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Posted By: Bostonian Gauging the intelligence of infants - 04/11/14 09:52 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/08/science/gauging-the-intelligence-of-infants.html
Gauging the Intelligence of Infants
by KENNETH CHANG
New York Times
April 7, 2014

Quote
The claim about babies was startling: A test administered to infants as young as 6 months could predict their score on an intelligence test years later, when they started school.

“Why not test infants and find out which of them could take more in terms of stimulation?” Joseph F. Fagan III, the psychologist at Case Western Reserve University in Cleveland who developed the test, was quoted as saying in an article by Gina Kolata on April 4, 1989. “It’s not going to hurt anybody, that’s for sure.”

In the test, the infant looks at a series of photographs — first a pair of identical faces, then the same face paired with one the baby hasn’t seen. The researchers measure how long the baby looks at the new face.

“On the surface, it tests novelty preference,” said Douglas K. Detterman, a colleague of Dr. Fagan’s at Case Western.

For reasons not quite understood, babies of below-average intelligence do not exhibit the same attraction to novelty.

Dr. Fagan suggested that the test could be used to identify children with above-average intelligence in poorer families so they could be exposed to enrichment programs more readily available to wealthier families.

But his primary motivation, said Cynthia R. Holland, his wife and longtime collaborator, was to look for babies at the other end of the intelligence curve, those who would fall behind as they grew up.

“His hope was always was to identify early on, in the first year of life, kids who were at risk, cognitively, so we could focus our resources on them and help them out,” said Dr. Holland, a professor of psychology at Cuyahoga Community College.

25 YEARS LATER For the most part, the validity of the Fagan test holds up. Indeed, Dr. Fagan (who died last August) and Dr. Holland revisited infants they had tested in the 1980s, and found that the Fagan scores were predictive of the I.Q. and academic achievement two decades later when these babies turned 21.
Posted By: indigo Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 04/12/14 12:10 AM
Also of interest in this article:
Quote
For the last decade of his life, Dr. Fagan was unexpectedly drawn into the “genes versus environment” debate over intelligence after he found that babies from widely different cultural backgrounds performed equally well on his test. That, he argued, undercut the argument for a biological basis for the stark “achievement gap” between white and black children, or rich and poor.

In a chapter in “The Cambridge Handbook of Intelligence”, co-edited by Dr. Kaufman and published in 2011, Dr. Fagan wrote, “A parsimonious explanation for the findings is that later differences in I.Q. between different racial-ethnic groups may spring from differences in cultural exposure to information past infancy, not from group differences in the basic ability to process information.”
Posted By: madeinuk Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 04/12/14 01:10 AM
This

Quote
Dr. Fagan (who died last August) and Dr. Holland revisited infants they had tested in the 1980s, and found that the Fagan scores were predictive of the I.Q. and academic achievement two decades later when these babies turned 21.

Seems to be at odds with this

Quote
Dr. Fagan wrote, “A parsimonious explanation for the findings is that later differences in I.Q. between different racial-ethnic groups may spring from differences in cultural exposure to information past infancy, not from group differences in the basic ability to process information.”

Unless all of the neonates that scored well and then went on to have high IQs and achievements 2 decades later all had the good luck to be raised in high SES and privileged environments. Am I missing something here?
Posted By: puffin Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 04/12/14 01:20 AM
In most cases providing an enriched environment for an infant is not dependant on income (the exceptions being work and poor childcare due to finances and medical/housing problems resulting in too much stress/depression and actual food povery). Babies need to be talked to, interacted with, loved and fed. They don't need expensive classes butthey do need a mother willing and able to mother (or someone else), and preferably a safe place to explore. My oldest didn't learn to roll until 6 months - I had post natal depression, it was winter and the floor was too cold to lie on and we had a rat problem. He learnt shortly after i returned to work and he went to home based care full time. Ds4 learned to roll at 12 weeks or less - i had not post natal depression, the house was warm and sunny with carpet on the floors and no rats. But i always talked to them and cuddled and played with them.

The oldest has a higher IQ.
Posted By: aquinas Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 04/12/14 03:01 AM
Originally Posted by Bostonian
“Why not test infants and find out which of them could take more in terms of stimulation?”

