I really dont want to borrow trouble, really dont want to...but we are still trying to figure DD out and she was getting in trouble today AGAIN for not looking at me when I talked to her. And she does this all the time, and she knows I consider it rude and that it is a big deal and she always gets in trouble, but she just wont do it. Even after getting in trouble and talked to about it. So I didn't know it it was just me, or what, so I started observing, and well I called my mom and asked her (as she had just visited with us for 2 weeks) and I asked her if there was anything she noticed about DD that she was concerned about(knowing my mom would never say anything even if she had without being asked cause that is just how she is) And she instantly said, "She never looks at me when we were talking or playing. She looked to the side of me, or at my body, but never at my face." She also mentioned the MANY meltdowns, complete screaming, yelling at us, when we did not play EXACTLY right, and playing the same senario over and over again for hours. And then she mentioned that DD spends so much time on the setting up to play and never seemed to really play with many things.(Whew, a lot of stuff she noticed.)
Well, so when DD wasn't looking at me again today, I asked her. I simply said "why don't you look at me when you know it makes me upset and I think its rude." She said "I just can't mom." I asked why not. DD.... "It doesn't feel comfy inside. It is uncomfortable. I feel like I am on an up and down road" (That is how she describes when she is anxious about something.)
I know very little about aspergers, but I do know the eye contact thing is often a part of it. Can any one point me to some resources to read on. I googled tonight and was overwhelmed. I started reading and the only thing I could see was myself. It described me to a T growing up, and in a lot of ways still does. So is this DD or have I somehow inadvertently taught her these behaviors? Does that even make sense? I'm not looking for a diagnosis unless it was really interferring...just wondering and hoping to understand her more.
Did you mention in another post that your hubby is away at work for a week? Mine has just started a new job in the oilfield where he's gone for one week every other week. Last time my 3 year old was nervous. This week he's pushing boundries and pulling heartstrings. He called his dad and woke him up and said, you have a bed here. Why aren't you sleePing in it. He knows his dad's at work. He has a calendar and he's watching it. He told Wella on the phone his dad would be back in 3 days, even though we forgot to mark a box today so there were 4 empty boxes.
I'm not sure about Aspbergers but I think it's similar enough to pg to be misdiagnosed. There's also the chance of the dual diagnosis. Where does quirky end? No, really. Is there an end to it? I'm working out the obedience aspect of listening with my pre-schooler. I just started the classic mom's "oh yeah, if you were listening then what did I say?". "hhff, then go do it.". I just the other day read on this very forum the actual steps of listening:
Look at my face when I'm telling you what to do.
Do what I told you to do.
Come tell me what you just did that I told you to do.
I told the boy we'll be practicing this. He doesn't want to. Plus he wants to tell me what to do. Tsk.
Hopefully she is fine, but if you are concerned I have just learned here that services are offered through the school district beginning at age 3. Maybe an evaluation would help relieve fears or identify anything, and alert the school district to her giftedness, too.
I started reading and the only thing I could see was myself. It described me to a T growing up, and in a lot of ways still does.
Ahhh. Me too.
Seablue- Thanks, I don't think our scholl district does here...not many resources on the island but I dont know. And yeah, it was scary when I realized wow, that was me.
La Texican- Yep, Thankfully he got back tonight. Wasn't sure if he would be able to make it in. Here about 1 out of ever 4 planes actually comes in ontime not delayed. He was delayed for a couple of hours but still made it, although the flight was awful(think prop plane in 60mph+ wind gusts) and he went to bed within an hour of getting in.
I did the same things with listening steps the other day, and that is a big thing here. It was her telling me it was uncomfortable that made me stop and worry. I wonder the same thing...where does pg and quirky end and a diagnosis begin. I don't want a diagnosis and wouldn't seek one unless it became a big problem. Just was wondering if there were some good reading out there. Maybe try some techniques. Shrug. I have decided not to push the eye contact thing so much now that she said how it made her feel, as long as she shows me she is listening.
I
I'm glad he made it in. It has been bad weather lately.
I'm interested in a book recommendation for great manners.
Guess there's a quarterly class for kid's at harvard. I want the DiY Manuel we could practice anywhere.
