Hi everyone
i am at a loss of what to do for K year with by DD5. She was just diagnosed HG (147 WPPSI) after years of perplexing, uneven behavior. Intense, hard to manage, constant craving of attention. She is the one that the "severe baby talk" thread is about. Anyway, she is currently an underperformer in school and home and after starting therapy a few weeks ago (initial findings- adjustment disorder/emotional disturbance). we've put some things together:

a) we feel she provokes us with baby talk and other behaviors as a way of testing our love for her. When she pushes us to the limit she validates how she feels- unloved, not as worthy as her brother, my DS7. When the going gets rough i tend to leave her in her bedroom, and she has actually shouted "see you DONT love me..".

b) she is very threatened by her brothers abilities and feels she is "stupid" compared to him. Afraid to show him (and now anyone else) that she can't do work at his level, and avoids it. Tends to hang out with very young kids at her montessori school. Does not want any of the older kids to know she can't read. She is actually way beyond her brother in terms of cognitive ability.

c) other than her academic performance, she fits in with kids who are 6-7 years old (she just turned 5), and if its kept completely social, she is great with them and preferes to be there. Will try to "woo" girls as old as 9 into friendships by trying to figure out what they woudl like to do, etc.

d) She is feeling of her being born and living first three years of life in environment totally devoted to her brothers special needs. He was (mis)-diagnosed with autism and our home was a revolving door of therapists of every sort. I went thru clinical depression during my pregnancy with her and first year of life due to DS's diagnosis. I felt overwhelmed by having a new baby in the home and hired a nanny to care for her (HUGE REGRET I AM VERY ASHAMED OF THIS).

So I am toying with the idea of homeschooling her next year. I feel that our relationship and the family dynamic needs to be healed and this would be a great chance to work on that.

I feel that if this doesn't get healed, there is no use moving her ahead into another academic environment where she will likely re-create the pattersns she is used to..Homeschooling is definitely NOT in fashion in our area (long island) so i'd be really going out on a limb.

The public school here is very good and they are dealing wonderfully with her brother. She very much wants to go to that school. So not sure if I should change that. Though the only basis for her opinion about what school she prefers is based on her brother. She toured many private schools including a Gifted school and none of them "passed muster" for her.

So I am wondering if anyone is homeschooling an UNDERachieving kid who is defintely not 2E when it comes to learning disabilites - that was ruled out..

and if anyone has dealt with these types of issues in a sibling of a disbled or otherwise exceptional sibling. At this point she seems like a mix of an emotionally disturbed child and a HG child. So I guess she could be looked at as a 2E kid in a way.. In other words i feel her behavior is outside the realm of typical HG/PG sensitivies.

thanks

irene

Hi renie1,
don't know much about home schooling but just wanted to send you well wishes and hope you find your answers.
My DS7 does the baby talk thing too. I find he does it more when he's feeling uncomfortable about something or seeking attention. Infuriating.

Good luck

Irene,
Please don't feel "ashamed" about making the choices you did. I'm sure you made them with your children's best interest in mind - we all make decisions based on information we have at the time - some work out well, others could have been better.

Your DD sounds like me as a 5 year old. Many of the issues improved with time/maturity. My DS6 is also very intense (guess where that came from?). I think homeschooling for us would be difficult because of the combination of our personalities - DH is right up there in intensity, too, so he wouldn't be helpful. DS actually has fewer behavioral issues at school than at home, and these are also getting better with time.

I'm sure you will make a decision that is right for you, now, with the information you have available. Decisions are not immutable, and plenty of other parents on this board have changed school situations if things didn't work out the way they planned. Keep posting - hoping for clarity for you and your family....

Just a quick reply to one of your points. Do you think she might have some unmet needs to feel mothered by you while she was a baby? Our
grandson, GS9, was with us off and on from the time he was 19 months, until he came to us permanently at 5 yrs, 6 mths. His mother effectively abandoned him at 19 mths, 1 stepmother had come and gone, and stepmother #2 had physically abused him before we got custody. Some of his behavior was very similar to your daughters'. I'm not implying there was any abuse involved in your situation, but with your depression, focusing on meeting the needs of the older one, and hiring a nanny to meet the physical needs of your daughter, maybe she didn't feel loved and attach to you. I'm not making any assumptions as to whether that's true, I'm just throwing that out as a possibility since that was where we had to work most with GS9 to help him. In cases like my GS, it's easy to say "well of course he felt abandoned, neglected, unloved; look what he went through." Although your daughter was cared for, she's a very bright child who probably felt things more intensely as a baby. Her feelings of being unloved may not be based on fact, but feelings often have very little to do with fact. And while she may cognitively know she is very much loved, that doesn't always take care of feelings that say otherwise. For GS9, the baby talk & behavior were a way to relive and try to fix what was lacking for him as a baby.

I don't have any answers for you. As a homeschooler, I can see how it could help and how it could be difficult. Homeschooling can improve relationships and bonding because of the sheer time spent together, but it could be difficult if you end up in constant power struggles.

If I were to try homeschooling in this situation, I would try to focus more on fun learning than book learning as that has a greater chance of improved bonding and less chance of power struggles over getting the work done. At her age, you won't be missing anything really important or anything that can't be picked up in a very short time. I'd concentrate on field trips to fun and educational places; just have fun together in places that are "educational". I'd read good books with her. I'd do arts/crafts projects and kitchen science experiences. Cook and bake together. Really, anything that is fun, that you can do together.

If you want more structure, you can do this in a unit study style. Pick a topic. Hit the library and find a bunch of books on it. Do a craft project. Cook/bake something related. Visit a local museum, science center, or other place that's related. Read a fiction story that is related somehow and find a movie or play to go with the book you chose. Look for things to do to go with your topic even if it is a stretch.

