Hello everyone,

Just a quick summary. I have DD4 recently tested WPPSI-III at FIQS 138 (this is thought to be an underestimate due to her hitting various ceilings). Because my question is about reading I will share that in verbal she was in the 99.5% and hit the ceiling in information).

I have been reading on the forum a lot. Many gifted profiles are quite similar to my DD with one exception- reading level. There are a couple of things going on in this realm. One is that she has been taught only in phonics the last two years in Montessori. Another is that she doesn't like to be wrong and really doesn't want to guess- ever, so we are playing lots of guessing games showing that it is ok to be wrong. A third is that she was in tears this last year with an intense desire to read and my own interventions as well as with her school failed to produce any change. She seems to have given up, although she loves books and will sit for over an hour "reading" alone or being read to. She is incredibly bored with sight readers so I am really wondering what direction to go in.

It was suggested by testers to have her vision checked. She also hit the ceiling and tested in the 99.9% in block design, and appears highly visual spatial. I am wondering though if it is too early to check vision? I wasn't clear on the connection here? Has anyone had a highly gifted child that is struggling to read or has or have had similar issues? What is the context? What learning style/method worked for your child eventually?

I have a HG+ child that didn't really read until kindergarten. At which time he jumped about 4-5 grade levels in a year. I didn't know he was more than a little gifted before kindergarten. I actually thought he was behind because there were so many Montissori kids at our school that were doing early reading. Little did I know it would take only a couple weeks to get him to be where they were.

Anyway - a couple things I noticed with our experience
1 - he didn't take off reading until he could read at his interest level. He never really read much below 3rd grade level.
2 - he tends to be visual-spatial somewhat.
3 - he was never interested in early reading. He likes to blend with his peers. He went to a very play based preschool program that didn't even introduce letters. He much preferred exploring science, math, puzzles, active play, etc as a preschooler.

He has a sister coming up behind him I think is going to be the same way.

Hi Branwen, Sorry I don't really have answers for most of your questions but I thought I'd suggest what we used to get my DD up and reading quickly. She really wanted to read, but wasn't moving along as quickly as she wanted. She is a voracious reader, and was even when we were reading to her. We used Scholastic's Headsprout Clicksmart online program. https://www.headsprout.com/login/index.cfm

I don't know if you have tried computer learning, but this is the first my DD5 (then 4) did and *loved* it! She went from sounding out 3 letter basic words to really reading very fluently in the space of a few months. It was amazing to me. She also has a problem being wrong and didn't like to read to us since we had to help her along. The computer took care of that...it didn't bother her to be told try again by the computer. I was quite impressed with the quality of the program, though it was a little pricey. For me, it was worth every cent. They have a free trial. I only wish I could find something similar for math...

Anyway, hope that helps.

Yes, you can test for vision issues at this age! I would suggest you go to someone who is used to working with kids.

My MG gifted nephew had a very uneven profile when he was evaluated. His mental age ranged from his chronological age to 3 years above. The profile hinted to some visual issues (he had difficulty distinguishing foreground/background, he had a very hard time finidng hidden objects in drawings such as Hidden Pictures magazine).

It was discovered that he needed glasses, but he also required some therapy. They had to find a developmental ophtalmologist for that. In 6 monhts or so of therapy, he caught up. The glasses, of course, he still wears.

Maybe with your DD it is a vision issue, you can easily test her vision. However, it is very likely personality/interest, etc. It is very difficult for some of these kids to have to go through this boring easy readers when they are being read super interesting material by their parents.

hi branwen
your DD sounds like my DD5. Her average WPPSI subtest scores was 16.8 and got a FSIQ of 147 but can't read a lick! ... she is also a montessori kid and completely avoided the reading/phonics area of the class.. just did the minimum (learning sounds of letters).. I would love to know what you discover- my DD has had routine "quickie" eye tests and has normal vision but maybe there is a subtler problem.
irene

A friend of mine's daughter has glasses and she is 5. We've had Wolf quick screened and it looks like he needs to go in for a more in depth screening soon. 4.5 is definitely not too young to check. Many optomitrists will do cheap or free quick screens for the little ones. I have very bad vision and it was not caught till I was in 3rd grade and having horrible headaches because I was capable enough to compensate at school.

Thanks everyone for the posts so far. The testers indicated that highly visual spatial kids often have problems with reading- can anyone post more about that connection?

kimck- Thanks for sharing. We are reading lots of complex stuff to her, chapter books and young adult books (appropriate) with almost no images at times. I think interest v. ability level might be an issue.

The vision problem they thought we should test for is not really with how well she sees but how the eye is processing the info. I think we will do it and will post back if they find anything. I know nothing about this really!

sdrothco- Thanks for the suggestion about computer programs. Her new school will be using starfall among other things. I have heard that computers are more friendly for visual spatial learners...she is already arguing with us now over the inconsistency in phonics! Montessori also lets them spell words as they sound...personally was never was a fan of that strategy because now we are having battles over how words are spelled.