If you are in the US, the school district has to help you assess. The eye contact issue is a red flag for Asperger's and other autism spectrum disorders, but also for problems with ocular motor control and visual processing, all of which respond best to early intervention. How difficult this assessment will be in terms of what resources are close to you and which ones require travel is another question. Speaking as the parent of a gifted child with all of the aforementioned diagnoses, I don't think there is a down side to having this checked out by knowledgeable professionals. If there is a problem, then you can begin to offer interventions early to help build skills, and if there isn't a problem, then you can stop worrying.
Wow, I went through this not too long ago. I read "Aspergirls" by Rudy Simone and was blown away when I realized that it not only described my daughter to a T but also my mom and myself to a large degree. Then I read the dual diagnosis and misdiagnosis of gifted children book and realized that so many of the traits also come with plain gifties.
We are getting DD17 tested in 2 weeks but only because she really wants to - just to help her understand herself.
As far as the looking at you when you speak, it is great that you are realizing this may be something other than willful rudeness. My DD17 found a trick that has worked wonders for her: she looks at your nose when you speak to her, it's close enough to pass and it isn't so intensely uncomfortable for her. She also learned to meditate to help control the tantrums/meltdowns (which continued well into the teens albeit with less frequency).
My DD always complained about those long tubular fluorescent ceiling lights at school and in our laundry room, she said they made her feel sick because they flicker like a strobe light (even though most people can't tell they are flickering). I have been reading that aspies are much more likely to notice the flickering. Perhaps an unscientific test? I don't notice the flickering so much, its the hum that gets me.
Interesting stuff.
If you are in the US, the school district has to help you assess.
I don't think there is a down side to having this checked out by knowledgeable professionals. If there is a problem, then you can begin to offer interventions early to help build skills, and if there isn't a problem, then you can stop worrying.
Ditto, these.
I agree that it makes sense to have your district evaluate. Write a letter describing your concerns and they MUST evaluate in all areas of suspected disability. If she has trouble with certain social skills, behavioral regulation, flexibility, language, motor skills etc mention these things in the letter. Even if she is at grade level or beyond, she may qualify for help in other realms such as social.
As far as the eye contact - yes it is a red flag for Aspergers and other spectrum disorders. People with ADHD also sometimes with eye contact. From what I have read, it actually helps them to concentrate and block out extra stimuli by looking away. Perhaps you can help your daughter understand when eye contact is essential and let it go when it is not important. It may make her concentrate on other aspects of human relation and conversation that is more salient.
There are many reasons why a person may struggle with making eye contact. Some gifted kids who take in a lot of stimulation at a high level find it hard to attend to all that stimulation at once. Breaking eye contact can make it easier for them to listen and to process verbal information.
Also, some people who are more sensitive and emotionally intense may be picking up a lot of information from looking at your face. Most often when parents say "look me in the eye" it is when they are probably communicating about something that is high in emotions and that may be overwhelming to the child. Also, when eye contact has become such a loaded issue she's already no doubt feeling on the defensive every time she realizes you are upset about it.
If you overall have concerns about her development by all means get her evaluated by someone who understands giftedness.
If the eye contact thing is an isolated concern honestly I would totally leave it alone. If it is a stand alone issue when she's older she can learn ways to modify and cope with it to keep up with the social standard. I would very strongly caution against telling her she's rude or making her responsible for your emotions of upset. That's a pretty big burden for a kid to carry over something like this. I'd instead say something like "people feel differently about eye contact, some people feel uncomfortable about it but they learn to handle it as they get older. It does help me when I'm talking to know that you are listening so let me know if you understand what I'm saying..."
Amazedmom, I think I have mentioned elsewhere my two favorite starter books on Asperger's:
Bashe and Kirby, The OASIS Guide to Asperger Syndrome (and the OASIS website (
http://www.aspergersyndrome.org/Home.aspx )
Sohn and Grayson, Parenting Your Asperger Child.
These are accessible and practical.
I still think that you should make an appointment soon so that you can have your DD evaluated next time you are in the lower 48. An evaluation will cost you a little time and perhaps some money, but knowing what's going on with your DD given your suspicions would be well worth the investment.
DeeDee
Thanks yall....so if we wanted to have her evaluated in the lower 48 when we get off the island what kind of doctor would I need to make an appointment with?