This line made me laugh. From my limited experience with DS, a child who can take more stimulation might just outright demand it. In DS' case, vociferously. He literally screamed for 5 hours straight or longer at night when we tried to settle him. Most nights, I was up until 2 or 3am with a 3 or 4 month old who insisted on books. At 5 months, when he said, "read book", we clued in that he wanted to be read to the whole time instead of sleeping, and everything fell into place nicely (including sleep). No test needed. We eventually found an alternate settling routine: running through the house carrying DS, naming everything in sight in rapid fire speech, usually for 20-30 mins.

So, while DS may not be a typical case, he's an example of the lengths a highly motivated child will go to to secure sufficient stimulation!
Posted By: HowlerKarma Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 04/12/14 04:43 AM
Whoahhhhh-- my daughter, on the other hand, responded SO strongly to over-stimulation that she could not be soothed as a newborn, and was incredibly upset for hours over too much holding, too much visual input, too much light, too much sound, too-much of pretty much anything. Sitting in a cool, quiet, dim room was the only way to shut it off once she got going.

Sensory OE, much? OH YEAH. Evident from birth. Everything was (and has always been) very much on her terms.
Posted By: indigo Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 04/12/14 08:34 PM
Originally Posted by madeinuk
This

Quote
Dr. Fagan (who died last August) and Dr. Holland revisited infants they had tested in the 1980s, and found that the Fagan scores were predictive of the I.Q. and academic achievement two decades later when these babies turned 21.
Seems to be at odds with this

Quote
Dr. Fagan wrote, “A parsimonious explanation for the findings is that later differences in I.Q. between different racial-ethnic groups may spring from differences in cultural exposure to information past infancy, not from group differences in the basic ability to process information.”
... Am I missing something here?
In reading the full article, the results are described as being predictive in aggregate, not at an individual level.

The article was a 25-year retrospective on a 2-part test:
1- test of novelty for babies
2- follow-up IQ test at age 21

The results were:
1- The article described that "babies from widely different cultural backgrounds performed equally well on his test."
2- The results of the follow-up IQ test at age 21 describes that results were consistent in aggregate, not at an individual level.

His thoughts penned in 2011 seemed to contemplate why the follow-up test was predictive in aggregate and not at an individual level.

Just my 2 cents.
Posted By: Mahagogo5 Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/03/14 05:21 AM
Originally Posted by HowlerKarma
Whoahhhhh-- my daughter, on the other hand, responded SO strongly to over-stimulation that she could not be soothed as a newborn, and was incredibly upset for hours over too much holding, too much visual input, too much light, too much sound, too-much of pretty much anything. Sitting in a cool, quiet, dim room was the only way to shut it off once she got going.

Sensory OE, much? OH YEAH. Evident from birth. Everything was (and has always been) very much on her terms.

I couldn't believe it when DS could only be settled in the first few months by lying him on the hard cold floor - I thought he hated me!!!
Posted By: cammom Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/03/14 12:36 PM
My DS7 was a quivering ball of rage as an infant. I once saw him (I kid you not) put another 12 month old in a headlock when he wanted a toy.
Posted By: 2GiftedKids Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/03/14 12:43 PM
My daughter was two weeks old and forcefully lifting her head to look around. I was told by a doctor that babies that young aren't supposed to be able to do that. Where there's a will, there's a way!
Posted By: notnafnaf Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/03/14 01:46 PM
When DD was born, she did not cry much - which concerned us, but the nurses said she was fine - she was born very alert and scowling at everyone with a "what the heck?!?" look.

DS head butted DH in his first week in a rage because DH was not me (he wanted to nurse and I had stepped out for a second).

