x - 03/30/12 05:55 PM
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Re: 504 time - 03/30/12 06:12 PM
Are you planning to teach him handwriting or written expression? I wasn't sure from what you've written here... and my reply will differ depending on which you're referring to 
I'm headed out the door to an appointment but will come back later and list the accommodations our ds uses, as well as the instruction work etc we've done with him in written expression if that would help.
FWIW, our ds has dysgraphia + an expressive language disorder which primarily impacts written expression, but he also has trouble with speaking to adults and speaking out in class which is related to his expressive language disorder. Just curious if you think that might be part of what's up with your ds.
More later,
polarbear
I'm headed out the door to an appointment but will come back later and list the accommodations our ds uses, as well as the instruction work etc we've done with him in written expression if that would help.
FWIW, our ds has dysgraphia + an expressive language disorder which primarily impacts written expression, but he also has trouble with speaking to adults and speaking out in class which is related to his expressive language disorder. Just curious if you think that might be part of what's up with your ds.
More later,
polarbear
Re: 504 time - 03/30/12 07:39 PM
Hi, MON--
I totally hear you on the weariness. This stuff is so taxing.
First thought: have you ever worked with a professional advocate? Hiring one was the best move I ever made with respect to schooling for my 2E DS9. She talks to school and district people before meetings, articulates the needs, negotiates behind the scenes, offers evidence-- so that the actual meetings go smoothly, because all the groundwork has been laid already. She has done a great job getting principals and teachers to understand that a person can be gifted AND disabled at the same time. We have gotten much better response from the school since we started using our advocate. One who is experienced in your district is best if you can swing it.
Second, related to first thought: do you have an outside professional (therapist, educational expert, neuropsychologist) who can educate the school folks directly? Because they clearly don't understand the needs at all. We bring our private therapist to IEP meetings; he is a nice, evidence-based, reasonable help to the school and they respect him.
Perhaps biggest: it sounds to me as though your DS should qualify for an IEP, and receive direct services to remediate. Participation is both an academic and a functional skill; if his participation problems are the result of disabling anxiety, the school should be working on it through direct instruction as well as supporting his efforts in a positive way across the day. The writing instruction, likewise-- they are responsible for teaching organization of content, etc., and if he struggles with that he should be receiving direct instruction. An IEP would get him the direct instruction.
If you think he needs an IEP, you follow the directions in From Emotions to Advocacy, write a letter requesting a complete educational evaluation, and listing every issue you can think of. They have to do it within 60 school days-- not enough time to fix this year, but maybe enough to get them primed to fix next year.
In any case, whether you want to fight the IEP battle or not, I think your best bet at getting something appropriate is to bring the right private professionals to bear on the problem.
HTH,
DeeDee
I totally hear you on the weariness. This stuff is so taxing.
First thought: have you ever worked with a professional advocate? Hiring one was the best move I ever made with respect to schooling for my 2E DS9. She talks to school and district people before meetings, articulates the needs, negotiates behind the scenes, offers evidence-- so that the actual meetings go smoothly, because all the groundwork has been laid already. She has done a great job getting principals and teachers to understand that a person can be gifted AND disabled at the same time. We have gotten much better response from the school since we started using our advocate. One who is experienced in your district is best if you can swing it.
Second, related to first thought: do you have an outside professional (therapist, educational expert, neuropsychologist) who can educate the school folks directly? Because they clearly don't understand the needs at all. We bring our private therapist to IEP meetings; he is a nice, evidence-based, reasonable help to the school and they respect him.
Perhaps biggest: it sounds to me as though your DS should qualify for an IEP, and receive direct services to remediate. Participation is both an academic and a functional skill; if his participation problems are the result of disabling anxiety, the school should be working on it through direct instruction as well as supporting his efforts in a positive way across the day. The writing instruction, likewise-- they are responsible for teaching organization of content, etc., and if he struggles with that he should be receiving direct instruction. An IEP would get him the direct instruction.
If you think he needs an IEP, you follow the directions in From Emotions to Advocacy, write a letter requesting a complete educational evaluation, and listing every issue you can think of. They have to do it within 60 school days-- not enough time to fix this year, but maybe enough to get them primed to fix next year.
In any case, whether you want to fight the IEP battle or not, I think your best bet at getting something appropriate is to bring the right private professionals to bear on the problem.
