Hi, my son just turned 5. We just had our meeting for transition to K today and after a battle I finally got them to schedule my son for an IQ test. We go back in 2 weeks and I want to make sure I am prepared and everything is as it should be.

Today they did what they called a short IQ test, I guess standard for all kids going into K? It took maybe 20 minutes and seemed pretty simple. The administrator said after "Your son was amazing, either he is very bright or a very good guesser." This kinda bothered me because the fact that I've been saying he is unusually gifted at academics for years should be the first clue he wasn't just guessing. The test also seemed very basic, letters, numbers, colors. There were some questions like leaf is to tree as petal is to ? He seemed to really enjoy those as I heard all about them on the car ride home. They said I will have the results for this mini test soon.

My son is currently diagnosed with ASD (basically mild asperger's) and we are privately looking at whether that label is still accurate and whether ADHD better describes him now... or both. He is very hyper, impulsive, unfocused, and distracted, to the point where it takes us 40 minutes to get out of the house to go places (even those he really wants to go to). He is on Prozac for anxiety. His behavior at school is a mess.

I feel that any test that adds to our understanding of him and what is going on is very valuable and I finally convinced them to do it. The IU has been putting me off for 2 years saying that IQ wasn't a factor in his behavior and it would be something we could look into later.

I met the lady who will administer the test. She seems very nice and was calm with my son, which is great. She said there will be a 1 hour IQ test, the wispy it sounded like she said and a 1 hour achievement test. Since the school is only 5 minutes away I decided to break it up into 2 sessions.

Is there anything else I should be requesting? Does all of that sound standard? My sons current preK teacher is concerned about dyslexia, will that test pick up on that? Is there anything I need to teach him about taking tests? Today I saw the instructor ask him to touch the picture of the employees. He said "employees?" She said, "yeah, I know that's a big word." He touched a picture of people, but the wrong one. Later I asked him if he knew what an employee was. He said employees are people who do what you tell them to and they make things. I feel like he would have done much better if he had been able to answer verbally or if conversation had been encouraged rather than a simple point to the answer style. Will the real test also be a lot of the pointing stuff?

I have to admit that I waited 4 years to get this testing done (by 12 months my son was very different from the typical children and I had no idea what was going on) and now that we are finally ready to get our answers I'm actually kind of scared. I'm not worried about a high or low score, I just want an accurate score and I'm worried about him testing below where he should due to his social and behavioral issues. I don't want the test to say he is smart, I want it to help us with understanding him. So I'm very concerned about getting an accurate result.

I know I can't be there for the IQ test, but I'm hoping I can for the academic testing. That will give me a chance to let the tester know if he just isn't trying. Tonight he wanted some math questions during dinner so I asked 224 plus 224. He immediately said 424. I said,"I think you forgot to do something". He thought a moment and said 448. He often does that, answers without thinking it through and during testing they won't know he is just blurting out something and not thinking.

If he does do poorly on the test or is uncooperative, how long do we have to wait to test again? I'm still not sure I trust an employee of the public school system to do a good job at this, but I am happy they will be doing it for free. If I feel the results do not represent my son at all I would like to get him retested privately as soon as it's ok to do so.

I'm probably not going to sleep for the next two weeks. Between the IQ testing and him taking the ADOS again I've got way too much to worry about! He just finished his BOT 2 testing through his private OT, he got 5.7 (age equivalents, not raw scores) on fine motor precision, 7.4 on fine motor integration, around 6.5 on the third subtest (forget what it was, included making dots on circles and stringing beads), and today he did one with ball skills and scored below age 4, but it's not all scored yet. So on the BOT 2 alone his age ranges were from 3-7. I'm happy to finally be moving forward on getting some answers, hopefully all of this will really benefit my son.

And sorry if this was rambly, I'm having a rambly sort of week.

Panzer, Sorry I have nothing to offer on the testing questions but wanted to give you a hug and remind you to just relax. Children can easily pick up on their parents' anxiety. So you will be helping your son by staying cool about the whole test. All the best!

Two things:

First, I may have problems pointing to the right pictures out of a set of people pictures if asked who are employees. I guess if they look American I could eliminate young kids, outside of that most people could potentially be employees. Some folks might look more like a stereotypical employee, but....

Second, Good luck. Hope everything works out good for everyone.

Yes, breath.

