree, it seems to be true in my house.

WOW! This struck a chord with me. I'm the opposite -- highest scores in verbal, and "only" good scores in math. I absolutely felt (and sometimes still feel) like I was/am no good at math. I continue to be amazed at how much I learn about myself as I'm raising my son.

I've done a fair amount of reading on giftedness recently, as I suspect my son may be gifted. In that reading, I've found several mentions of children being gifted in a given area but being typical in another.

Separately -- I've read Thomas Sowell's book The Einstein Syndrome. It talks about the connections he's found in children of gifted parents who also happen to be late talkers. Stephen Camarata of Vanderbilt Univ has done research in this area as well.

Also, I wouldn't diminish it by calling it partially gifted. My take is that a person is gifted (period), perhaps in one area, perhaps in more than one. :-)

I wouldn't call it partially gifted, but rather verbally gifted, etc. It actually is common to have academic strengths and relative weaknesses. DD8 is very strong on the verbal side (reading/writing) and artistically, but clearly not gifted in math. However, she is bright enough and elementary math is basic enough that she has no problems aceing 4th grade math in her 3rd grade GT class. The difference between her and her siblings is that she actually has to be taught and benefits from modeling by the teacher and practice.

Gifted is gifted. Gifted can mean universally gifted, but it can also mean gifted in some specific areas.

That said- to the OP - your child is young yet. My daughter was not interested in math at that age and did not display any particularly strong mathematical abilities.

Now she is 11 and they are starting to learn some algebra at school. She is spreading her mathematical wings, as it were. She will never be evenly balanced with math and words - but the difference is a bit less obvious as she gets more post-arithmetic exposure.

I used to wonder if she was only gifted in reading, but now I know she is PG in reading and only gifted in math.

Asynchronous development. I love the term. So much more meaningful than "gifted" at times.