DS was not motivated to move until he was ready and certain he was not going to fall or hit something, but he figured out how to get everyone else to carry him everywhere (including the director of our daycare, who would take him everywhere as an infant - as soon as he saw her walk by, he would wave and do everything to get her attention so she would pick him up and take him on her rounds).
Posted By: notnafnaf Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/03/14 01:53 PM
Originally Posted by cammom
My DS7 was a quivering ball of rage as an infant. I once saw him (I kid you not) put another 12 month old in a headlock when he wanted a toy.

another baby wanted DD's toy when she was around 10 months, and came over to try to grab it. The teachers saw his mouth go on her arm, but she said nothing, and had no change in her grim determined look on her face, so they thought nothing of it... and she refused to let go of her toy. The other baby crawled away, and then a little later, the teacher picked her up to change her and saw the bite mark on her arm, realized that the other baby did bite her after all - she just refused to let go.

She had gotten bitten a few more times after that by a few other babies and toddlers - but it never worked on her, she just refuses to let go of whatever her toy is (and she had a really strong grip).

and she used to crawl up to another baby as an infant, pull their pacifier out, and see what they would do. When they started to cry, she would try to pop the pacifier back in (she hated pacifiers herself and never used one). The teachers used to laugh because no other baby did that - usually other babies pull out the pacifier to suck on it themselves, not see what the reaction would be.
Posted By: Dude Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/03/14 02:17 PM
Originally Posted by 2GiftedKids
My daughter was two weeks old and forcefully lifting her head to look around. I was told by a doctor that babies that young aren't supposed to be able to do that. Where there's a will, there's a way!

DD9 did this on day one (though in her case it looked less "forceful" than "casual", and she held it up for several seconds before lying back down), which I witnessed just a few hours after she popped her own shoulder and arm out of DW (injuring DW in the process), and attempted to use her liberated arm to push herself out the rest of the way. We still have the gasps of astonishment from the assembled medical professionals on tape.

DD would make an interesting case study for gauging the strength of infants, as she still has much more muscle mass than her age peers. Watching other kids try to push her off the ball in soccer is quite entertaining.
Posted By: Ivy Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/03/14 10:01 PM
DD11 presented as way more PG as an infant than she does now (where most people seem to assume she's a small, bright, 13-year-old). Even though she was our only and we didn't have a lot of interaction with other babies, it was pretty clear that she was way ahead of the normal milestones.
Posted By: Tigerle Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/04/14 04:42 PM
Originally Posted by indigo
Originally Posted by madeinuk
This

Quote
Dr. Fagan (who died last August) and Dr. Holland revisited infants they had tested in the 1980s, and found that the Fagan scores were predictive of the I.Q. and academic achievement two decades later when these babies turned 21.
Seems to be at odds with this

Quote
Dr. Fagan wrote, “A parsimonious explanation for the findings is that later differences in I.Q. between different racial-ethnic groups may spring from differences in cultural exposure to information past infancy, not from group differences in the basic ability to process information.”
... Am I missing something here?
In reading the full article, the results are described as being predictive in aggregate, not at an individual level.

The article was a 25-year retrospective on a 2-part test:
1- test of novelty for babies
2- follow-up IQ test at age 21

The results were:
1- The article described that "babies from widely different cultural backgrounds performed equally well on his test."
2- The results of the follow-up IQ test at age 21 describes that results were consistent in aggregate, not at an individual level.

His thoughts penned in 2011 seemed to contemplate why the follow-up test was predictive in aggregate and not at an individual level.

Just my 2 cents.


Also note that the original quote refers only to IQ differences based on ethnic and racial background NOT differences based on SES. The journalist added "rich or poor" after "white and black". This is not actually the same thing. They may have controlled for parental SES and found that there is no ethnic-racial difference in infancy. There may be one even after controlling for parental SES at the age of 21 because there is a vast difference in other environmental SES factors apart from parental status for children of different ethnicities, such as school SES, neighbourhood SES and group culture.
Posted By: Tigerle Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/04/14 04:44 PM
And to supply a fun anecdote as well, DS2 (2 today!), due to a major birth defect, was born via scheduled C-section and immediately taken away by a pediatric team for medical care. My husband was allowed along and took pictures and a short video. He swears DS2 looked at the camera with interest at the age of 23 minutes. I swear I can see it in the pictures.
Posted By: NotSoGifted Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/04/14 05:38 PM
Don't know if this had anything to do with intelligence or just liking dessert...

