I have posted before about my middle daughter, who is now 12, here: link to previous thread . She has had difficulties with spelling, phonological processing, writing down information that seems to be right in front of her, & some auditory issues since 2nd grade. But her grades have always been good & scores on state test are consistently high.

I have finally managed to get a psychological evaluation done & had the last appointment to get the results today. So I thought I would share them & find out if anyone had any feedback. Also if you have any advice for placement for next year as she enters middle school (gifted, advanced, honors, etc.)

WISC-IV
Verbal Comprehension Subtests/Scaled Scores:
Similarities/16++
Vocabulary/14
Comprehension/18++

Perceptual Reasoning Subtests/Scaled Scores:
Block Designs/15++
Picture Concepts/15++
Matrix Reasoning/14

Working Memory Subtests/Scaled Scores:
Digit Span/04--
Letter-Number Sequencing/10--

Processing Speed Subtests/Scaled Scores:
Coding/10--
Symbol Search/11

Index/Composite Score/Percentile:
Verbal Comprehension/136++/99
Perceptual Reasoning/129++/97
Working Memory/83--/13
Processing Speed /103--/58
Full Scale IQ /120++ /91

++statistically significant relative strength
--statistically significant relative weakness

WJ-III
Composite Scores & subtests/Standard Score/percentile/GE:
Broad Reading/98--/44/6.1
Letter-Word Identification/97--/42/5.6
Passage Comprehension/113/80/11.3
Reading Fluency/92--/31/5.2

Broad Mathematics/116/86/10.1
Calculation/130++/98/18.0
Applied Problems/112/78/10.3
Mathematics Fluency/91--/27/5.5

Broad Written Language/96--/41/5.8
Spelling/96--/38/5.4
Writing Samples/121++/92/13.5
Writing Fluency/88--/22/4.9

Academic Skills/107/68/7.4
Academic Applications/117/87/11.4
Academic Fluency/90--/26/5.1

Total Achievement/103/57/7.0

Oral Language/103/57/8.2
Story Recall/104/60/9.3
Understanding Directions/102/55/7.8

++statistically significant when compared with intellectual potential of full scale IQ of 120
--statistically significant weakness (minus one standard deviation)

There is a long, well-written report, but I won't bore you with all of that. If anyone wants details I will be happy to share. The overall factor is that her strong abilities are hampered by her weak fluency/speed.

The diagnosis is that "[dd12] is best considered a gifted student with a learning disability. She meets criteria for a Reading Disorder (dyslexia) with particular impairment in reading speed as well as a Disorder of Written Expression with impairment in writing speed."

His recommendations are:
1. A 504 education plan that offers extra work time for classroom examinations & standardized tests;
2. The opportunity to use a keyboard when possible for written assignments;
3. Using learning strategies of visualization, conceptual analysis, practical examples, & general understanding to integrate information;
4. (synopsis) Make sure she learns to organize her work & does not procrastinate. Because of her slow work speed,the further she gets behind the harder it will be for her to show her full potential.

Hi Ginger,

Congrats to you for pursuing this-- I'm sure it will be helpful to your DD to know what she's dealing with.

I'm surprised that the recommendations don't include direct remediation of the dyslexia and the disorder of written expression. Both of these can improve considerably with targeted therapies, and you might want both in-school and private help with them.

DeeDee

What are the choices availible to DD12 for next year? Will they allow her to take honors classes with extra time? What is her keyboarding skills level - can she type without looking at the hands, and how fast?
I sounds to me that having good work ethic is going to be very important to DD's success - so to me that means that she must have classmates and academic material where she is engaged intellectually. Why? Well, she is going to be working twice as hard to do what the other kids do, so she had better, at least, be having some fun, and getting something back from the interpersonal interactions and the academic material, yes?

Good for you for persuing it this far!
Yippee!
Grinity

This is one of the reasons I am posting on here. What exactly am I looking for to remediate these areas? I don't know how much help I will get from the school; it's a new ballgame to me now that she has an actual diagnosis. Up until now I have been fighting to get her any sort of accommodations as she does not "fit" into the RTI model to get help. (She drops out at the 1st question, "Is the child successful?" which to the schools means making good grades & state test scores--check.)

Also, I was wondering how/if the gifted score ranges change when a child has an LD. Isn't the overall IQ score "lowered" in a sense by the areas in which the child has the disability?

I spoke with someone at my daughter's school today to let them know that I had these results & that I wanted to have a meeting to go over them. They wanted me to wait until next school year since this year is nearly over & she will be going to middle school next year. I said absolutely not--I want to have a record of her performance this year with the teachers she has worked with & the provisions they have made for her in class. I am not going into next year trying to explain what the past few years have been like. Even if we have to meet again next year to formalize her plan, I want to have a summary of her elementary school years in hand to take with me. I have had more problems trying to explain everything that has been done & not having documentation to back up those explanations...