I believe the IQ test they are talking about is the WPPSI -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wechsler_Preschool_and_Primary_Scale_of_Intelligence

The fact that the person administering the test is nice and calm with your son is a great sign.

FWIW my DS was tested at 6.5. He sat under the desk for 1/3 of the testing, spun in his chair, threw his pencil around and was an all around disaster. I sat in the corner and cringed thinking the tester was thinking I was a nutcase for thinking he was even remotely bright. In the end she saw through it all and he somehow came out with gifted scores that in many ways exceeded what we would have ever guessed. Good luck and breath.

Of course, I don't know anything beyond what you've told us about the specific examiner, but, in general, early childhood evaluators are very accustomed to the behavior and varying levels of attention and compliance of young children. I don't do littles much anymore, but when I did, I absolutely tested children while they were under tables, spinning, dancing, in 15 minute increments, rewarding them with stickers every few items completed (lots of stickers!), taking turns (you draw a picture, and then I'll draw a picture), etc. I've sat under the table with them, given them fidget toys to play with while testing...pretty much done everything except stand on my head in the quest for optimal performance (can't do a headstand). I think I may have tested a stuffie once.

Naturally, you should do what you think is best for your son, but I would put a caution in about sitting in for any portion of testing. Children, especially very bright children, are very savvy about cueing off their parents' (and the examiner's) reactions to their responses. If you are in the room, make sure you are somewhere that he cannot see or hear you. Many children give up more easily if adult feedback conveys to them that they are answering incorrectly. He knows you very well, so he will be able to read your "tells" much more easily than another person's. You might be better off giving the examiner a few examples of the kind of careless responding that may obscure his true abilities, along with some of his specific skills, in a private conversation out of earshot of your son.

I would agree that the cognitive test is the WPPSI-IV, a very appropriate instrument for this age and ability. If you need re-testing, the re-test interval is a minimum of two years from the last administration, if giving the exact same test. In two years, he will be seven, which would move him up to the WISC-V. In fact, you could have him re-tested with the WISC-V at age 6.0, in exactly a year. If you really need re-testing sooner than that, the SBV is also a solid instrument, with a higher ceiling than the WPPSI-IV, actually. The WJIV cognitive would also work, but it has some normative limitations for early childhood.

I wouldn't get too far ahead of yourself, worrying about having to have him re-tested. Keep in mind that IQ scores are quite unstable at this age, so even if he doesn't test at a number consistent with your everyday experience of him, it doesn't necessarily mean it was a bad test. Little children are just a bit unpredictable in their response to and presentation on testing. It's more important to focus on the information, guidance, and supports you get out of testing, than on the precise numbers.

Oh, and the brief test that he just had is likely a kindergarten screener, which is designed mainly to pick up children with delays in one of the Big 5 areas of development. They tend to have low ceilings, as the objective is child find for children at risk for disabilities and developmental delays, not actual IQ. Many of them are reported simply as above or below a cut score.

I will leave the details to the expert advice you received above, but quick add: no, the cognitive test will not pick up on dyslexia or such issues. These need to be teased out separately.

I've found the IDA fact sheets good summaries that stick to the facts (be forewarned, most dyslexia websites tend to get a little carried away); there's one one testing towards the end of the list: http://eida.org/fact-sheets/

ITA


Also agreed. The IQ test may be *impacted* by dyslexia or other LDs, but you'll not have the full information you'll need to know that your child is dyslexic. To diagnose an LD a wide variety of information is usually taken into account: ability/achievement testing is part of it, classroom and parental observations, classwork/homework samples, and further testing to pinpoint the exact nature of the observed challenges. Most kids with LDs aren't diagnosed until they've been in school for a little while. You're ahead of the game since your ds has a preschool teacher who's identified a potential concern.

When you asked the school for testing, were you asking specifically for dyslexia testing or for gifted testing? If you are concerned about testing, there are other things you should be able to ask to have included that are specifically targeted at reading - although I don't know if they are available for the age your ds is. One thing you might request through school or pursue on your own is vision/hearing testing.

Best wishes,

polarbear

Thank you for all of the responses. As far as the dyslexia thing goes, my son is actually a great reader, but his teacher is concerned about his resistance to sounding out new words (which he can do, but it seems to require a lot more effort than it should) and the fact that he reverses his letters even with years of practice at writing. He also occasionally spells words backwards. He also sometimes guesses a word when reading, but based on the last letter in the word rather than the first, which might be normal, but I don't remember ever doing it.