Eldest DD went to a day care with kids 0-3 years old all in one large room. When she was about 11 or 12 months, she could walk, but it was easier to put her in the walker with a tray at snack time than to have her around the older kids. Babies like her got Cheerios for snack, but the older ones got cookies. The staff wouldn't let her use the walker anymore after she pulled this stunt a few times - get that walker rolling fast, crash into kid holding cookie, kid is stunned, grab cookie and eat.
Posted By: aquinas Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/04/14 09:59 PM
Originally Posted by Tigerle
And to supply a fun anecdote as well, DS2 (2 today!), due to a major birth defect, was born via scheduled C-section and immediately taken away by a pediatric team for medical care. My husband was allowed along and took pictures and a short video. He swears DS2 looked at the camera with interest at the age of 23 minutes. I swear I can see it in the pictures.

Happy birthday to your DS2!
Posted By: Dude Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/06/14 02:08 PM
Originally Posted by Tigerle
And to supply a fun anecdote as well, DS2 (2 today!), due to a major birth defect, was born via scheduled C-section and immediately taken away by a pediatric team for medical care. My husband was allowed along and took pictures and a short video. He swears DS2 looked at the camera with interest at the age of 23 minutes. I swear I can see it in the pictures.

I believe you 100%.

I began reading to my DD each night while she was in the womb, and I always began by saying her name twice, in a particular, sing-song way. I was doing this with a purpose, waiting to see how she would react when she came out.

We were still in the delivery room, the nurses had finished doing all their highly-invasive things to her, they wrapped her up, and placed her, still protesting loudly, in my arms. I said her name in that sing-song way. She immediately stopped wailing, and locked her eyes on mine. I was rocking her back and forth, and as she moved, her eyes moved to stay with me. I had read that she shouldn't be able to track moving objects with her eyes for weeks, so that was a shocker.

When she picked up her head a few hours later, I was leaning back in a chair with DD on my chest, and DW napping in the bed next to me. She picked up her head in order to take a good, long look at what her mom was up to.
Posted By: bmoore4 Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/06/14 02:37 PM
DS2.5 rolled over when he was 4 days old from back to belly (3 or 4 times in a row). The last I caught on video. He is still very strong and physically coordinated.
Posted By: bmoore4 Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/06/14 02:43 PM
DD5, on the other hand, did not crawl until 12 months and walked at 15 months. But she was always extremely alert as a small infant.
Posted By: indigo Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/06/14 02:45 PM
Quote
I began reading to my DD each night while she was in the womb, and I always began by saying her name twice, in a particular, sing-song way... We were still in the delivery room... I said her name in that sing-song way. She immediately stopped wailing, and locked her eyes on mine. I was rocking her back and forth, and as she moved, her eyes moved to stay with me. I had read that she shouldn't be able to track moving objects with her eyes for weeks, so that was a shocker.
Yes! This is also supported by research - a baby's development of neural pathways in the brain can be fueled when people talk to and read to the baby.
DOE archive, Read With Me.
NPR article, Baby Talk (Hart & Risley).

There are huge potential personal and societal benefits when parents choose to interact with their babies in this way, even pre-born.