Also, I need to check with our school district. I know that they have evaluators come in, I think it is once a semester for a week from Anchorage. So it has to be schedualed well ahead of time. Things are so different out here. Basically take everything you know of and change it LOL....thats what I have learned in our 4 months here.....
On a funny.... I just got our catalogs for christmas shopping....yes, this week....they all said "please deliver by November 12th" OMG! LOL. Dh got in last night but the plane did not bring any luggage due to weight-(this happens all the time) Last week I heard there was 80TONS of luggage and cargo in anchorage waiting to get here. It could be weeks till we get his luggage LOL.
I'd choose a neuropsychologist or developmental pediatrician in a practice that focuses specifically on the autism spectrum. Preferably one that has seen lots of girls.
We found ours through the autism center of a children's hospital-- that's one way to make sure that they've seen the range of what's out there and are good at drawing the fine distinctions that need to be drawn.
DeeDee
If you think she's PG I would very strongly urge you to have her seen by someone who specializes in gifted kids. PG kids are really developmentally different than the kids most developmental pediatricians or neurologists see on a regular basis. In fact many will have never met a PG kid before and you may get all kinds of wrong information as a result. I would save yourself the time and heartache of a potential misdiagnosis by going to someone who specializes in giftedness in the first place.
In my very limited experience, the most highly qualified people in the autism world are moderately well equipped to understand giftedness; much more than the people I've encountered in the gifted world are equipped to understand autism. Especially autism in a girl, where the rate of under-diagnosis is staggering.
Gifted AS kids often have their disabilities overlooked as PG quirks or excused as OEs by people who are too focused on their giftedness, and then they don't get the help they should.
That's my two cents only, use it as you will.
DeeDee
In my very limited experience, the most highly qualified people in the autism world are moderately well equipped to understand giftedness; much more than the people I've encountered in the gifted world are equipped to understand autism...
Gifted AS kids often have their disabilities overlooked as PG quirks or excused as OEs by people who are too focused on their giftedness, and then they don't get the help they should.
I second the idea that gifted/AS kids' AS symptoms are frequently dismissed as gifted 'quirks' by those who aren't familiar with both, and as a parent, I can tell you that it is very, very tempting to just go with that explanation.
It isn't that I necessarily think the autism specialists will misdiagnose autism if it isn't there. I think you equally run the risk that concerns will be dismissed. Wherever you go it is can be a very tricky diagnosis. There are a lot of HG and PG kids who appear MUCH quirkier as preschoolers than they do later. I don't say this to dismiss the value of getting help because there is a lot of good that can come from it. But, I would also not overlook the very real problems of misdiagnosis.
I wasn't clear from the original poster - what are your limitations in terms of travel and expense? If you have flexibility I would urge you to see somebody who has seen many kids who are both highly gifted and on the spectrum. That's a handful of specialists but I really don't think short of seeing someone who really specializes in 2E kids that you are going to be at all confident in any diagnosis you receive - or that you don't.
I second the idea that gifted/AS kids' AS symptoms are frequently dismissed as gifted 'quirks' by those who aren't familiar with both, and as a parent, I can tell you that it is very, very tempting to just go with that explanation.
One thing I notice is that sometimes people mention the "misdiagnosis" book without noticing it also says "dual diagnosis" in the title. If you read the book it makes it clear that there are kids who have both. I don't at all think the poster should be discouraged from seeking an evaluation if she has worries, but really if the kid is PG and the people evaluating her have had very little or no experience with PG kids that is not the road to getting an accurate evaluation OR to getting a treatment plan that is based on her strengths.
Passthepotatoes,
I agree with everything you have said. My gifted/AS son's very real issues were repeatedly dismissed by professionals who focused on his intellect and failed to take the delays in other areas seriously. Finding people who have experience dealing with 2e is really the best approach, if it is at all possible. We had expressed concerns about my son to medical professionals from the time that he was 2 1/2, and it was three years before anyone took us seriously.
We had expressed concerns about my son to medical professionals from the time that he was 2 1/2, and it was three years before anyone took us seriously.
That's a very frustrating situation. Good for you for persisting until you got answers.