The IU just repeats the same old line of we don't expect a child to write without reversals or even read at all, so it's not a problem. The preschool teacher believes that errors only make sense for children who are not as familiar with the letters, not a kid who knew them all before 18 months and has been obsessed with them (in addition to numbers) pretty much ever since he was old enough to see (as an infant when I read to him he only looked at the words and not the pictures, I was so concerned by this behavior!). He also reverses numbers.

Another thing I notice about him is that he can complete math problems much better in his head than on paper. This is completely counter-intuitive to me! As soon as math is written down he fights doing it, but when we are in the car he asks for math challenges the whole ride.

I spoke to the head OT at our private therapy today and she said we are going to mainly focus on body awareness, motor planning, and anxiety during the next 6 months. His BOT 2 scores ranged from 34 (well above average) for fine motor integration to 0 (well below average) for upper limb coordination.

This is a kid who can write very neatly, but can't open the screen door or the car door. He cuts beautifully, but can't get the scissors on his hand right without help, or even on his right hand. He hates to try new things or to do anything even remotely challenging. Transitions to difficult or novel activities usually end in very violent tantrums.

Every test we have done leads us closer to answers as to what is going on with the poor kid. He really is a sweet child and so easy to be with as long as there are no real demands placed on him. Out of the house he has to control everything and can't handle the slightest deviation from what he had in mind.

He's clearly got a disability, he has been in therapy since 2. We just need to figure out what it is so that we can actually help him. My concern with the IQ test is just getting accurate and useful results. I certainly wouldn't mind if they confirmed what I have been saying for years about how advanced he is, but even if his IQ isn't amazing, his academic achievement can't be denied. He is clearly reading and doing math at a beginning 3rd grade level (average, he's probably got some gaps as I'm not a teacher and some areas very advanced, even to adult level). I don't know any other kids his age who are like him, he's amazing and super challenging and we love him that way

Also, aeh, I don't mean to offend with my opinions on school psychologists. I personally had very negative experiences in that area and our local IU in general tends to attract some of the worst professionals in their fields (OT especially). A few of the IU employees have been great, most have not. I will probably never get over my personal bias against public schools, but that in no way means that I think school employees are always less qualified than those in private practice. After all, there are some pretty horrible people in private practice... Kidding, kidding

We have a great speech therapist with the IU and the psychologist who will perform the test seemed very nice and even told me she would manage to test him even if he never sat in his chair. She also said he can take breaks and visit me anytime. She insisted on an am session, which hadn't even occurred to me. I didn't grill her on her experience with gifted kids, because I'm not sure if my son is one. I guess I just have to trust that she knows what she is doing!

No offense taken. I know that there have been some pretty catastrophic experiences with public schools out there.

I gather, then, that this eval is a disability-driven eval, rather than primarily about giftedness. You may wish to convey all that you have said here about odd disparities in his academic skill to the psych, so she knows that she may need other instruments, like the CTOPP-2 or the PAL-2. Or at least a measure of word attack.

Maybe not too helpful, but both of my children (very early with letter recognition; DD read as a young 5, DS as a young 4) reversed letters and numbers here and there until about 6.5. Not frequent and they didn't do the other stuff you describe. But even with early literate kids, I think it can happen.

Thank you ultramarina, that is very good to know. Did they reverse any of the letters in their names? My son reverses the first letter of his name (S), and they have them tracing it daily at preschool. We don't really do any writing practice at all at home, which probably doesn't help, but I figure he will need something to do at school and I'm not too into academics until at least 5 (which he's only been for a week).

The IU has no issue with the reversals, but they do bother me to practice writing with him because he starts at the bottom when he writes. I countered that the other 4 year old weren't even writing and his letters were quite legible (this was the week he turned 4, I couldn't believe they were giving us handwriting homework?!?). They said it will affect his fluency of writing later.

He wrote a summery of a movie plot the other day and sure, it lacked spaces and proper punctuation and the spelling was rigidly phonetic, but I thought it was great and there was no way I was going to mark it up for errors. I always just tell him his work is great. Maybe I'm part of the problem?

As a preschool teacher, I would not worry about reversals or writing form.

The development of physical act of actual writing (small muscle control) and the process of writing (sound-letter identification and visual spacial cues) are different.

Many early readers/writers reverse and it is developmentally OK and not unusual to age 7.