Please note that this study describes a beneficial pattern of behavior, which can be used by persons of all ethnicities, education levels, and SES:
- Study overview and book description here.
- Book: Meaningful Differences in the Everyday Experience of Young American Children.
- Companion Book: The Social World of Children Learning to Talk)
- brief roundup of free, downloadable pre-literacy and literacy resources available from the US Department of Health and Human Services, National Institutes of Health (NIH), Eunice Kennedy Shriver National Institute of Child Health and Human Development (NICHD)... which appear to back the findings of Hart-Risley... including:
1) A Child Becomes a Reader: Birth to Preschool (2006) 36-page PDF, subtitled Proven Ideas from Research for Parents
2) Put Reading First: Helping Your Child Learn to Read (2001) 8-page PDF, subtitled Helping Your Child Learn to Read, A Parent Guide, Preschool - Grade 3
3) Shining Stars: Preschoolers Get Ready to Read (2007) 9-page PDF, subtitled How Parents Can Help Get Their Preschoolers Ready to Read
There are also a number of free, downloadable reports available on literacy research, including:
4) Developing Early Literacy: Report of the National Early Literacy Panel (2010), 260-page PDF, subtitled A Scientific Synthesis of Early Literacy Development and Implications for Intervention
5) Child Development and Behavior Branch (CDBB), NICHD, Report to the NACHHD Council (2009) 74-page PDF, no longer current. NOTE: See page 45 for information foreshadowing a push for Social Emotional Learning (SEL).
6) Developing Early Literacy: Executive Summary of the National Early Literacy Panel (2010), 11-page PDF, subtitled A Scientific Synthesis of Early Literacy Development and Implications for Intervention
7) Early Beginnings: Early Literacy Knowledge and Instruction (2010), 20-page PDF, subtitled A Guide for Early Childhood Administrators & Professional Development Providers
Posted By: Bostonian Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/06/14 07:04 PM
Originally Posted by indigo
Quote
I began reading to my DD each night while she was in the womb, and I always began by saying her name twice, in a particular, sing-song way... We were still in the delivery room... I said her name in that sing-song way. She immediately stopped wailing, and locked her eyes on mine. I was rocking her back and forth, and as she moved, her eyes moved to stay with me. I had read that she shouldn't be able to track moving objects with her eyes for weeks, so that was a shocker.
Yes! This is also supported by research - a baby's development of neural pathways in the brain can be fueled when people talk to and read to the baby.
DOE archive, Read With Me.
NPR article, Baby Talk (Hart & Risley).

There are huge potential personal and societal benefits when parents choose to interact with their babies in this way, even pre-born.
I wonder about this. My wife and I left our children from an early age with a live-in babysitter who was not that well educated. Maybe she talked to them as low-income mother talk to their children. I don't think this had a long-term detrimental impact on our children, although this is unknown. In general, when well-educated mothers go back to work, they are putting their children in the hands of less-educated women. Otherwise the economics don't work. In the day care setting those women are also caring for more children than a SAHM would be. I don't think the research has found that mothers working hurts the educational attainment of their children.
Posted By: Dude Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/06/14 07:30 PM
Originally Posted by Bostonian
I wonder about this. My wife and I left our children from an early age with a live-in babysitter who was not that well educated. Maybe she talked to them as low-income mother talk to their children.

What on earth...?
Posted By: Tigerle Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/06/14 07:33 PM
Thanks for the birthday wishes, Aquinas!
Posted By: Minx Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/06/14 07:59 PM
Originally Posted by Bostonian
I wonder about this. My wife and I left our children from an early age with a live-in babysitter who was not that well educated. Maybe she talked to them as low-income mother talk to their children. I don't think this had a long-term detrimental impact on our children, although this is unknown. In general, when well-educated mothers go back to work, they are putting their children in the hands of less-educated women. Otherwise the economics don't work. In the day care setting those women are also caring for more children than a SAHM would be. I don't think the research has found that mothers working hurts the educational attainment of their children.

Could you elaborate on how you think low-income mothers talk to their children? And why you think this might have a long-term detrimental impact on a child?

Posted By: Bostonian Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/06/14 08:13 PM
Originally Posted by Minx
Originally Posted by Bostonian
I wonder about this. My wife and I left our children from an early age with a live-in babysitter who was not that well educated. Maybe she talked to them as low-income mother talk to their children. I don't think this had a long-term detrimental impact on our children, although this is unknown. In general, when well-educated mothers go back to work, they are putting their children in the hands of less-educated women. Otherwise the economics don't work. In the day care setting those women are also caring for more children than a SAHM would be. I don't think the research has found that mothers working hurts the educational attainment of their children.

Could you elaborate on how you think low-income mothers talk to their children? And why you think this might have a long-term detrimental impact on a child?