Grinity--She is currently signed up for Honors Algebra, & advanced geography, life science, language arts. Electives are to be determined. I don't yet know about gifted placement--like I asked above: Is there a difference in the way gifted scores are determined when a learning disability is involved? I need to do some research, but if anyone on this board knows where to start (particularly if you are in FL) please point it out.

Another thing that the psychologist pointed out is that dd12 is excellent at applied learning. This is such invaluable information-almost makes me want to weep with joy. It is like a key in unlocking a door for her! So we will need to try to find ways to integrate that into her learning plan. We do have some good hands-on programs in our system; I just want to keep dd from having to run all over the place to get her education.

Ginger, I don't know much about RTI-- you will need to really read up on the Wrightslaw website to see what your DD's rights are. I do believe that the school is NOT allowed to use RTI to delay evaluating your child for disabilities. If you haven't already requested that the school evaluate her, you should. In writing, ASAP. The school has to do its own evaluation before granting any services.


I don't think anyone lowers the bar for a person with an LD, even if that means that some people are unfairly excluded from gifted services.


Yes, pursue it with the old school for the sake of gathering as much documentation as possible, but know that it takes months and months to get a plan into place, and you won't finish the job this school year. Also contact the new school with your written request for an educational evaluation for suspected disabilities, and give them a copy your private report as evidence that the eval is necessary.

I have giant heavy duty binders in which I put every shred of evidence, including uncompleted work, complaints from teachers about failure to turn in assignments, report cards, diagnostic reports-- literally everything, organized chronologically. If you don't have a binder yet, start one-- it's useful to have.

DeeDee

I can't really understand what you are asking ginger - can you say it a different way, or with more examples? Srry
Aww, that is so excellent!
Naugh - I would let that goal drop away - there are plenty of worse things than running all over the place to get a good fit education.

Lots of afterschool activities are also great for applied learning - Enjoy!
Grinity

Regarding whether different criteria apply when there are learning disabilities involved - with scores like this, the psychologist's report should include the GAI, which is calculated without the PSI and WMI, with a statement that the GAI is a more accurate estimate of your child's intellectual abilities. If this is NOT in the report, contact the psych who did the eval and ask for it to be calculated and included. Because of the significantly discrepant scores, FSIQ is not a valid estimate of intelligence in a situation with scores like these. The school should use the GAI in place of the FSIQ in evaluating eligibility for gifted programs.

Thanks, aculady, that answers 2 questions. I was also wondering what the GAI was & why it is not included on dd's report. I will call & ask the psychologist about that on Mon. I'm curious to see how different the scores are. (Is it possible to figure that score out on my own?)
I did speak briefly with the counselor at dd's school this morning & she said that they will consider the score from the RIAS (131) that the school psychologist gave her earlier this year when looking at her eligibility for gifted education. According to that, she meets the standard. Of course, there are other factors involved, but that one is met.

BTW, the GAI for these WISC scores is 139.

WISC-IV Technical Report 4

Yes, the GAI can be figured by looking at WISC Technical Report #4, which is available online (just google it). Her GAI would be 139. My youngest had a similar pattern on the WISC with high VCI and PRI and lower/average WMI and PSI although her WMI wasn't as low as your dd's. It is funny how subjective interpretation of IQ patterns can be. The psych who tested my dd said that she didn't have any LDs or anything wrong. Another psych dxed her with ADD with the same data and input from dd and me.

aculady-

Wow, you don't waste any time do you?

Thanks!

I had dd12's eligibility meeting for gifted education as well as a 504 education plan. Both were approved.(!!!) She will start next year in all 3 gifted classes that are offered (science, geography, language arts). If the work load is too heavy, we can back off 1 or 2 of them. She had already signed up for honors algebra.

Her 504 individualized plan has the following accommodations:
*Seating considerations: preferential seating-near front;
*Repeat & simplify instruction: check for understanding of written directions;
*Testing accommodations: extended time (+100%), flexible setting, small group (as needed), allow her to retake assessments that she scores below 60%;
*Use of assistive technology: allow her to use computer for written assignments as needed;
*Organizational techniques: encourage dd to use her planner to keep track of tests, projects;
*Other: reduced assignments for mastery in math & spelling, allow extended time on assignments in class.

She still does not qualify for remediation because of her grades/state test scores. But with the testing we had done I now know more of what she is actually dealing with & can look for help on my own. Also, my mom is a retired teacher in TX who works part-time with kids who may be dyslexic (not yet identified) & she may have some resources for me. If anyone of you have any ideas for us, I am pretty wide open.