Students, especially earlier or independent learners, often will write completely backwards, mixed formats, and reversals. The asynchronous development is not uncommon. I would keep an eye on it, but not go running for an eval in that area. Keep an eye on his eye development. Sometimes eyes dont work well together and that results in writing concerns and/or difficulty. Or fine motor control. Most specific assessments for 'writing' will not identify anything at age 4/5 because writing at all in letters, words would place him out of a 'delay' range.

As for correcting him, I wouldn't. It will come in time and phonetic spelling, unusual spacing/capitalization are part of the writing process developmentally. If he is writing and spelling-- that is ahead of the developmental range for a 4 yr old but follows the developmental curve for writing development.

If you correct him, he may develop a hesitation to write for fear of mistakes and/or correction rather than freely writing (as it sounds like he is doing now).

Does he have a dominant hand? Many kiddos with mixed dominance will write upside down, reverse for a bit longer due to the way the brain processes information.

One of my girls wrote in preschool all sorts of ways backwards, reverse, etc. She did not pick a hand until 1st grade. She even reversed numbers/letters to 2nd grade. Now in 4th she does not. Slowly she self corrected, she is very visual spacial and excels in puzzles and visual processing. She , too, still prefers to do math in her head since the act of 'organizing' in writing is much harder than just figuring it out.

I second what KCMI said about the writing - DD is an early writer, and she occasionally writes in all sorts of strange ways. I've quizzed her about it a few times and she says that it's fine and not to worry about it, she knows it's not right and it's ok. I trust her.

I agree with all of this but with one caveat that applies here - if you've seen *other* signs of atypical development, the continuing reversals and refusal to write out math problems etc *might* be an indication of a challenge - and if there's a chance that there is a challenge, the earlier you are aware of it, the better.

The OP here has noted difficulties with upper body coordination, a very low score on one component of the BOT-2, as well as concerns voiced by his preschool teacher. Each of those, combined with the observations of starting letters at the bottom and writing reversals in spite of handwriting instruction combine to suggest something more than typical handwriting development is going on. I'd look at a few other things re handwriting - do the reversals happen only when he's writing words, or do they also happen if he's writing individual letters or the alphabet? Also did he go through pre-writing stages where he made scribbles that looksd like lines etc? (Sorry I don't know how to describe this - it's something I saw from one of my dd's teachers once - showing what typically happen as children develop writing skills - I just remember being very surprised by seeing it because it described *exactly* the way my nt dd's handwriting developed, and we saw absolutely none of these stages for my dysgraphic ds).

Best wishes,

polarbear

The reversals happen when writing individual letters and numbers and when writing words and sentences. They are usually certain ones, but it's somewhat random. The ones I often see wrong are s, k, j, 3, 4, 5, 7, and 9. He will even write down a math problem such as 10+14=24 with one four right and one four wrong. He doesn't seem to notice this even when reading it back. He also gets his numbers out of order 41 for 14, even though he has a strong understanding of place value and can tell me, oops, I wrote 4 tens and 1 one instead of 1 ten and 4 ones.

I'm not too sure about the pre-writing stuff. He didn't "write" at all until well past the normal age when other kids show interest in scribbling/marking (I think around 12 months?). When he did start he was well ahead in that he didn't want to just scribble, he actually tried to make things. I think his first ever drawing was around 18 months, which was just a scribble. He didn't try again until sometime after 20 months and that time he made water with fish in it (broad strokes with a blue crayon and orange blobs added on top). He made a few drawings like that and quit again for a long time until he started drawing vehicles maybe a year later, using squares and circles. For some reason the vehicles were made out of lots of squares with circles for wheels and a steering wheel. If asked he would draw a person, but he wasn't too into it.

He still doesn't draw much, but when he does I think it's pretty decent for his age. When he paints, he likes to make snakes. Because they are easy! Mostly he likes to make mazes and write number patterns. He loves to do color by number, mazes, connect the dots, word searches, and other puzzle type written work. He does not like to write out sentences or stories too much, but he loves to write up a schedule for the day or he might suddenly sit down and write down the lyrics to a favorite song.

So, back to pre-writing, he never did that stuff I read about where he pretended to write notes to me or anything. I just figured that was part of his social delay. I guess I'd say he went straight to just trying to make stuff, letters, fish, trucks, etc. He didn't really ever show interest in just picking up a crayon and marking up a paper just for the fun of it.