The interesting thing is that DD loves to write words and make up her own words and rhymes. Hmmm....

If she's a visual spatial learner, she more than likely has issues with the whole phonics thing anyway... she doesn't learn in parts/order, she learns to see the result first, then break it down.

DS5 doesn't have a "diganosis" of anything, but every time it's mentioned around here, it makes sense that he would be a visual spatial learner... he never broke words down when he read - he just said them as a whole, etc... it also makes me wonder about myself, as I tend to see the big picture first - could be why I had such issues with reading comprehension - not that I didn't understand the story, but when you're asked questions, you're asked to break down the story in order or whatever. And I had issues with that and/or wanting to break it down into parts... same thing with math and writing step by step how I got at an answer... hmmmm.

As for the eyes, there's someone here that has a DC that had issues with their eyes - vision was good, but there was more. I can't remember what/who it was though. I hope she finds this thread.

And interestingly enough, I was in therapy for my left eye (which doesn't go left unless I force it) when I was younger and have gone back and forth between distance & reading glasses - my left eye has had the same distance Rx since I was like 12. I also had issues with reading the same line over and over again - not that I couldn't see the words, hmmm... interesting.

This doesn't say anything about vision itself, but I found it EXTREMELY interesting for my own issues - ha!

Visual Spatial Learner

CFK- your response hit it on the head which is why I posted in the first place. I thought checking vision and all of this is really fast for me but I am trying to be open minded to this new world in which I find myself. her not reading is not a problem in any way, and is only expressing itself as a frustration, by her- she feels the pain of it and I am already trying to help her understand she does not have to move so fast through life, or be perfect doing it. That said, I'm not sure what to do with a 4 year old that is so emotional that she can't do something. As I have read on other threads, this is not me pushing her, nor thinking her not reading is a problem, but her pushing me. I would have been fine with having never identified her as gifted...but that is another story...and we're here now, mostly because of behaviors and contexts generated by her.

Thanks Dottie- I'll wait patiently for the click...in the meantime I'll research more about this vision stuff.

Thanks JJsMom for the link- very helpful!

Try www.covd.org for more on vision related stuff. My DS had problems with tracking/perception and this helped me figure out more about it all. Good luck!

i wanted to add that i have a visual-spatial DD7 who was so uninterested in any kind of phonics or rote learning when it came to reading (and everything else, really). He did not really read until entering first grade, but by January (Six months later) he was reading very difficult chapter books.. So all our worrying for nothing.
irene

This is very much how my DD (MG/HG) learned to read. She did not read at all starting K, but by the end of K was reading chapter books. It was pretty astounding to watch it happen.

Thank you master of none. I really appreciate your response. It definitely struck a cord. I am just learning how to have this confidence that you mention and have been in a lot of chats with DH about our role as her advocate and champion. Your post reminded me of our recent school decision. We ended up picking the accelarated school with gifted instructors, putting her in K a year early, for the very reason you mention- thinking of her needs v. my own comfort with a more "average" or what is thought to be "normal" pace. Trust me this is a lot of internal arguing going on about my assumptions about what is appropriate when ;-)... I imagine that occurs for a lot of parents just discovering this world of high IQ, OEs, weekly OT apts, visual spatial learning, etc.

My dd is already doing the gifted girl hiding behavior, and she is also an extreme introvert so she immediately scans a room and quickly modifies her behavior to match the group. This behavior in itself caused her to partially reject reading even though she had been quite passionate and emotional about it (i.e. none of her friends were reading). Of course she didn't do it perfectly and apparently for introverts perfections is quite important. I am working with her to understand and also teach myself how these are incredible strengths and nurture them.

Fortunately, my DH is quite similar to this, an extreme introvert himself so he is quite enlightening on the motivations.

Thanks for the post, very thought provoking.

Branwen, I have a son who has had glasses since he was three. It's definitely not too early to get vision checked, though it is true that kids vision continues to change through pre-school years. Ask the Dr on that one.

It's interesting that your DS wants to read so badly. I have heard that some of learning to read is social readiness, which correlates with the phenomena of more girls being early readers than boys. Both my sons actually resisted any kind of formal reading instruction until they could read. My DS15 never liked the phonics books. His first "book" that he read alone was Captain Underpants when he was six, and 3 months later he was reading all the Harry Potter books. My DS11 has always been less mature for his age. He had learned to "read" (sound out words) at school and we all knew it. He insisted that he couldn't read and it came out that he was afraid that if he could read we would stop reading books to him (by this time his older brother preferred to read alone). Like his brother, he didn't want to read until he could read whatever he wanted which didn't happen until 2nd grade.

That being said (my own story I know) I would definitely honor her desire and if things don't click, get her vision tested. (I might not tell the Dr that you're doing it because she can't read yet