I've been trying to remember 5 year olds who made the DYS 150 cut off on WPPSI. All I can remember is quite a few kids on SB-V (cut off 145) and very few on WPPSI. Dottie, any stats on that?

Does one have much better chance using SB-V than WPPSI? On one hand there is DS4 who may be DYS candidate, on the other hand there is DS6 who made the WPPSI DYS cut off.

I am really not able to compare the two of them. They are so different. As much as I don't hesitate to use HG for DS4 I am not sure he would qualify for anything beyond that.

My ds was close -- 148 FS on the WPPSI at 5y5m. And that was a composite; all index scores were lower. If we'd had the choice (SB5 or WPPSI) and I'd known then what I know now ... I'd *probably* have gone for the SB5.

That said, your ds4 is younger than mine was, and if you think HG rather than HG++, he'd probably be fine with the WPPSI if you need results now.

I think the problem isn't the test itself, it's the age. I sort of wish the DYS requirements read 150 if the IQ test was administered before the age of 6 (or preferably 5 ) regardless of the test.

The 150 requirement on WPPSI doesn't really leave any space for a mistake. DS6 was 5:3 when tested on WPPSI and besides being smart he was probably also lucky to pull it off. BTW I would love to retest him at some point. I love numbers but I am not sure if that's a good enough reason for spending $$$.

DS4 will be 5 in a few months and I am quite torn between going back to the same tester who doesn't administer SB-V or finding somebody else. I know way too well that the most reasonable thing would be to wait till he is 6.

Besides our local gt programs we don't really need the testing. He will be homeschooled next year and I am not sure they would accept a recommendation from a PreK teacher but then achievement testing in fall would probably be a better choice anyway. Of course there is DYS which let's face it is the main thing on my mind. If he belongs there I would rather not explain next year why he cannot attend the Summit while his brother can.

Either way we won't do achievement testing till he is in K. I am not interested in any partial results.

My son at age 4 scored significantly higher on the WPPSI than on the SB-V. I have always assumed this is because he is much more gifted verbally than mathematically. I think it was partly the tester, too, of course.

I've heard lots of people say that, all else being equal, the SB-V is supposed to be good for mathy kids. Can anyone say why? In particular, do the non-verbal subtests actually include math questions, or are they just the kinds of non-math questions that a mathy kid might be good at? I guess I'm asking because it would seem odd to me if there were actual math questions on an IQ test, but it also seems odd to me to think that there are non-math questions that mathy kids in general are good at. (Logic questions, for example, seem to me to be a different kind of thing than math questions, and talent for one doesn't generally indicate talent for the other.)

It's mostly any idle question, but I really would be interested to know the answer. I'm fascinated by what exactly people think they're measuring in IQ tests.

BB

A verbal test for quantitative reasoning? I really don't understand what these categories mean!

BB

Also, what if a kid is better at math than verbal stuff, but better at verbal than spatial things? I've heard that SB-V is more of a spatial test, but then again you guys are saying it also has the math component.

Thank you. That's what I needed to hear. Now if I only could follow through and stop thinking about it once it's done At least we will get the papers for our local gifted programs.

My DS6 did very well on the SB-V at age 4 years 9 months--well enough to qualify for DYS. One of my fears is that retesting on the WISC-IV in a year or two might be significantly lower and put me back in a GT denial.

I also have two younger children--DD is actually 4 years 10 months right now. Since she doesn't fully read yet and is much more artistic than academic I haven't had the desire to get her tested. I think I may have her tested on the SB-V before she turns 6 just to see if she can qualify for DYS. I know she is gifted but I know that achievement wise she is not where DS6 was at this age because her interests are so much different than his. She is also much more compliant and thrives with the repetition in her current Montessori classroom. She is advanced in math but definitely avoids the language arts right now.

Also to comment on the Quantitative Reasoning subtests--DS6 is pretty mathy and scored 147 (99.9th%) on that subtest with an 18 in non-verbal and 19 in verbal. He actually scored 4 more raw points than needed for that 19 in verbal. In the words of his tester--he nailed it!

A cut and paste from our report about the Quantitative Reasoning Subtests:


Also about the Visual Spatial Subtests:

It is interesting to note that some children with clearly incredible verbal comprehension (or other variable) skills, may test lower on those subtests of the WPPSI, than seem reflective of their abilities. In the case of partial WPPSI, such as ERB, the tester's session notes may carry weight and provide insight, in reading and interpreting results.
My child took the SB5 at 3.11yrs old and scored in the top of the 99%ile, the WPPSI one yr later, scoring in the same range there. It was interesting that the lowest scoring subtest was in verbal comprehension, while performance, non-verbal and others, were far above the registered scale. I didn't have an opportunity to discuss these tests/results with either tester, but found the session notes from the WPPSI tester to be clear and informative.
Here in ny, there may be a considerable additional fee to confer with SB tester, so there is little insight into the process, unless this is done.
The assessments made using these 2 tests seem to be applied in very different ways. I've also heard that the SB5 is more of a spatial assessment tool and truer IQ measure, while the WPPSI has been described as more of a readiness gauge or achievement test.
I've been skeptical about using results from such young children as a true measure of aptitude and potential abilities. That is the only reason I would have my child test again at a slightly advanced age. Otherwise, we've seen these tests and their results applied in some ways (for admissions, etc) that seem often inappropriate in such young persons.

Dottie, do you have any old George Carlin tapes for DD. You know the one where he is getting "in" the plane not "on" the plane. Technically she was correct about the theatre problem ....They should have worded the problem better.

Chiming in on the WPPSI vs SB-V question- I spoke to Aimee Yermish this w/e and she recommends the V over the WPPSI for HG+ kids. The Wechsler has a hard ceiling that can be a problem for these kids. The V has more "head room".

Hi. I'm very interested in this conversation, however can someone tell me what DYS is? I haven't been able to find an abbreviations FAQ.

Thanks!

Davidson Young Scholars