We have a son who scored well on his IQ test (144 overall on a testing day where he was actually quite ill) - and is very outgoing, super bright, and funny. We had him interview at a gifted school and although he was bright enough by IQ scores and academic assessment (he place on 2nd grade reading and math - even though he is in pre-k), they felt he lacked maturity. We are worried that the school might have an issue with his personality, more than his maturity - as he seems like a very normal child of his age. Not sure weather to wait a year and reapply or not. Anyone seen any kind of this supposed asynchronicity in their kids, meaning normal maturity kid w/high scores and faced this kind of issue from gifted program? Not sure what to do?

My son is 5 (pre-k). We thought about early entry to kinder last fall... and realized although mentally more than capable.. maturity wise he is no where ready. I wonder if he was with kids that are at his intellectual age would his emotional age increase. We have not had him tested (its not financially feasible) but he completes my 1st graders enrichment math and reads at about an beginning 1st grader.

So to answer your question... yes it is very possible

hth
Sheila

Lacked the maturity to sit still for a full day of 'easy-peasy' work, where he learns very little, like his big sister? ((Just guessing here!))
In that case they are doing you a favor!

Flexibility is what you need from a school. Same old same old at a slightly earlier age isn't the same as actually being willing to analyse what the child's learnig level is and bringing him to the classroom that is a match.

Especially if your son doesn't seem immature at home, I think that they are pulling your leg.

Grinity

I think they like stereotypical bookworms and our dc is very outgoing and questions a lot. I think what they called immaturity is really more of a personality issue as he is actually in school now and has zero maturity issues ever mentioned - in fact is seen as a very studious kid. We are concerned b/c he needs the differentiation they offer (the gifted school) - but are worried that they will try to squash his personality. He is already 3 yrs above grade level, and other privates seem to be a bit put off trying to meet him where he is at - and instead want to deal with him as a typical 5 yo and ignore the fact that he is so far ahead - but those schools are better suited for his personality type...loving the strong, outgoing leader type. So we are VERY confused.

DS is suppose to be in Pre-K actually, but got skipped to K and is finishing K this year. Do you think we should place him in our public 1st grade (which will be repeating some of the material as his current K is about 1 yrs advanced) - which is crowded (like 28-30 kids) or put him in a private that is about $20K - tha is likely going to be non academic as he will HAVE to redo K next year..but will be 12 kids or so. Public he will be much much younger than everyone and smaller, but he will have be a bit more better fit academically. Private will have a much nicer environment, less kids, more extras but basically repeat a K program AND that is totally not academic like his current K.

Red flags are flying when I read the gifted school's comment. I wouldn't want my DD in that school because of all the schools you would think they would understand asynchronous development.

Question: Does his present school not continue on past K or is it not an option for other reasons?

Okay, more questions: In our state they won't consider Kindergarten placement in private school and would require the child to repeat kindergarten but if the child completes 1st grade in private the public school has no problem allowing them into 2nd no matter their age. It seems like your state is opposite. So why would this other private force him to repeat K? Can they not administer an assessment for placement?

Your two choices you presented are hard ones. I would hate to have my DD redo a grade when she is already so advanced yet I shutter at the idea of her in such big classes but this has more to do with her personality. If your son is a very social kid it might be okay. I really feel for you ... that is a tough choice.

Our son is in private K now and the other private we would move him to would want him to repeat K.

The reason we are moving him is that we had some issues with his past teacher for the usual stuff - hated us b/c we asked that she please differentiate for him as he was refusing to go to school because of the work he was forced to do daily (workbooks on Abc's - when the kids is completely reading...like 2nd grade-3rd grade books). Anyway - the teacher yelled at us and I felt really hurt our son for a time being. We ended up moving classes, but she is still there and is one of the owners..so I am not sure what this will mean if we kept him. The school does go to 3rd.

As far as my dd's gifted school (the school we wanted ds in). The school said we should bring ds back next Jan and reconsider him - as his scores are so high. They say he just needs to mature. The gifted school does a stellar job accelerating for the kids but the teachers yell, and its very rote learning and the atmosphere is kind of rigid. Parents are not allowed to be involved at all (super white tower philosophy). But its the only real gifted game in town..and I have these 2 kids and feel worried about pursuing anything else - even though this school is so wrong for them both in so many ways.

I have started to feel like raising"gifted kids", as far as schooling goes, is really no gift at all

I don't think either of those choices sounds appealing at all.