Yeah, I would just really like to Get her. I totally worry about the misdiagnosis thing, I feel it happened with me as a child. I was identified as HG+ and later with anxiety, depression, OCD...and now that I have started to read, Aspergers fit me to a T then and still does. It just wasn't diagnosed hardly at all then. Anyway, I have been trying to understand her since she was an infant. She had a favorite song by 2 months, that she remembers to this day that it made her feel better even though we have never told her that. She was always ON even though she was a premie. I remember at 5 months reading a book about Spirited kids, trying to understand why she never slept, was always on, and was nothing like any of the children we knew and why none of the parenting advice from other mom's and from books never worked for her.
About the travel limitations, we are on an island in the Aleutian Chain in the middle of the Bering Sea. The only way off is plane, and well it is $1000 a person just to get to Anchorage, so travel right now is very limited option. We are going to Louisiana to see my mom this spring though. Before we moved from PA to her, DD was identified by a Developmental Pediatrician as PG, who recommended homeschooling at the time if we stayed in that district and said to prepare for college level material by the age of 10 or so, and we had some testing done with an education specialist who spesialized in gifted kids. So we currently know Verbal IQ, but because of her age have not had her fully assessed. We also know she ceilinged out on the PPVT and at age 3.2 had a verbal receptive age equivilent of 10 years 11 months.
I guess a lot of my concerns stem from her actions and I have no way of knowing what is normal and not...what is just a quirk and what is something more. She uses these made up words and phrases, well typically they are not made up but from obscure phrases in a movie or a TV show (and she only gets about 30 mins of TV a day) but for example, she uses terms like goozymahokas (which apparently she states Candance says on one episode of Phineus and Ferb)and many many other phrase, but they are completely out of context.... and she will just say DUCK randomly when she is uncomfortable with the situation or if someone is talking to her in public and she is uncomfortable. So all of that with the rigid rigid ridgidness she insists on for everything, and the way she yells at others when they don't do things exactly right, especially in her play, and the fact that she plans whole senarios in her head and gets extreamly distraught by them (which I did to) worries me. For example, tonight, well she was in the childcare at the PCR while I was in my knitting group, and when I went to get her, one of the ladies in knitting gave her a piece of chocolate, and asked DD if she wanted her to open it. So DD handed it to her, but then it dropped on the floor when dd was playing and she had a HUGE meltdown about it being open and that she never wanted it opened in the first place, and that she wanted to eat it at home not there. When I finally calmed her down and left, it started right back in the car, but this time it was about the fact that
Dad will never believe me when I tell him the shape. He will never belive it was a christmas tree now, and I can't draw it cause I wont be able to draw the humps, and if I tell dad he will think a christmas tree with balls on it, and he won't believe me. And it is the truth and her wont believe me and I never wanted it opened in the firts place, and now Dad wont believe me!" Oh my it went on for the entire car ride home no matter what I said. She awfulized and awfulized.
Anyway, I love her, love the way she thinks as it always surprises me LOL, I just don't want her to have as many problems as I did growing up because the issues were never found out until I was much older. Thanks for all the advice
She sounds like a wonderful and intense kid and I can see why you are struggling to sort this out. A lot of it sounds familiar to me.
Are you aware it may be possible to get a phone consultation? Given your remote location and your need to plan for a potential visit this spring this might be a good time to give that at try. One possibility might be Dr. Ed Amend. He's one of the authors of the misdiagnosis/dual diagnosis book and has a lot of experience with kids with highly gifted/AS kids.
http://www.amendpsych.com/ http://www.sengifted.org/articles_learning/Amend_AnInterview.shtmlAlso, I'm wondering if it might be a good idea to start a separate thread with a request for any 2E specialists near Louisiana and see if anyone from the area can suggest someone.
I hope you can find answers.
Passthepotatoes-
Hmm, I was not aware that it is possible for phone consultations. How does one go about that? And yep, I think you are right, need to start a thread for 2E specialists near where we are going this spring. Off to do that now.
On another note, I found some checklists for aspergers, and I am printing them out, not noting what they are for and asking Dh to fill one out this weekend, a friend of mine who has spent a great deal of time with DD, and my mom, as well as myself so I can get an more unbias view of what may be going on.
Thanks for all the help.