Some ideas based on what we've done or will do eventually:

The BGF: read the book, see it as a play, make breakfast as described in the book, make a shadow box scene, act out a scene from the book, write/tell an alternate ending

Where the Red Fern Grows: read the book, learn about coonhounds and raccoons, watch a movie version, visit the zoo or dog park or animal shelter, make a diorama

Read any Magic Treehouse book: learn more about the history/science topic in the book, do a craft project (ie. make and paint a sugar cube pyramid for the Egyptian book), visit a museum with a related exhibit

Hi, your post resonated with me... I also have an HG child who has emotional difficulties... and similarly, does not really have any learning disability.

I am also toying with the idea of homeschooling.

My advice is, if you feel you want to spend the time with her, why NOT homeschool for Kindergarten? K is not mandatory, so you can do this and still send her to first grade at the good local school, if you decide to, right? I don't see a downside.

Certainly though, based on what you describe, I would keep the pressure off her-- make it fun and loving, enjoy her company and marvel at her intelligence. Why not?

Good luck.

I have been homeschooling for maybe two months. It is the bomb diggity. Wish I'd done it years ago. He's learned more in an hour a day for two months than he did all year long at public for six hours a day.

thank you for everyones thoughtful responses. yes, i feel she does have abandonment issues due to lack of attention/being left with a nanny at a young age. Its being explored with her psychologist. We've tried homeschooling the last week or so due to her being out of school early in the year. I've seen some really positive changes in her. The negative is that she does not allow me to structure the day in any way. she has to be the boss. so not sure how that would fly when we'd HAVE to get work done that is specifict to a curriculum. But thanks for pointing out that for K year i can get away with a lot more.

irene

Maybe it would help to give her the options and let her choose the order in which she does them. Or something of that nature. Do you want to do math or reading? That kind of thing works here with my DD6's.

Why do you feel you'd need to get work done specific to a curriculum? Sounds as though this might be the ideal time for some "unschooling" - e.g., decide that until next Spring (say) you're going to do fun things with her, and of course they'll involve learning because 5yos are learning machines, but you could afford the time to let her "drive" and develop her own instincts. Given how bright she is, from Spring to Summer would surely be enough time to make sure she'd covered what's expected of K, if you wanted to.

My only reservation on this is that you said she was keen on going to her brother's school - it would be a pity if she felt that you'd deprived her of doing that. When do you have to decide? Can you prepare the ground a bit and then ask her what she'd prefer, making clear that you like the idea of homeschooling next year because it would give you plenty of time with just her to enjoy helping her learn whatever she wanted to?

I agree with ColinsMum that doing something more unschool-y might be the way to go. It doesn't have to be full-on unschooling. That would strike fear in my heart, personally, though I believe strongly that there are ways to make unschooling work wonderfully well for kids. How you approach homeschooling is really more of a personality issue than anything--both your child's and yours!--and I am not that personality. But there's a HUGE middle ground between no set curriculum whatsoever and doing exactly what some teacher's guide tells you to do.

My compromise is to be very child-led, offer many choices about what DS8 can do, but still have some fairly flexible requirements. We have "math time," when he must select one of the many options I provide that are acceptable to me as math. I choose the options based on his specific needs. Some we use a lot, some we never touch. Some are game-based, some are very traditional worksheet-type things. As long as we eventually cover all the skills he needs, whatever he picks from the pile of options is fine.

He has to do each subject when it's time to do it, unless he gets on a roll with something. If that happens, I make the call about whether it's more productive to change gears or to amend the schedule to let him keep going. Usually it's worth it to let him keep going and just catch up on the other subject(s) later. If he's excited about learning, then it usually doesn't make sense to stop him.

The central idea here is that he and I are partners in his education. When we first started homeschooling, I told him that I am making a promise to the state that I will be sure he gets a good education, and that if I can't provide that, he has to go back to school. So there are things he must learn. But how he learns them and when he learns them are flexible. On bad days (of which there are surprisingly few...), I remind him that if he is unhappy with what he's learning, then he has to work with me to help me find something else for him. It's his responsibility, too. That works for us. It might not work for all kids, not even all HG+ kids, but it works like a charm for him. Feel free to use or ignore...

BTW, we started HSing when he was 6, so these sorts of conversations are not impossible with a 5yo, depending upon the child. But giving your DD some responsibility, stressing to her your own responsibility, and being very flexible about what she studies could be just what you need. I can tell you for sure that giving DS8 a great deal of control within certain boundaries virtually eliminates fights around here. Plus it is encouraging him to view his education as his own responsibility. I don't know that I ever really felt that way--even in grad school!--so I think that's a good side-effect.

Hopefully there's something mildly useful there for you...

yes i was wrong about worrying about curriculum for K.. And yes, its very important for her to go to school with her brother, so this is a major reason why i'm confused about september (when she is scheduled to begin K).. But what i do know, is that in just over a week of basically devoting my day to her she has changed. She is overall just easier and seems happier. So hopefully by Sept. we'll have an entirely different child.
irene

Oh, you're not wrong. You're very normal to worry about curriculum. But if she's responding better after just one week, it may be okay if you tweak things just a tad.

A lot can happen over a summer. How soon do you have to make the decision between homeschooling or the school? Can you stall? Homeschool over the summer and then try school in the fall to get some comparison? Afterschool while she's in school? Find some middle ground between the two in some other way?

I'd recommend staying as flexible as you can for as long as you can. Kids' needs and desires change, and it's good to be able to respond.

FWIW...