HTH,
DeeDee
Re: 504 time - 03/30/12 08:00 PM
Originally Posted by master of none
Yet, it is likely they will try to do away with the 504 this year--they have been telling us that since the day we started at this school. "504s are reserved for kids who need them to learn", "your son is getting good grades and doesn't need anything special", "we don't have any extra computers for the kids to use".
I know that you are tired but I would fight this tooth and nail. It doesn't sound like your school understands that 504 plans protect the disabled student's civil right to equal access to the educational process. It is not a special ed law. Does your district have a parent 504 guide? Here is the eligibility criteria from our district:
"[A] student is eligible for Section 504 protection when it is determined that he/she has a physical or mental impairment that substantially limits one or more of the major life activities, and the impairment is impacting access and student benefit from school programs and services."
I assume that yours would be similar since they have to comply with the same federal law. From what you've described, your son needs his existing accommodations implemented and maybe a bit more in order to learn. He needs a keyboard to write, he needs extra time, etc. Are they going to make him go back to what you call "the torture" of handwriting? I would challenge them if they try to take his 504 away.
Our district also has a 504 compliance officer who will go to bat with the schools if they are not implementing plans as written. You might want to check if there is a similar person in your district.
Re: 504 time - 03/30/12 08:43 PM
504 plans are not really legally binding; IEPs are. It's always better to try and get an IEP if that is possible.
Re: 504 time - 03/31/12 02:15 AM
Hi
We have had several above the principal's head arguments. I hear you on not wanting another one. I have 2 dc on IEPs. One is dyslexic and diabetic type 1. The second is hearing impaired and used to have some major anxiety issues. We got the IEP based on the hearing loss. He never had hearing loss related goals. A 504 plan would have clearly covered his physical disability. For the IEP we had goals involving his anxiety for years. He was actually allowed to chew gum in class because it relieved his anxiety. He has certain situations where he was allowed to go work in a separate room if he was having a super high anxiety day. He was allowed to have a book from home with him at all times to read after he finished his work and other kids were still working. He would get nasty and anxious waiting for them to finish. He had goals stating these misc things to relief his anxiety. I know you don't want another fight. They are so draining
He never had extended time but my dyslexic child did have extended time on all written assignments and standardized test. He is a HS senior this year and still has extended time. It takes him longer to read and write things.
I would really consider making the request for the evaluation and consider contacting an educational lawyer. We ultimately didn't hire one, but we had her waiting in the wings if things didn't go well. We too had one principle that hated our DS and tried her best to not follow his IEP or give him good placements. He was reading novels in kindergarten and she refused to put him in the advance reader's program! She was just a witch and I do have a younger child with her now. I think we have fought over the years for very reasonable things and over time the schools have given more weight to our input. She has her hands tied at this point by the district pupil coordinator after the horrible things she did to DS.
Eligibility Determination: A Two-Pronged Test
It is important to understand that establishing eligibility for services under IDEA is a two-pronged process. The team of qualified professionals and the parent must determine that the student meets both of these criteria in order to be eligible for special education services:
Prong One: The student must be determined to have one (or more) of the 13 disabilities listed in the IDEA; and
Prong Two: The student must, as a result of that disability, need special education in order to make progress in school and in order to receive benefit from the general educational program.
Given this two-pronged test, it is possible that a student could be determined to have a disability (Prong One), such as a Specific Learning Disability or Attention Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder (AD/HD), yet not be in need of special education (Prong Two).
http://www.ncld.org/at-school/your-...g-your-childs-need-for-special-education
Good Luck:)
We have had several above the principal's head arguments. I hear you on not wanting another one. I have 2 dc on IEPs. One is dyslexic and diabetic type 1. The second is hearing impaired and used to have some major anxiety issues. We got the IEP based on the hearing loss. He never had hearing loss related goals. A 504 plan would have clearly covered his physical disability. For the IEP we had goals involving his anxiety for years. He was actually allowed to chew gum in class because it relieved his anxiety. He has certain situations where he was allowed to go work in a separate room if he was having a super high anxiety day. He was allowed to have a book from home with him at all times to read after he finished his work and other kids were still working. He would get nasty and anxious waiting for them to finish. He had goals stating these misc things to relief his anxiety. I know you don't want another fight. They are so draining
He never had extended time but my dyslexic child did have extended time on all written assignments and standardized test. He is a HS senior this year and still has extended time. It takes him longer to read and write things.