Wait... stop the train... We were told (by SLP) there's no possibility that DS has aspergers b/c his immaginative play is on target. Ansley is the one who gets frustrated b/c she's way into complex imaginative play, isn't she?
We're wondering a bit about sensory integration stuff, which is still kinda spectrummy, but not the same. Treatment for that seems to be hugs and cuddles, and answering questions using adjectives. So I've started doing that a bit more consiously with DS. It's can't HURT, can it -- extra cuddles and yummy adjectives
(DS doesn't do eye contact quite normally, and has started showing wierd reactions to sounds, and sometimes squinting or covering his eyes -- it's very cute. He sees/hears dogs at about a 1km radius. I can only tell he really heard it because when we meet the dog later, I recognise the bark)
(I found out recently I really did meet the autism criteria, not aspergers when I was (mis)diagnosed, and DH is aspie, so... we were concerned, even when DS was just a splat on my uterine wall)
-Mich
I really do like the chance to chat on here... It's nice to think things through fron a different, and less naval-gazing perspective. Ppl here actaully worry about some of the same stuff as me. Wierd.
Amazedmom, take the online checklists with a grain of salt; no substitute for expert evaluation.
Imaginative play: this issue too requires expert teasing out. It is a mistake to think that people with AS have no imaginative play at all. Some kids with AS actually have elaborate fantasy worlds and imaginative play. The difference between these and typical kids is usually that the play is heavily scripted and inflexible (others can't participate unless they are "doing it right")-- or highly repetitive, or both. See Sohn and Grayson's book on the "fantasy boy" type of AS.
DeeDee
Mich- Yep you are right which is the one thing that doesnt fit...Although her play, while imaginative, it can be extreamly repatative and often comes from something she has seen, read, or heard about. For example, she was the virgin Mary while my mom was here, and we had to be the inn keepers and we had to start over upteen times because we didn't do it exactly right, however once we did, she played the same thing (put a bowl in her shirt, knock on the door, ask for room, we say no, tell her about the stable, She asks if it is to small, she goes and has a baby, brings out the baby doll while bowl drops out of dress, then comes and says "look at my baby" we say wow, whats his name, Jesus she says, then we had to ask how she named him that, and she says "An angel of the lord told me to" and does a whole speel) Then she does this over again from start to finsh for an entire hour or more....more than 30 times the exact same thing. This happens ALL the time.
I alternate between ADHD (but she can concentrate and focus when she wants, but she has to be doing other things to. DH and I have ALWAYS said, while she can do any puzzle, she probably couldn't do the simplest one if you made her sit still and be quite during it. Even when she is focused on a task, she is standing on one leg, twirling around, singing constantly, or talking about something that has nothing to do with the thing she is doing), Aspergers, but she plays and doesn't fit that 100 percent I dont think, but I don't know, Seneory issues, I have no clue. I was a family therapist before having her and I just know something is different, but I have no way of knowing how to seperate it from the giftedness
There is a chance of having her evaluated her. My teacher friend said the psych for the school district is comming end of Jan. She is talking to the couselor and sped teacher tomorrow to see if we can get Ansley eval by them even though she is not in the school system. OUr choice right now since they do offer preschool, but its not a good fit. It is an academic based where they seperate 3 and 4, and the 4's are just learning letters, and the 3's learn colors and shapes. DD asked not to go after observing. She would much rather spend the day doing 2nd grade math, and reading chapter books, and 3rd grade science. So I dont know if they have to eval or not. Hopefully I will know something tomorrow either way.
Although her play, while imaginative, it can be extreamly repatative and often comes from something she has seen, read, or heard about... Then she does this over again from start to finsh for an entire hour or more....more than 30 times the exact same thing. This happens ALL the time.
It's hard to know what sort of play is to be expected for your daughter, age appropriate? Academic level appropriate? But I don't think that her sort of imaginative play 'rules out' AS in any way. Many people with AS also have sensory issues as well as the behaviors of ADHD. The problem is that although people expect folks with AS to have 'above average IQ' there is basically almost no data on folks who have PG range IQs. I would read Dee Lovecky's book 'Different Minds' as she is one who has studied AS and ADHD in gifted kids.
I see ADHD as a 'slower than normal' developmental path in developing executive function skills. Having the diagnosis of ADHD says nothing about where the person will finish their growth, only that they are a few years behind in this area. But it did take me into my 40s to get the routines down to keep a decluttered home.