Have you ever considered homeschooling or self-paced virtual schooling? Is there some reason why this would be impossible for your family? If you are sending him to school for the social aspect, there are plenty of opportunities for homeschooled kids to socialize with other children, and with scores this high, it is really unlikely that you are going to find a school that is going to move at the pace and intensity that he will probably want to go at.

It might only need to be a temporary situation, until he reaches an age where the schools will admit and place him based on achievement level, not age.

Wow wolfson! (((((BIG HUGS))))) I think you need it. You really don't sound like you have many options and that gifted school sounds awful! How is your DD doing in that school? Does she like it? Even if it is a good fit for her it might not be the best place for your son.

We have a gifted school here but I see it as my last resort. My DD goes to a Spanish Immersion program which is academically 2 years ahead of public schools. We have signed her up for Kindergarten for this next year but my husband is still very hesitant about if the school will continue to challenge her since her challenge has been the foreign language component and that is no longer a challenge. He wants us to look into the catholic school but I just hate the thought of losing foreign language. I'm thankful that we do have some options but even here we are limited due to DD's LOG.

I really hope you can find another option for your son and I second the idea of homeschooling if this is even a possibility for you. I would prefer that option over huge public school classrooms or repeating kindergarten in private plus you can take the money you were planning on using to pay his private tuition and hire tutors and/or mentors for him. Homeschooling doesn't necessarily mean you have to be the one teaching him. Just a thought.

yes - considering homeschooling as well. he is very very social - and has been in a school environment or a while..so would be big change...am researching homeschooling as well. i know it will be better for him in many ways, but i also know that he would become incredibly accelerated - he learns very quickly and i am a bit worried that this 3 year gap between his age and ability will continue to expand...that next year I will have a child technically ready for 1st but on a 5th grade reading level and 3rd or 4th grade math. i never know with these kids what's right to do frankly...slow them down, work at their pace...never know what serves them best. any opinions on this. i feel with both my kids (as is the case with many of these kids) - it is like a bottomless well that needs and wants to be filled, so the compulsion is to fill it, but then they become harder to serve in the school systems. what do you think of this issue? god - its so good to have a place to discuss this...so happy i found this board!

Wolfson, if you had a kid who was healthy, but growing really fast, and who was taller and stronger than almost all of the other kids his age, would you consider not feeding him at all, or maybe only feeding him enough for him to stay alive, but not grow, in an attempt to "keep him with his age peers" and make it easier to shop for him in the children's department?

Why do we look at intellectual development any differently than we look at physical development? Depriving gifted children of opportunities to learn and to work hard while doing so has much more negative consequences than providing them with the level of pace and challenge that they are capable of. All of the research on acceleration shows that it greatly benefits children who need it. Those who are good candidates for it and don't get it seriously suffer in both achievement and self-esteem.

1st grade at 3rd or 4th grade math isn't as scary as it sounds. My 1st grader is doing a virtual academy and started the year with 3rd grade math. It took until halfway through for him to get to something new and slow down a bit. He is now a few units into the 4th grade math and we are definitely taking it slower - as we're finding he has forgotten some of what he learned earlier this year due to lack of practice (multi digit multiplication mainly).
I thought we'd never hit a point where we would slow down but it just naturally happened right about the midway point of 3rd grade math.

He is really enjoying the virtual academy and that he can go at his own pace - which so far means he completed all of LA, Science, and History for 1st grade as well as Math for 3rd grade. LA is still 'too easy' but he is enjoying it for the most part (except the composition parts but that's because he does not like to write!) and he'd do Science every day if I let him but I don't really want a 2nd grade in 4th or 5th grade science so we just read a of science books instead!

I think you say it best - you can try to 'go wide' if you homeschool, but spending a lot of energy trying to keep them fitting in a school system (when they never fit in the first place) seems like a dangerous waste of everyone's energy. Of course I did as you are doing, and didn't like what I reaped.

When the compulsion is replaced by a dull eyed stare, and the child says 'Is this what you want Mommy, I'm trying to please you' It kinda rips one's heart out.

Any families you've met from DD's school that would join you in an informal mini-school for their younger sibs?

Love and More Love,
Grinity

You and me both!!


I'll tell you straight up that if I had a way to talk to the parent of my five year old child, I'd tell her in no uncertain terms to stay AWAY from schools like those you've described...

sure, give the virtual school a shot, but don't let it have your soul.

KWIM?