I would really consider making the request for the evaluation and consider contacting an educational lawyer. We ultimately didn't hire one, but we had her waiting in the wings if things didn't go well. We too had one principle that hated our DS and tried her best to not follow his IEP or give him good placements. He was reading novels in kindergarten and she refused to put him in the advance reader's program! She was just a witch and I do have a younger child with her now. I think we have fought over the years for very reasonable things and over time the schools have given more weight to our input. She has her hands tied at this point by the district pupil coordinator after the horrible things she did to DS.
Eligibility Determination: A Two-Pronged Test
It is important to understand that establishing eligibility for services under IDEA is a two-pronged process. The team of qualified professionals and the parent must determine that the student meets both of these criteria in order to be eligible for special education services:
Prong One: The student must be determined to have one (or more) of the 13 disabilities listed in the IDEA; and
Prong Two: The student must, as a result of that disability, need special education in order to make progress in school and in order to receive benefit from the general educational program.
Given this two-pronged test, it is possible that a student could be determined to have a disability (Prong One), such as a Specific Learning Disability or Attention Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder (AD/HD), yet not be in need of special education (Prong Two).
http://www.ncld.org/at-school/your-...
Good Luck:)
Re: 504 time - 03/31/12 01:26 PM
These are some ideas for anxiety in the classroom:
http://www.worrywisekids.org/schools/sample_accomodations.html
http:/
Re: 504 time - 03/31/12 05:52 PM
Originally Posted by master of none
Heavens no. He is typing. We are not going to torture with handwriting practice!
I'm just going to work with him on constructing essays. He's good with factual stuff, but not the abstract like "do you think birds should be our national symbol, why or why not?" especially when you add a time element. (one teacher actually calls him a "gifted writer" but that's because it's spitting back what he has learned with a twist to match the essay question, and there's no time pressure)
The not talking is totally anxiety, which increases when the teacher says- you will be graded on participation. He's had therapy and people are impressed with how he expresses himself. So impressed that sometimes they forget that the goal is NOT to be his audience, but to teach him how to talk to others.
I'd like him to learn writing and participation in school and I'm frustrated that school is more punitive than instructive. Yet, it is likely they will try to do away with the 504 this year--they have been telling us that since the day we started at this school. "504s are reserved for kids who need them to learn", "your son is getting good grades and doesn't need anything special", "we don't have any extra computers for the kids to use". I guess I'm just weary right now, and I'd like to see if I can turn it more positive toward accommodations that will actually help.
I'm just going to work with him on constructing essays. He's good with factual stuff, but not the abstract like "do you think birds should be our national symbol, why or why not?" especially when you add a time element. (one teacher actually calls him a "gifted writer" but that's because it's spitting back what he has learned with a twist to match the essay question, and there's no time pressure)
The not talking is totally anxiety, which increases when the teacher says- you will be graded on participation. He's had therapy and people are impressed with how he expresses himself. So impressed that sometimes they forget that the goal is NOT to be his audience, but to teach him how to talk to others.
I'd like him to learn writing and participation in school and I'm frustrated that school is more punitive than instructive. Yet, it is likely they will try to do away with the 504 this year--they have been telling us that since the day we started at this school. "504s are reserved for kids who need them to learn", "your son is getting good grades and doesn't need anything special", "we don't have any extra computers for the kids to use". I guess I'm just weary right now, and I'd like to see if I can turn it more positive toward accommodations that will actually help.
I'm sorry I asked about the writing! I hope I didn't add to your frustration - I tend to not be able to remember who's child is doing what so I get confused... I totally understand your frustration, we've sooooo so been there with our ds' school experience!
First thing, the accommodation our ds has for timed fluency tests is that they have to be given orally.
Re accommodations for anxiety - our ds is an anxious kid, but his anxiety at school almost always flares around issues that come up due to not accommodating appropriately for his disability - so when there's an issue with anxiety at school we look at what's going on, what can be done to alleviate it, and then make a suggestion for an accommodation based on that. For anxiety in general, I'd look through the list of suggestions above, or look at your state's special ed resource website if there is one, ours has a state policy handbook which lists typical IEP accommodations for different types of disabilities, and that's been a good resource for us because when we ask for something that's listed in that book (and word it the same way it's listed) we get it - the school staff is familiar with it and won't object.
Re doing away with the 504, if the school suggests this I'd put down everything they say in writing, and email it back to them - letting them know this is your understanding of what was said, and stating your concerns, maybe restating some of what is in the actual law.
Gotta run, I hope some of that helps!
polarbear