Likewise I've read that AS is a 'slower than normal' developmental path in learning certain social skills. You may have experienced this yourself in your own life. We all always grow and change - hopefully into a fuller version of ourselves, but not in a straight line path. If your daughter does have 'clinically diagnosable' AS that says nothing about what she will be like at age 10, 20 or 30. Especially with her LOG. Realize that all the future predicting works pretty well for folks who are within a standard deviation of normal IQ, so the experts won't even know that they don't know.
If she is doing 3rd grade math at her age, you know for sure that she isn't following any 'typical' path of development in at least that one area. I would read up on AS, but always take it with a grain of salt about what the future will bring. Concentrate on learning about how other families have handled various issues well in the moment.
When my son was first IQ tested he was misdiagnosed as having NVLD. I do resent it that my psychologist didn't level with me that my son was an outlier and send me right away to a gifted specialist, but I learn tons of 'super-parenting' tricks from those books, even though it was a misdiagnosis!
As a baby and preschooler, my son made it very clear how he wanted things. I wish you all had been around to remind me that because he is
good at communicating what he wants isn't a reason to avoid the tantrum and
always do it his way. It might have been that he 'needed' lots of practice in 'handling his strong feelings.' But that isn't the person I was then, and I had no gifted support at all until he was 8 years old. Now that I realize that we can be completely close and connected without having to steer around so much of life, he's feeling stronger about himself, and my 'job'as Mom is totally different. As always it's a slow path from where you are to where you are going.
Love and More Love,
Grinity
(I was a little worried someone was going to say something like that.)
There is a chance of having her evaluated her. My teacher friend said the psych for the school district is comming end of Jan. She is talking to the couselor and sped teacher tomorrow to see if we can get Ansley eval by them even though she is not in the school system. OUr choice right now since they do offer preschool, but its not a good fit. It is an academic based where they seperate 3 and 4, and the 4's are just learning letters, and the 3's learn colors and shapes. DD asked not to go after observing. She would much rather spend the day doing 2nd grade math, and reading chapter books, and 3rd grade science. So I don't know if they have to eval or not. Hopefully I will know something tomorrow either way.
It seems like it would be in the school's best interest to get an idea of how they could help your dd now for planning purposes even though she is not "old" enough.
No matter what her dx could be, if any, I wonder if OT would help. It certainly gives kids the chance to play in a safe environment. Something like the How Does Your Engine Run program could help regulate her energy levels. There is a book available on Amazon called Take Five that uses the HDYER ideas which I found helpful when we were doing supplemental OT at home last summer.
Modulated listening therapy seems to help with eye contact and regulation issues. It needs to be overseen by an OT, but the therapy is done at home. Maybe there would be a way to have the school district set you up with long distance OT and meet over Skype and oversee some programs like this which are helpful for broad populations of kids.
Hi Amanda,
Oh how I empathize with the puzzle you are trying to solve. It is very difficult to unravel giftedness from other possible explanations.
The play scene you described with baby Jesus sounds very familar. My DD4 will fixate on certain characters and needs storylines to be very specific, sometimes following a book's storyline. She can make leaps and change things, but she can do the same story again and again and I have flat out told her I cannot keep doing the same thing and sadly, no other child is going to share the same interest for as long as she does. This issue arises during playdates. We have begun an evaluation, and she has had one appointment so far which specifically was looking at Aspergers signs and so far, the psych said she saw "many good things" which was vague, but encouraging.
Her behavior can look like ADHD too, but sensory issues can create over-stimulated behavior. She CAN focus, but she is very silly and almost too happy if that makes any sense. She often seems more UP than most kids. She is never down or mopey for any extended period.
There are some differences between our girls, but a number of things sound similar so I will keep you updated on what we are finding out. As I said before, my DD does go to OT and I think it has been very helpful for her.
Best of luck to you.
She CAN focus, but she is very silly and almost too happy if that makes any sense. She often seems more UP than most kids. She is never down for or mopey for any extended period.
