I am just wrapping up a biannual trip back to visit family in the States, and after every visit I get sad about missing my family and think about moving back. I end up researching places, but in the end we always decide that we like where we live too much and don't move.

This time I have the added challenge of just having found a school that I think will be a really good fit for my son. He is not officially 2e, but he is HG with some challenging behaviours, and definitely has asynchronous development between his academics and his social emotional development.

I guess this is a good place for us all to vent our frustrations, so I sometimes get the impression that few people are happy with their schools. Does anyone out there have a child attending a school that they think caters well to their children?

ETA It took us a lot of research to find the new school that we think will work, and that was living in the city we were looking for schools in, so I guess we will probably decide against a move again, but I like to feel like I have options.

In general I am in like with my 5th grader's elementary school but not in love. If I were queen of the world I would fix the few things wrong with the school with a wave of my hand and then I would love it.

My high school son's school is adequate. I don't hate it. I could fix a few things there too. Like hire more elective teachers so those classes are not just warehousing kids for a period. The facilities are nice and he has decent teachers.

As far as gifted. The elementary did do a skip but beyond that he isn't getting much more to support his needs. He is getting into some bad habits.

The high school honors classes and AP are challenging enough for my 2e gifted high schooler. Wish he had more contact with his gifted coordinator. In fact, I wish the gifted coordinator offered a gifted elective (my son finds it hard to find electives he wants to take).

In order to have a school that caters to your child, you generally need to be relatively high in the school system, whether on the school board or be school superintendent, etc.

Alternately, you need to socially ingratiate yourself to these people.

Yes. Our middle school is pretty extraordinary-- not perfect, but great for my 2E.

After forcing a grade-skip despite their every attempt to stop me, I no longer hate DD9's school. Her daily G/T math and ELA pull-outs are meeting her cognitive needs, and those subjects are tending to also involve some science and social studies, too. The school is offering a surprisingly rich array of extracurriculars for a public elementary school, too.

But, still. Just yesterday I had a conversation with another parent of a G/T student in her school, in which he talked about how every year he has the same conversation with the school about his son's schedule, how the pull-outs often conflict with homeroom core subjects (science and social studies), and how he has to make himself a PITA in order to get things corrected, even going so far as requesting copies of the books for home. It all sounded painfully familiar.

The school also micromanages everything, though DD notes that the rules are often bent for the G/T kids. Only when she's in the pull-outs, though. For example, in those classrooms, she can have gum.

Then there's the 20-minute lunch (with teachers wasting so much time policing militaristic marching lines that some students get less than 5 minutes of seated-to-eat time every day), the zero-tolerance bullying policy that does not exist in practice (unless a parent makes himself a PITA), and nonsensical recess boundaries based on grade level (two grades may share the playground, but each has their own side, and woe to the child who crosses) and gender (DD reports that girls are shooed away from the basketball game by teachers).

DD's school experience has come a long way, but it has a much longer way yet to go.

We love our school. It's not perfect, but when I think about what I would change the only big thing would be a longer school year - just to have more more more of what they do there.

(We use a gifted private school)

We did last year (private, Catholic school). Very good classroom setup (two hours of primarily self-directed/small group work -- students had a list to work on but the order was their own), fun teacher, single-subject acceleration support. This year, not as much. Perhaps the glow has worn off, but this teacher just doesn't get it the same way the other one did. And that's just one more thing we have to deal with when parenting an already challenging child. We are tired. So, to be frank, we've not done much about it yet.

Home district for Kindergarten was not good at all. Blech!

Private school for 1st through 5th grade (grade skip from 1st to 3rd) was a fantastic place, but came with a $ cost.

Open enrolled to the neighboring district. They were on board with a grade skip into 7th. Plus, put her in the accelerated math program. Plus, put her in the G/T program. Plus, in 8th grade, allowed her to take three HS classes. Overall, the middle school may not have been perfect, but for a public school it certainly was better than average, and they were trying to make things work.

Continued into HS in the neighboring district. This HS is very much into pushing AP classes (in my opinion, perhaps too much). This might not be great for the average learner, but it works out well for our, now 10th grade, DD. She did have to fight a little bit to be allowed to take two foreign languages at the same time, but the school did relent. They are also accepting of taking classes through local colleges for HS credit, which may be good when her senior year rolls around.

Overall, after leaving our home school district, we've been pretty happy.

Best of luck,
--S.F.

Yes, we are in Detroit. I would not leave friends and family for the school but am super happy that the school is in our neighborhood. It is a stand alone TAG school.

Our experiences with our own children have been okay, but not ideal (now we homeschool).