I'd probably have kept homeschooling, honestly. Or maybe started again in middle school, three years ago.

Like Grinity says, I don't know that I can serve as much of an example. More like a warning to others.

Your son sounds somewhat like my DD at that age. It's a tremendous gift to kids like that to just let them BE WHO THEY ACTUALLY ARE. Will that gap continue to widen? Yes, perhaps it will.

But think about what that means in terms of a rigid, inflexible school placement, too:

every year that passes, the curriculum will fit less and less well. As that happens, the child's MG/ND peers will seem to be as happy and well-served as ever, leading a HG child to realize that there is something wrong, (it can't be the school/curriculum, since nobody else seems to have a problem with it-- so that leaves the problem being with themselves). This can give that child the sense of being trapped in a dead-end job with enthusiastic coworkers who seem to relish each day.

Please think about that. And, if you like, read my cautionary tale about perfectionism and my 11yo DD. We thought that we could "slow her down" too, and at least not continue to widen the gap. Well, it worked. Sort of. She's now WELL beyond most high school level material in literature and the humanities... and well into high school material in the physical sciences and mathematics... and she's never learned any study skills and thinks that she SHOULD earn 100% on every bit of graded work she completes, or she's a worthless failure, maybe even dumb. She's miserable and so are we.

Yes, this is very sad. But it isn't the point.

The point is that a GOOD FIT isn't just about how good it will be in five years. It's also about how healthy your child's self-image will be at that point. How much will he still love learning? Will he have learned that school is a place of punishment and rigid rules? Or a place of joy and learning?

If you have a way to let your son BE the very young boy that he is, and simultaneously feed his needs as a HG learner... do it.

The one thing that we've done right for our DD is to allow her to be the asynchronous creature that she is. Childhood is too short not to enjoy being a little child. Even if you also happen to be a little child who likes advanced physics or Shakespearean sonnets. It doesn't mean you can't play light sabers with the neighbors when you're ready for some down time.

Home education (full or part-time) allows for that kind of thing in kids that are REALLY asynchronous. It's a tremendous thing to be told "She's so-- normal." when people meet your gregarious PG child for the first time.

Oh, this describes my now 10 year old son very well. He is also extroverted, outgoing, loves to talk about everything, love to make people laugh. Ready for high level of input, maybe a little above grade level output. Our local gifted school is very much a bright/MG school and not really a great fit for HG+ kids. He went to public school for 2 years and that was quite disastrous.

We are now homeschooling and it's been great for my HG+, asynchronous kid(s). We do many outside of the house activities and live in an urban area, so he gets plenty of social. We are fairly laid back homeschoolers, but both our kids are wildly ahead of grade level and have plenty of time to explore far and wide. It's been a great fit for us. Both kids love learning and are learning how to face difficulties and challenges.

It felt like jumping off a cliff starting, but 3 years in, it was definitely the best decision. We'll see where the future takes us! We re-evaluate every so often.

Wow, this sounds so much like our experience. My DS was shouted at in school (private K) by a teacher too. We started homeschooling soon after and haven't looked back.

You see when we started homeschooling the whole giftedness issue wasn't an issue because I was clueless for the longest time. I pulled him out because he was miserable but I hadn't connected the dots about giftedness then. My 8yo is now breezing through 8th grade level work at home. He wants to go higher but I can't keep up so I'm keeping him at that level for now.

Asynchronous? Oh yeah! Only just learned to ride a bike. Still can't climb playground structures and he doesn't have physical disabilities. Not at all a nerdy type though he can bury himself in books (even literally so). Always laughing. Always making the silliest jokes. Can't look serious to save himself.

The bottomless well will get filled. Their ability to learn will keep expanding and expanding but you don't really run out of things to expose them to. For example, he outpaced my ability to teach science a long time ago so I found a tutor who works with college students and DS and tutor get on famously. They discuss not only science concepts but real-life stuff, office politics, work experience, math tricks, all in an age appropriate setting...it's awesome to watch them together. If you live close to a good college, bring him to their public talks and programs, visit museums, or just let him loose on the internet with parental controls in place...there's just so much to learn!

If you need to dicuss homeschooling I'd love to chat more. Wishing you lots of luck with this!

I would love to chat more about it! It was never really something I thought about, but it's seeming like it would be really good for our family!

PM me if you like Amber! Take care!

I just have to say, I keep coming back to this. It really hit home with me. Thanks for sharing, H.K.:)