I have never heard my DD described quite so well. That is her...to a T! She has her meltdowns, but otherwise, she is very silly, and yes the almost too happy makes sense. It is a hard to describe thing, but I KNOW exactly what you are talking about. She is so wound, ALL THE TIME. She is always bouncing, moving, and twirling even when talking or focusing on something else. I have wondered if this and they eye contact thing is the same thing. She is uncomfortable in social situations so when she has to talk she spins, wiggles, does the splits, anything to avoid having to have an actual conversation. That is something I noticed today, but she does it all the time to.
Sigh, I would like a moment of calm LOL.
Yes, please do let me know what you have found.
yes, when my DD has her meltdowns or her "over-reactions" they are just as extreme, but a majority of the time she appears very happy: sing-songy skipping happy. It is funny but I have said to my DH something about needing her to "sober up" for a moment (obviously joking since she is four).
My DD does not struggle with social interaction on the surface--she smiles and greets people and that sort of thing--but has come on too strong, been a "space invader," talked too loud, and tried to push her ideas on others.
There are a few things that quiet and settle my DD a bit: drawing and Playdough. She makes things from Playdough on a daily basis. Of course she often makes characters that then act out the scenarios that can drive me bonkers, but it does seem to settle her (back to the sensory issues).
I know exactly what it is like to be with a child who is just running on HIGH all the time. There are days it literally overwhelms MY senses. I have a feeling you know what I mean.
Oh man, yes. I cried yesterday because I have been so overwhelmed.
You described my DD to a T. Ansley struggles at times with the social, but when she does do the social she is too strong, talks too loud, and is just too silly!
Your comments about eye contact really struck me.
The eye contact issue is a good example of how we can be making things worse for people with an ASD when we are only trying to help them. You start with someone who feels anxiety when they look you in the eye then you make them feel anxious (unintentionally) because they feel less than adequate for not being able to look you in they eye. Just like that you have doubled the anxiety that the person associates with eye contact. It can become a vicious circle.
Please don't misinterpret my comments as a criticism. I just want to give readers some food for thought. Many others may have different experiences, but I want to share mine.
I suffer from eye contact issues and my son has been diagnosed with an ASD. I too used to see a lack of eye contact as a character flaw rather than something being caused by having a brain that works differently than most. Even though I knew how difficult it was for me to look people in the eye, I still got frustrated with my own DS for not looking people in the eye.
I have suffered with a generalized anxiety disorder for the last 20 years. After my DS was diagnosed with an ASD, and I realized that I too have many of the characteristics of an ASD, I cut us both some slack (not just regarding eye contact) and we are way better for it. I will never again feel bad for not being able to make eye contact. Never again will I expect my son to make eye contact. That is just us - take it or leave it. (It sounds like you have already cut you DD some slack no matter what is causing her difficulty with eye contact)
I know that many people with ASD can learn to overcome this difficulty, but my DS and I have greater difficulties to deal with. In the grand scheme of things I now fail to see the importance of looking people in the eye. I believe it is important to adhere to most of society's norms, but a lot of them are not worth making anyone miserable over.
In the grand scheme of things I now fail to see the importance of looking people in the eye. I believe it is important to adhere to most of society's norms, but a lot of them are not worth making anyone miserable over.
I think it depends on what other skills are present/missing, and what your short and long term goals are. And whether you are talking about short or long term misery.
A lot of the teaching we have done with DS has made him uncomfortable at first. Autism/Asperger's boxes a person in, makes them rigid and unwilling to try new things or things that are difficult. Our position in raising our child has been that we are going to get him out of his box to the fullest extent that we can. And yes, I am as appalled as anyone at parts of the Tiger Mother thread, but there are times when it is worth some short term discomfort for long term gain.
DS has learned over some years to make reasonable eye contact; to go into the woods (which terrified him previously); to apologize when he's offended someone; and countless other things he used to hate to do. One can learn these skills. We have found them worth learning because one of our goals for him is that he be employed and independent someday, which will undoubtedly mean an interview where he makes eye contact (and many other skills, too).
If you are a person for whom the process of learning this skill makes you miserable over years, not days or weeks, then you might decide it's not worth it at this point in your learning, or else change your approach to learning it.
The strategy of teaching matters; we won't torture our kid, but we will firmly insist that he practice things that are hard, for a little while at a time, and reward his efforts, until they are easier and eventually mastered.
DeeDee