We have decided (At long last)to do testing for Aiden and Nathan.

Here in South Africa they use the JSAIS for kids under 7 (ceilings are at 8+ for all subtests) and after 7 they switch to SSAIS.

We waited a year for Aiden to be less anxious and over 7, so he will do SSAIS.

Nathan though is the conundrum. At age 5 years and *almost* 10 months he is pegged to do the JSAIS. The Ed Psych called me to chat and is "quite sure" that he will only hit one or two ceilings at this stage, but says that if wait too long (ie after age 6) we need to wait till he is 7+ years for SSAIS rather.

I know Nathan is cognitively more advanced than Aiden. It was apparent from the age of 2. He is an all-rounder - good at anything he deems worth attempting - including maths, reading, science, music...

Would you wait for the SSAIS? Would those ceilings concern you?

Tests are for our own understanding/knowledge as well as future entrance to the CIE (UK Education System) Examination system - here in SA the distance companies request full IQ tests for anyone under age 12 starting towards school leaving to show capability and to request any concessions.

Madoosa - I hope someone here knows more about those particular tests.

The tests available were different, but both of my DC have hit test ceilings when I was told it was very uncommon. So yes, those ceilings would concern me.

Does the JSAIS have any sort of "extended scoring"?

DS could have taken the WPSSI at 5, or waited to take the WISC at 6. We waited for the WISC and I am very glad that we did. He hit some subtests ceilings on the WISC, but extended norms are available (and I do not think that they are available for the WPSSI - yet).

Also, for achievement testing, I allowed DS6 to take the WIAT this year, instead of the WJ. He hit multiple ceilings on the WIAT, so perhaps he should have taken the WJ.

I hope someone chimes in who knows about those tests...

I am not familiar with the JSAIS or SSAIS, not being in SA...

I did do some poking around, though, and found some small studies that found pretty noticeable ceiling effects even in unselected populations of 6 yos, so, yes, I'd be pretty concerned about the ceiling. Couldn't find any sign of extended norms for the JSAIS.

The WIAT ceiling effects probably had to do with the item sets, which are lockstep by age/grade.

Any reason not to just wait until each kid is seven? I'm not familiar with the testing formats of course but it is my understanding in general that the tests for the under 6/under 7population aren't good instruments for testing gifties, and the school age version may give you much better information regardless.

Do you need to do the JSAIS or SSAIS-R in particular? I ask because I notice that the norms are approaching 30 years old on the SSAIS-R. For a reasonably high SES, environmentally-enriched child, the trade-off between local norms (SSAIS-R) and current norms becomes a bit foggier (WISC-IV/V). It also suggests that ceiling effects are more likely, as the test is likely to read high by about 6-8 points for an average-ability child, and possibly even more than that for a high-ability child. (Compared to scores derived from a hypothetical recent norm group.)

If the tests are, in part, for your own understanding, hitting a ceiling will not likely give you a full understanding of his abilities.

If we had simply kept having DD take lower-ceiling and grade level tests, we really would still have had a limited understanding of her abilities. When she finally took an out-of-level test, followed by a test with a higher ceiling, we had a much better understanding of her abilities and potential. In part, it depends on what you are hoping to get out of the testing.

Are they the only tests available? And I think I would just test the older one now.

Thank you all for your comments

Loy58 - I am not aware of any extended scoring on the JSAIS. I know a friend's child who hit 8+ on all subtests bar 1. She was 6 so it was enough to get the grade skip they were after. That's all you get if they hit the ceiling - "8+". and I know he will be 8+ in several areas.

Tigerle - We have been offered a substantial discount on the feedback session if we do both kids together. I am waiting for feedback to see if our Medical Aid Fund would cover the testing and then it will be fine to wait for 7 theoretically. He will most likely start Pre-IGCSE work in at least 2 subjects in January. That covers 2 grades. In order for him to be "allowed" to prep for the IGCSE exams (in theory a 2 year course that comes after the Pre courses) we have to be able to give in full test results. This kid is all about leaps and bounds. Right now I have no idea if he will even want to do the work for those exams at that age, but if he does want to and I don't have the results... Then he will have to wait another calendar year to gain access to the materials and tutors (which I am more keen on than the exams to be honest).

aeh - i had no idea the norms were that old on the SSAIS! wow!

Puffin - I know these tests are used here as they are localised norms; I am not sure if she considers utilising other tests. I have not done an IQ test myself so I have no idea if it's due to language, social, historical or environmental differences that perhaps made the traditional testing tools less effective? (my totally uneducated suggestions as to why)

Loy58 - yes that is why I worry. He will be young and will be asking for admission to these high school-level modules and exams. So my main reason for testing is to get him accepted into that when he is ready to do so. And for my own understanding so that as we homeschool we will know best how to meet his needs.