I remember a friend who is very bright and very near to my sons age coming over around when they had both recently turned 4. My son drew a complex maze with a picture at the start and the words start and finish on it. His friend just scribbled. His mom said that was all he ever did and she was worried he was behind. I assured her that my son is just unusual and that she had nothing to worry about, her son is both smart and very social. For his part, my DS looked at his friends work and said "Why did he just scribble all over the paper? He's wasting paper, I don't think we should give him another piece." Luckily his friend wasn't really paying close attention.

I'm not sure if it's important, but as well as my son reads and as much as he loves books, he never wants to read them himself. I have to make deals to get him to read, I'll read to you, then you read to me, and then I'll read to you again. He won't choose anything difficult and actually tends to choose his level 1 readers, just to get it done quickly! He absolutely can read very well when he decides to do it and I try not to push him at all, but I want him to feel confident and learn to enjoy sitting down with a book. He told me a few weeks ago that he used to love reading books, but his interests have changed and he will want to read books again when he is 10. That's really not acceptable!

Thinking back to my own childhood, I was excellent at drawing, but I had terrible handwriting. I actually relearned how to write on my own in middle school because none of my work would be accepted by the teachers. I trained myself to draw the letters the same way I draw pictures. It seemed to work for me and my printing is now very neat. I have no idea if that is relevant or not. My son isn't really taking after me completely because his writing is actually very neat for his age. It remains to be seen if he eventually falls behind though, I know that early skill does not always mean later mastery.

Panzer, I think you're on the right track to continue to observe and to seek further evals. Much of what you say about your ds' early writing development sounds like my dysgraphic ds, some sounds different. The one main difference between your situation and my ds' is that you're looking at signs earlier, which could mean you're overthinking it and what you are seeing is just normal development, or it could mean that you've caught on to an issue early. My ds isn't ASD, but he does have challenges with expressive language, and that tangled together with dysgraphia/dyspraxia made it difficult to tease out the impact of some of the challenges early on because you'd see signs of one challenge but not have the full picture yet because of the other not-recognized challenge. I hope that makes sense lol!

It may feel like others think you're overanalyzing when they say things like "it's normal to reverse letters up through 2nd grade" etc... and yet you'll wonder until you do have more info. Seeking out that type of info, whenever there's any hint of a red flag of something going on - is a *good* thing. If the answer you finally get back from an eval is "everything's ok, you were overthinking it" - that's A-OK, actually a really good thing! OTOH, if your concerns are confirmed, then you're ready to take the next steps of getting a plan together and getting help and support for your ds - and the earlier in his life he has appropriate remediation and support, the better things will be for both of you

Best wishes,

polarbear

ps - dysgraphia, like dyslexia, does seem to appear in family clusters. There are several dysgraphic/dyslexic individuals in my dh's family, and ds has at least one dysgraphic cousin and one dyslexic cousin. I think it's telling that you describe re-learning how to write in middle school the *way* you describe it. It's not all that atypical for a middle school student to change the appearance of their handwriting - I remember doing that to be "cool" when I was in middle school, doing things like purposely making the dots above my "i"s huge and changing the amount of slant, making curly-q shapes on long letters etc. Writing neatly also becomes important at this stage for all students due to increased length of writing assessments and increased demands from teachers. However, your description of actually relearning how to make the letters and doing it the way you'd draw a picture sounds *very* much like my dysgraphic ds.

When I was in school poor handwriting was just called lack of effort I remember in 6th grade getting assignments handed back to me with a big 0 on them and a note stating that the name was illegible and therefore the work could not be graded. I always felt that was so unfair, because how could the teacher claim she couldn't read my name/identify whose paper it was to hand it back to me if the paper claimed right on it the 0 was because she didn't know it was mine. lol

I see a lot of people advocating for typing here, but it took me many years to learn how to type. In college I was still a very poor typist. I failed typing in high school. Now I am good at it, but it just took forever for me to really master it (and multiple games and teaching programs, going back to dos!). I'm always wondering how all the kids learn how to type so easily and so young!

I have a very bad pencil grip too, but my son's pencil grip is perfect. No one ever understood how I could draw and have such poor handwriting. My cursive is still awful, so I don't use it anymore. I was also abysmal at spelling and I still am. Spell check is a wonderful invention and if my son has the same problems with spelling that I had I am all ready to insist that spelling is not longer even important. There are those times when even spell check can't figure out what I'm trying to write... but I tweak as needed.