See the link to Hart & Risley posted by indigo, which is what I was responding to.
Posted By: Tigerle Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/06/14 08:21 PM
While it does not make a difference as such whether the mother works or not, the quality of the day care provider has been found to make a difference. However, it has been found to make less of a difference than parenting makes, so barring abuse, the SES of the parents will always override the SES of a DCP.
Sadly, that goes for situations where it's the other way round as well, so high quality public child care and preschool with higher SES peers can compensate for a lot, it can't compensate for every deprivation.
Posted By: 75west Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/06/14 08:43 PM
And what about all the twice exceptional babies here??? These are the kids who have gross, fine, speech, visual, feeding, or other developmental delays yet end up within the 98-99.9%. How do they factor into this study?

And what about those who are twice exceptional and receive early intervention and others who do not? A lot of variables there, particularly with those on the autism spectrum.
Posted By: aquinas Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/06/14 08:51 PM
Originally Posted by Dude
I began reading to my DD each night while she was in the womb, and I always began by saying her name twice, in a particular, sing-song way... We were still in the delivery room... I said her name in that sing-song way. She immediately stopped wailing, and locked her eyes on mine. I was rocking her back and forth, and as she moved, her eyes moved to stay with me. I had read that she shouldn't be able to track moving objects with her eyes for weeks, so that was a shocker.

My dad and DH have a simliar story for me and DS.

1. My birth was a medical emergency, and I was inconsolable. After a few minutes of my wailing, my dad demanded to be let into the nursery to comfort me and said, "Aquinas, this is your Daddy." I immediately stopped crying and accepted his finger to suck on while we waited for my mum to be prepared to see me, all the while watching him intently as he cradled me.

2. DS' birth was also a medical emergency (for the same reason), and DH provided kangaroo care for DS while I came out of anaesthetic. Because DH read the same set of stories to DS every night while I was pregnant, he decided to recite a story to DS. DS stopped crying and accepted comforting on dad's warm chest. DS was apparently transfixed with DH's face and seemed to anticipate the funny parts of the story with excitement.

I love my gentle gentlemen!
Posted By: Tigerle Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/06/14 08:53 PM
Studies tend to exclude 2e kids precisely because they are unpredictable....
Posted By: Aufilia Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/07/14 05:39 PM
Originally Posted by cdfox
And what about all the twice exceptional babies here??? These are the kids who have gross, fine, speech, visual, feeding, or other developmental delays yet end up within the 98-99.9%. How do they factor into this study?

And what about those who are twice exceptional and receive early intervention and others who do not? A lot of variables there, particularly with those on the autism spectrum.


They were probably excluded, but DD has a ton of special needs and is still PG.

DD (8) has Aspergers, ADHD, SPD, low muscle tone, and terrible vision, and didn't walk until she was 20 months old. But she was still markedly PG as a baby. She was interested in books from the first day I started reading regularly to her, at 2 months of age. She said her first 5 words in the same week at 8 months, and at 19 months, Early Intervention rated her expressive & receptive language as being around a year ahead.

She did NOT hit any physical milestones early or perform any extraordinary physical feats, and as a first-time parent, I had no idea if she was extra alert. She WAS a champion sleeper, compared to my DS. She hit her physical milestones on time until walking, which she didn't learn until 20 months. One day I remember her physical therapist (through Early Intervention), saying, "She't too busy thinking about all the ways she might fall down and hurt herself." She has definitely muscle tone and balance issues, but she still definitely thinks herself out of doing things.

DD & DS both did a number of baby studies through the University of Washington, through the Institute for Learning & Brain Science and some other research departments. I wish, in hindsight, they gave you info on your kid's results and a copy of the final paper, because now I wonder if you could see a correlation with IQ or achievement with those early studies. But alas, they don't.
Posted By: aeh Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/08/14 01:25 AM
Originally Posted by aquinas
Originally Posted by Dude
I began reading to my DD each night while she was in the womb, and I always began by saying her name twice, in a particular, sing-song way... We were still in the delivery room... I said her name in that sing-song way. She immediately stopped wailing, and locked her eyes on mine. I was rocking her back and forth, and as she moved, her eyes moved to stay with me. I had read that she shouldn't be able to track moving objects with her eyes for weeks, so that was a shocker.

My dad and DH have a simliar story for me and DS.