I will say, though, that the private sectarian school I attended as a child has really taken the modifications my parents talked them into trying for each of us and run with them, to the point that they now have gifted enrichment pull-out 2-6, advanced tracks 7-8, and policies for modified programs, including accelerated courses, independent study, transfer credit from CTY-type or college courses, and partial enrollment for early college (though they won't issue a diploma if you drop below a certain number of core on-campus courses). They also allow students to "challenge" prerequisite courses (test into higher levels by passing the final exam of previous courses). Of course, being a private school, you do pay extra for anything that requires additional staffing.

I had a very good experience there (decades ago), firstly because it was generally a community of warm, dedicated educators who viewed this as a vocation, and secondly because they allowed my parents to assume the risk in adapting the curriculum to my needs. I would probably send my children there if it were not very, very far away. Though I would probably still end up using some alumnal and professional leverage to make further accommodations (especially in elementary).

Yes. I love love love the school my middle school kids attend (my EG ds graduated from it too). It's a private school, but fwiw, there were a number of things I loved about the elementary school my kids attended before switching to private school. And although it's not ideal, there are quite a few things I love about my ds' high school and the program he's in.

There were some really tough things in our public elementary though - for our ds - more related to his being 2e than to being gifted. If he hadn't had his 2nd e I think it's quite possible he might have been able to really soar there and had a great education. The 2nd e still causes a few issues in high school, and there are other issues with high school... but...

FWIW, I think that what you will find online is more often than not people who are searching for something better, so it will always seem like things aren't good just because that's the cross-section of experience you're seeing posting. The folks who've had good experiences (that I know of personally in real life, where I live) don't spend their time online discussing school

polarbear

I passionately love our school. I also post on here very little compared to before we found this school, and it's mostly to spread the progressive education gospel, which comes across as basically bitching about normal schools.

Like a PP, the only downsides are cost and not enough school. The only tolerable vacation for my kids is Christmas, and as soon as the presents are unwrapped they're itching to go back to school.


I know several people who were very involved in the system (either socially ingratiating, on the school board or teachers or admin) and had to jump ship because the system is just too stagnant and hidebound to cater to HG+ kids.

It probably depends on the school system.

In the type of school autocracy I'm thinking of, the system doesn't have a choice if you have enough actual or social power.

Now if the bureaucracy is in charge, and no one individual holds the actual power to alter the system at will, that's different.

When I was in high school, and I wanted some sort of structural or procedural change, I simply hit the Easy Button and the change was made.

So, you have to make sure that you are in a system where the systemic power is personal and autocratic rather than bureaucratic and diffuse.

"Love" is a strong word. But since my wife and I could afford to send our three children to private school and do not, our actions suggest that we at least like our schools. Public schools in Massachusetts have a good reputation, and our town's schools have a good reputation within MA. I have occasionally heard people not living in our town say its schools are good.

More than 90% of our high school graduates go to college. At a presentation I asked the high school principal if he had thought of tracking what percentage graduated from college. He was surprised by the question but said it was a good idea. I think lots of people judge schools by how their graduates fare, without adjusting for the kinds of students going there. Since there are plenty of "good schools" based on raw outcomes, there are lots of parents who like the schools of their children, even if their children could be learning more in the time they are spending.

Surveys have found that parents have a higher opinion of their local schools than of American schools in general.

Possibly he was surprised or taken aback due to
1) knowing this data is being tracked from preschool to college to workforce in longitudinal student data systems,
2) many parents expressing opposition to the extensive data collection and sharing.

That's just the natural tension between the enlightened and modern open information world, in which all information is available to everyone at all times, and the archaic feudal privacy system in which information asymmetry is weaponized and information is hoarded by those who want to prevent the spread of knowledge and human development.

We do not love our top rated school or even the ones that we pay a lot of fee for. But, our neighborhood parents rave about our local PS (with its sky high standardized test scores) and the private school that DS attends is "highly reputed" and parents proudly put the stickers with that school's names on their vehicles. So, whether a school is great or not depends on who you ask! I may be "too picky" a person, but the others around me seem to love, love, love the same schools that I am nitpicking about

While that may be true, who is on which side? The lived experience of the family in these articles seems to suggest that governmental collection of data is weaponized and information is hoarded by those who want to commercialize the data, charging parents exorbitant fees to see what is in their child's file, and/or correct any inaccuracies. At the prices which parents are being charged to see their child's data, some may say the collected data is being held for ransom.

Some may say the collection of data is also being conducted in a less than transparent manner. This is not the first time on this forum that a parent's post indicated lack of awareness of a permanent school record for kids.