Nothing would make me happier than hearing everything is good with my son. He's finally catching up on so much social stuff. He still can't hop on one foot or catch a ball and I'll leave it to the experts to decide what to do with all of that sort of information. I just want to get the whole picture so that we know what we are dealing with and can treat correctly. So many people say, oh, this is typical for a kid on the spectrum and leave it at that. Yet his ASD diagnosis has always been borderline and I hate to see everything attributed to it, anxiety, clumsiness, hyperactivity, impulsivity, even medical complaints like digestive concerns and allergies. I'm sick of hearing it's probably just part of the autism, especially when the ASD is so mild that it might not even be ASD.

So, very frustrating just never really knowing or understanding what is going on. The more tests we try, the more we learn, so after reading all of this I feel confident in pushing for all of the tests we can get in any areas of weakness. You never know what they will show. Thank you everyone for your input, it was very helpful. We still have that test in just over a week. I'm nervous, but trying to keep it well hidden. I coached my son a bit on the idea of tests and answering the questions to the best of his ability. I let him know that some questions will be too hard and that is OK, but to try his best on all of them. Hopefully he has a good day that day and goes in there and does his best. I figure I'll tell him he can have ice cream or a cookie or something after just to try to keep it all positive. I'll let you all know how we make out with the test!

It sounds like you have both family history and spider senses run amuk - two really good reasons not to wait and see. If there actually are LDs going on, waiting is not benign.

Dyslexia in particular is so much easier to remediate the earlier you catch it. The Shaywitz book (dyslexia.yale.edu/book_Overcoming.html) includes detailed markers of dyslexia at even very young ages, and may be useful to help you try to figure out if there is an underlying phonological deficit going on.

Be forewarned, though, that a verbally gifted kid won't show many of the usual markers, or in the usual ways; the signs may be there, but much more subtle. My DD, for example, always loved to rhyme (usually a big challenge for dyslexics) - but the hint was that even as she got older sometimes seemed to not notice the difference between rhyming and alliteration. As it turned out, when tested, her "phonological awareness" was 88th percentile - she could have passed an overly-simple screen with flying colors. But her ability to manipulate those phonemes plummeted as the task got more complex, down to 10th percentile for the harder tasks.

Dysgraphia I will leave to the many deeply experience folk on the board, with the question: if he were supported and accommodated for dysgraphia now and his challenges ended up reducing over time, is there any way those accommodations could cause harm, or just help him work through a difficult period?

Panzer,

In reading your own story, I hear two big takeaways:

1. Yes, you would do well to closely monitor his development, as family history is a risk factor. Your own profile is strongly suggestive of an LD.
2. Your success in life gives good long-term perspective on your child's prospects.

On the potential LD front, the combination of soft early markers for dyslexia/dysgraphia and a squishy ASD Dx make me think of NVLD. It is not uncommon for individuals with nonverbal learning disabilities to have delayed social development, and even to receive early Dx of ASD, especially on the mild, PDD-NOS end of the spectrum. Physical restlessness and visual inattentiveness often get them a Dx of ADHD. They'll have good oral language skills, but often have the physical awkwardness of DCD. Sometime they have a slow start learning to read (hence early dyslexia Dx), but take-off, once they attain fluency.

I have to run now, so I'll have to save more detail for later, but just a thought.

OK, I looked up NVLD and some of it fit, but a lot of it didn't for my DS. So far the only thing I have ever thought he tics all of the boxes for is ADHD. Well, all but the moves from one activity to another quickly. My DS is just the opposite, we can't get him to switch activities even with bribes and timers

It might be useful to mention that I was diagnosed with ADHD at 8, but without hyperactivity. My family never thought that it was a correct diagnosis though, as I was fine at home according to them. I was also given an IQ test at the time and despite my mom being convinced I was pretty smart due to early academic skills, I was scored at low average to borderline MR. This is the main reason I am worried for my son.

I have no idea what my actual IQ is, but I know that assessment was incorrect. I never really got good grades in school (and I failed things like gym, shop, typing, and other "easy A's"), but when I got to college and got to chose my own courses I was generally top of the class and the person who destroyed the curve. I remember once getting back a test I had gotten a 98 on and the next highest score was 54. I quickly learned to turn my returned work over as soon as I got it so that everyone wouldn't be annoyed with me.