1. My birth was a medical emergency, and I was inconsolable. After a few minutes of my wailing, my dad demanded to be let into the nursery to comfort me and said, "Aquinas, this is your Daddy." I immediately stopped crying and accepted his finger to suck on while we waited for my mum to be prepared to see me, all the while watching him intently as he cradled me.

2. DS' birth was also a medical emergency (for the same reason), and DH provided kangaroo care for DS while I came out of anaesthetic. Because DH read the same set of stories to DS every night while I was pregnant, he decided to recite a story to DS. DS stopped crying and accepted comforting on dad's warm chest. DS was apparently transfixed with DH's face and seemed to anticipate the funny parts of the story with excitement.

I love my gentle gentlemen!

Aquinas, that is a very sweet pair of stories.

One of my sibs tracked immediately at birth. My #2 also was soothed on hearing #1 sing, within hours of birth (#1 sang non-stop to mama's belly-button during #2's gestation). I suspect, based on the respective birth circumstances, that tracking and alertness at birth have a great deal to do with the use of (or rather lack thereof) anesthetics during the birthing process.
Posted By: it_is_2day Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/08/14 03:55 AM
DD 2 3/4 from the moment she was born could see clearly. During the entire hospital stay she looked around the room. I know everything that I have read states early infants can't see clearly, but she most definitely could. She would track movements across the room.

When we brought her home one of the first tricks she learned was to get her arms out of the burrito wrap, followed by not letting us wrap her up like a burrito. She spoke her first understandable words at an age that I feel uncomfortable to state. She used the correct words for what she wanted at a very young age, again I do not feel comfortable saying the exact age because it seems almost impossible.

At 5 months she knew her chore was to bring the mail in and give it to her mother for allowance. Of course I carried her to and from the mailbox. She did have the dexterity to put the coins in her bank by herself. She fully understood the cause and effect of Bringing in the mail meant getting to put coins into her piggy bank. Her favorite pass time was to have daddy carry her around showing her the world. At that age she seem almost scary advanced.

Now, even though she does still seem advanced, she does not seem that advanced, except on theses certain occasions when she says something that is absolutely brilliant that reminds me, oh yeah she is smart.
Posted By: Val Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/08/14 03:58 AM
I think this thread has hit a resonance frequency of parental bragging.
Posted By: aeh Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/08/14 11:44 AM
I expect that this is because, while the research on reliably assessing intelligence in infants as a class is rather open to debate, we all know exactly what our own infants were like. smile
Posted By: 75west Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/08/14 12:59 PM
Aufilia - we've got a similar situation. My 2e pg ds8 was born with with special needs - including severe sensory processing, hypotonia, dyspraxia, and gross/ fine/ speech/ visual deficits. And yet, at the same time, ds was a very alert baby with a head on a swivel sucking everything in.

IF parents or professionals just focus on those motor/speech skills then a child like Helen Keller would never be identified as gifted. And I could list many, many others who would fit into this category. Herein lies the problem for 2e parents.

Super advanced motor skills in babies may be an indicator of a super high IQ or intelligence, but it's only one indication and doesn't seem to apply to some 2e kids. This can become a huge problem for 2e parents because their kids have delays and/or deficits and yet their brains/bodies seem to compensate or overcompensate for these delays and deficits in spectacular ways.

Please let's not forget the number of 2e parents who do not fit into this category and still have children who are gifted but with special needs.
Posted By: Mev Re: Gauging the intelligence of infants - 10/16/14 02:43 AM
My kiddo has dyspraxia with a left sided hypotonia but we still knew he was bright. I just didn't really understand he was gifted until much later. We figured out the dyspraxia first.

The only early indicators we had of giftedness were...

When he was 8 months he looked at me and said 'cock a doodle doo' and 'where dada go?' (Then he didn't speak again for months.)

And he smiled at 2 weeks.

He started interacting with books at 4 months. Turning pages and seeking books out independently.

And he was just super alert. People commented on it all the time. He NEVER napped. OMG. NEVER. Didn't sleep much at night either.

I remember the daycare people told me one day the babies were sitting at the table together and all crying except for my kiddo (4 mos). They said he was gaping at the other babies like 'WHAT is wrong with you? This is awesome!' He loved daycare. Loved the stimulation.
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