Anything that has a time component (reading, writing, academic fluency), you see much lower scores. While they are still in the "average" range, they are MUCH lower than overall cognition - especially compared to the GAI. This is sure to cause frustration, doubt, fatigue.

A 504 will help by providing accommodations. But, at age 12, I wonder if you would consider remediation, to see if you could actually help her increase fluency in the area of reading and math? I also notice relatively low working memory scores. She would probably benefit from help learning to study and approach school work to overcome these deficits. I am especially concerned about HS and college when the volume of information increases - she will be slower getting through it (fluency), and may not be able to access/recall it very well if she doesn't know how to get it to her long term memory.

I do want to remediate, but again, she does not qualify for services under the RTI model. Does anyone know of free services for children with dyslexia? I talked with my mom & she gave me some strategies to use with dd; I can use some of the techniques we teach at Sylvan as well. I am have signed her up to take keyboarding through FL Virtual School this summer. But I feel strongly that she needs guidance from someone who has expertise in this area.

I have another question for those who are knowledgeable in interpreting scores: What do you make of her very high score in math computation? The psychologist said that it could have been even higher; that he saw her make a few minor errors here & there. He also said that she was very persistent in working the problems. I have never noticed a natural ability for math in her before.

I am beginning to realize just how much effort she puts into her work & I so want to help her reach her full potential.

There are private Orton-Gillingham tutors-- I'd go for one of the methods that's had the best track record for remediation...

DeeDee

The Scottish Rite tutoring centers run by the Mason's offer free, quality, OG tutoring. http://www.childrensdyslexiacenters.org/

Waiting lists are often long.

Mich, do you have any suggestions for methods of teaching this? Specifically, how do you teach someone how to get info into their long-term memory so it can be accessed/recalled? Thanks!

I met someone who runs a private reading clinic for children with dyslexia & related language difficulties when I was at a conference for SES providers. It is relatively close (1.75 hours away). We talked about her work & she was kind enough to share several techniques to try with dd12. She also offered a phone consultation. This lady has worked with dyslexic people for over 15 years & really had some great insight from her experiences. She helped me to see why dd12 has never developed a passion for any one thing like my my other two kids. It's as if she is trying to get from point A to point B but is always being led off the road or having a roadblock put up in front of her. It must be completely confusing & frustrating. So we put the accommodations in place to get her around the roadblocks & work on remediation to get her back on the road. Then she should be able to see her way much more clearly & begin to develop those interests.

Nik -
Regarding strategies to overcome WM issues - I am not a teacher, just a mom that has hired tutors to work with my kids! This is what I observe:

WM issues often result in "careless" errors. For instance, my daughter has very good math comprehension skills, but often "gets the wrong" answer. Her tutor taught her how to organize and show her work so that she could avoid some of these issues and at the very least, leave a trail so that she could more easily check her answers.

Sometimes kids with WM issues find it difficult to take notes, remember details for tests - even though they have an EXCELLENT understanding of the big issues and how they interconnect. Tutors have taught my children how to "preread" text books (scan headings, picture captions, graphs, read end of chapter questions) PRIOR to reading the text. This helps to alert them to the important issues that they should pay attention to while reading. As they read through assigned text, they take two column notes. On the left is the info, date, vocabulary word, even etc on the right is the "so what" explanation, definition.

Previewing/Reviewing is important. By previewing a topic, it is easier to connect the important details to the big picture during the lecture, discussion, reading. Reviewing what they learned, gives the brain a second chance to store it away in a manner that it can be retrieved more easily later on.

My kids also consciously connect new ideas to what they know - for instance, when reading "To Kill a Mockingbird", my daughter connected what she read to "A Time to Kill" - a book with similar themes. In French, she tries to remember roots to help her learn the vocabulary. And Mnemonic's and acronyms are helpful to (although not so much for my dyslexic son - he has a harder time with the mnemonic than the content!).

Here's a good article:
http://www.ldonline.org/article/5736/

Ginger - it sounds like the person you spoke with really "gets it"! I hope that the accommodations make a difference for your daughter. Extra time made a HUGE difference for mine.

Mich thank you so much for this post, it was a real "Ah-ha!" moment for me. I know from my DDs CAPD testing that she has fantastic retention of information she finds meaningful and can map to something, but she has almost zero retention of anything "meaningless". Now the test was for auditory input but I think with her it probably applies across the board.

mich-

It sounds like you have found great tutors for your children. A couple of other strategies I was reminded of when I read your post: SQ3R & the Cornell note-taking method-- study strategies.