I also remember being in the top reading group in elementary, but when I was in 3rd grade the schools introduced this new subject, phonics. I failed phonics each time while reading at the top of the class. I still don't get the idea behind phonics for people like me, who read words as a whole and apparently much quicker than the average person. I can actually read upside down faster than most people can read right side up.

My low IQ score and diagnosis of ADD landed me in the IU for years in a special classroom basically doing nothing because the teachers didn't have work at my level. When I finally returned to regular school I was years behind and hadn't learned any of the stuff the other kids had. My parents had to fight to get me out of the IU, even the IU didn't want me, they kept saying I was the best behaved and highest performing kid in the IU. But the school didn't want me back.

I eventually got out of that school early by testing into a program to go to college for my senior year. To this day I hate public schools and completely distrust the school system. I had terrible teachers, including one who said that I looked evil because I used to have some remnants of a lazy eye when I looked up at her. She always told me I weirded her out and looked possessed. Nice lady.

I would rather never send my son to any type of school than have him unhappy. I'm at an odd place where I need to balance all of his different needs and work with the IU for now. If I could just get his behavior "fixed" I could get him into a good private school and go from there. Now that he is 5 and still hitting, tantruming, super hyper and unfocused, and generally very difficult it is becoming more apparent that if I won't accept public school I'm going to need to prepare for the possibility of homeschooling. All that I care about is my sons happiness and I'm willing to do anything for that.

So this IQ test feels very scary to me. I want it to help us figure out what is wrong and also to show us any special strengths and I think it will be helpful with understanding some of his behavior. At the same time I worry that he will perform poorly like I did and his full abilities/needs won't be discovered at all.

Sorry to write a book again, I tend to do that

That very much fits the profile of 2E gifted/Aspergers. Your descriptions of your child do remind me of mine (now 12) in some ways.


This can happen not only with ADHD, but any other dual-exceptionality that makes the test a poor fit for the child's actual skill set. For a child with ASD, there are lots of social judgments he will miss, which can depress the score on a standard IQ test.


The law offers much better protection now than it did then. Now schools are required to place children in the least restrictive environment in which that child can be educated. And the child is entitled to an appropriate education, which you clearly did not get. I'm so sorry.


Your child has more rights in the public schools than he does in the private schools.

I would highly recommend ABA therapy-- it is not always a walk in the park, but it is highly tailored toward teaching the child the self-management skills he's missing. We have found this process essential to getting our DS to the point where he can do well in school and socially.


If he does poorly on this IQ test, you should look at the Raven or the Differential Abilities Scale. These are also IQ tests, but they are formatted differently. Many 2E kids who do poorly on the more "standard" tests reveal their gifts on these alternative tests. Yet the tests are recognized by experts as valid. Just a different way of capturing the data.

Hang in there and trust your judgment about your child--
DeeDee

My sons father and his family are also a nest of LD's, tic disorders, ADHD, and probable asperger's. Dad himself was in the gifted program. He doesn't really have much of any memory for anything, but he thinks he didn't meet the cutoff for total IQ and they allowed him in anyway for certain extremely high splinter skills in mathy stuff. I personally feel very strongly he is either asperger's or maybe an oddly severe ADD. He is a programmer and loves his job and enjoys programming in his spare time as well.

Luckily, so far my son seems to have my amazing memory skills. He also seems to have both of our strengths, my verbal and his dads math. He is definitely smarter than I was at the same age. He's not just a bright kid, he's an often amazing kid. He is honestly better than many adults at logic games and puzzles and we buy him adult level maze books with 3D and multi-level mazes that confuse even his therapists.

Anyway, everyone has helped me to feel much better. It's only a few days until the test, but I have moved onto a calmer place. Playing lots of games with my son in hopes that it gets his brain warmed up for testing. I feel confident this test will show something helpful.

Today we tried out Cart Before the Horse that he had gotten for Christmas but not yet played. He sat and worked at it for over an hour and had a great time. I was happy to see this as that should be about the length of time he will need to concentrate for the test.

On the other hand, it was obvious when he was done. He started standing on his chair and staring in the distance for more time than he spent working at the task. He needs a lot of help moving on though, even if his behavior shows he is clearly done. Hopefully the tester will pick up on that sort of thing and stop the test for the day even if he insists he wants to keep going. His lack of focus is not an indication that the work is too hard, it is just what happens when he runs out of attention.