Without true and accurate data, there is false or distorted knowledge which does not benefit human development for the individual about whom the data is collected, nor society at large, but may benefit meglomania. Meanwhile the image one receives from distorted data may be akin to a reflection in a fun-house mirror.

Without regard to need for advocacy, etc, some of these back-office elements of public education may cause some parents to not love their child's school.

Well, all information that exists is stored in the Akashic records anyway, so I guess it's a moot point.

Tools of Ahriman, all of it.

I was going to post yesterday that while I don't LOVE my kids High School, I don't hate it as much as I make it seem on this board. There are pro's and con's. It's much easier to talk about all the stuff that is wrong or that I dislike. And forget to mention the good stuff. The school isn't as good as it "thinks" it is.. but on the other hand it really is better than most of the other alternatives. (Outside private schools that would cost a mint and require a crazy commute.) Some of the pluses are my son has cohort of similar peers, some of his teachers are excellent, and it's very culturally diverse.

I don't post much these days but am adding my $0.02 here. I agree with Bostonian that "love" is a strong word, but I'd say our educational situation here in the midwest is at least a strong "like" at the moment.

We have two kids, twins just turned 15yo, who are freshman in high school. I am not sure about PG or not, but the test scores we do have are DYS level. Their public high school is down the street (<1 mile) from the state flagship university. There has been some very public conflict in recent years pitting the needs of "advanced learners" against social justice at the school - we've benefitted from some resulting changes and there is currently a lull in the conflict. There is always room for improvement, and I am moderately active in keeping constant pressure on the district and school to keep TAG issues on their radar. Here is what we like about the school:

1) many peers who are as strong academically, or even stronger in some areas, than my kids.
2) large enrollment (600 kids/grade) gives my twins space from one another -- they can both take all honors classes in core subjects without having a single class together. Also, there is significant diversity in the student population, especially good for the prickly twin, who is an oddball in so many ways.
3) Mostly good teachers, and some excellent
4) fantastic extracurricular club opportunities
5) within walking distance from home
6) flexibility - when we asked if our kids could work independently in math because their precalc classes were too slow/boring, we met with *no* resistance.
7) in subjects where they have exhausted the hs offerings, in jr and sr years they can take classes at the state flagship (at no cost to us) and count them toward hs graduation requirements.
8) they are challenged in some classes (I am okay if they are not challenged in every class)
9) no tuition

We loved our son's accelerated school-within-a-school elementary program for highly gifted kids. He is now in a new STEAM-based charter middle school with no GT program per se, but lots of opportunities for my to work at his own pace, plus lots of flexibility. So far, we like it a lot.

We live near a major metro area with lots of options plus open enrollment, which is a good combo for finding a good-fit school.

I don't love the school by any stretch of the imagination, but sometimes there's those teachers that just go above and beyond and makes the whole day almost worth it.
Makes us overemotional types want to cry (sometimes mid-class, apparently).

This is a great discussion. Thanks everyone for your input. I will find out over the next couple months how the new school for our kids fits them in practice, it is all looking very promising in theory so far. If we do find the school a good fit, it will only be one more thing on a long list of things we love about where we live that makes it so we never end up deciding to move back closer to family despite how much I miss them. But it will be a very strong thing as it sounds like there are schools out there that can work, but if you find a good one, it's a good idea to stick with it if at all possible.

I don't hate my kid's school I just don't love it. I object to handing over so much control to people i don't know that well, I wish my children were challenged more and I wish the system actually provided more education and told the parents what was going on. There aren't any schools that are significantly different and the kids don't dislike it (they would like shorter hours though) so I just work round the edges.

I agree that love is probably too strong of a word to use in regards to institutional education anywhere. Having said that, I like many things about my kids' previous elementary school and their current middle school. It's not couture or a tailor-fit but mostly good in an off-the-rack with alterations way when you are not a perfect standard size. However, were I inclined to focus on the negatives, particularly as applied to my kids, there would be plenty to criticize as well.

In particular, school has been invaluable for my kids to gain exposure to a variety of people and learn social and coping skills. The extra-curricular offerings, particularly at the middle school level, are wonderful. The opportunities for public speaking and writing have been beneficial and would have been difficult for me to provide in another context.

Alleged misuse of databases of student information reported in this recent article:

EXCLUSIVE: Fraudsters in Department of Education...
Wills Robinson for DailyMail.com
UK Daily Mail
March 2, 2015


The extensive data collection on students, and potential uses/misuses of that information, may be a reason why some parents do not love their child's schooling system.