Anyone else deal with this? What are your kid's symptoms? We live in western WA and we are noticing a seasonal pattern to DS's problems. At three we blamed it on adjusting to a new sibling, at four we blamed it on a bad preschool fit and undiagnosed sensory issues. Now at five we are looking into seasonal allergies (mold) next week but the nurse practitioner brought up the possibility of seasonal affective disorder.

We went to the clinic because in the winter he looks and acts kind of sickly (dark circles under his eyes, irritable and pale pale skin). Last year he drew our family and in complete seriousness colored himself light gray. I was thinking he was anemic or needed vitamins or something. She said his Flintstone once a day is all he needs. She referred us to an allergist and advised us to come back if he either doesn't have allergies or if the irritability persists after the allergies are treated. The irritability is basically that he acts like a tired kid all the time.

I didn't bring up any of the gifted/dyslexia/Eide wait list stuff with the nurse practitioner. I suppose "mental stuff" like that might be relevant to a discussion about SAD but this person was in a rush. I know this because she mentioned several times how she only had a few minutes for our appointment and couldn't really answer questions. Ugh.

I haven't noticed this in our kid, but *I* definitely have been affected from time to time, although it's really more of a low-level depression. Keeping the room very well-lit helps me a lot. Also we live in the South now, so we can go outside most of the time and not freeze, which also helps a lot. I think there are other things people have found helpful, if you Google around. Good luck!

I definitely think there is something to SAD. As with many things some people are more affected than others by environment. I used to feel very out of sorts in the winter when I was a kid, especially around 4-6 pm it was very uncomfortable. I have found that plenty of plants, and definitely a fountain (those table-top ones are really nice...the ones that make noise I think are better) helps my DD and even me. She also likes some sort of tent in the l.r. with blankets and flashlights. Twinkle/holiday lights here and there are good - we even have them in the kitchen and on the mantle in the l.r. This is nice for that dusk time or dark cloudly days.

I've thought about those special lamps. They're expensive but might be worth it.

If you live near a botanical gardens w/ indoor-tropical areas, or a zoo with a rainforest, a weekly visit there w/ membership is really great.

DS8 definitely seems to hit a slump in the winter time. He's less able to attend, moody and makes us pull our hair out. We didn't initially put it together with the seasons, but now that we have we plan on heading it off as much as possible. He'll be bundled and outside as often as he can and I'm looking for full spectrum lightbulbs for his room.

We live in MI and have long dreary winters also. I disagree about the Flintstones being enough. I supplement myself and my daughter with Vitamin D in the winter (you can get some gummy vitamin D for your son). I give her the Flintstone plus two gummy vitamin D per day. If you think about it, Vitamin D isn't a byproduct of any food, milk and whole grain cereals are enriched with it, but that is not enough to give your body what it needs. I know I feel much better when I take the Vitamin D.

Edited to add: the lamps (just like natural sunlight) help your body produce Vitamin D. So supplementing should be sufficient.

YES, YES, YES.


This is our DD.

We finally put this together when she was about 8yo.

It's a combination of things, and so we've used a variety of strategies to get a better handle on things. For one, problems which would seem small or annoying at other times of the year tend to be consuming or massive between late November and early March.

There are several things that contribute to the seasonal affective issues, IMO, with a HG child.

1. They realize sometime in late October, usually, that the proportion of "new stuff that I'll be learning this year" is pretty low when compared with "slow pace of instruction" and "review" not to mention "busywork that I could do half-asleep." This disappointment is not insignificant in a lot of instances.

2. Poor weather and short days make it difficult to get NATURAL light in large amounts-- or a lot of exercise.

3. Any illness exacerbates both of the first two problems, and it's that time of year.

So what we've done about this (living near the 48th parallel, it gets fully dark here about 4:30 this time of year... yikes) is:

a) we have a dog. A very intelligent, energetic young dog. This dog MUST be walked daily-- or she is incredibly disruptive and destructive. So DD walks her very briskly for about an hour each morning as soon as it is fully light out (right now that is about 8 am)-- this provides two VERY essential things for battling any affective disorder: daylight and exercise.

b) we use broad-spectrum lights in strategic locations in our house-- in DD's overhead light in her room, and in one lamp in our living room. Use these judiciously, however-- because they can interfere with the ability to GO to sleep if you sit under one too late in the day! These are just fluorescent bulbs, about ~$15 bucks at most home-improvement stores, by the way.

c) Good sleep hygiene, and this involves screen time, too. NO computer/tv within an hour of sleep time.

d) maintain a schedule as well as you can-- be flexible, of course, but do NOT allow sleeping during the daytime, unhealthy coping mechanisms, etc.


To the OP-- we live in this part of the world as well. Winters are long and grey here, it's true. But don't discount the academic disappointment hypothesis I listed above. I do think that this can be a major exacerbating factor.


DD mentioned this to me yesterday-- that she is SO much happier "this year" than ever before. Part of it is the exercise, which we've made non-negotiable aside from illness (and we make her prove it with her peak-flow meter or a fever, frankly)...

she attributes it to her two AP classes this year, which she pretty much spends 60% of her 'school' time on. Learning and working at something close to her readiness level has made a HUGE difference in her attitude about school, and about everything else, too.

KJP, I thought I replied to this last night - must not have hit the submit button lol!

FWIW, we live relatively far north of you, and quite a few folks up here do feel the impact of SAD. Although I don't know of any children who are impacted by it I do know quite a few adults with SAD. I'd second all the recommendations for providing extra light and physical exercise. If there is a time of day that's brightest, be sure to get your child outside when you can during that time of day. Even though they aren't broad spectrum, you might try stringing a few Christmas lights around inside your house wherever your ds spends a lot of time - we find them cheery and folks in our part of the world leave those lights up all winter long until the sun returns

All of that said, the main point I want to emphasize, is to be sure to follow through on the allergy testing. My dd10 has mold allergies - and they can both be seasonal and appear to be seasonal even if they aren't. There are *so* many different types of mold, and an allergist can usually determine through testing which of the different types of mold found in your area are (or aren't) impacting your child. For instance, my dd is allergic to snow mold - it appears in our area in the spring when our snow cover melts. When she was younger, we could see the impact in her behavior. She is also allergic to the type of mold that grows on books and newspapers etc - this isn't a seasonal allergy *but* it can appear seasonal because she's inside school during the winter months where there is more of it. Now that she is older, the symptoms appear less in her behavior because she's more aware of what's up with her body - so for instance, she knows that when she's in the school library and her nose gets sniffly and she feels like coughing, it's the mold and she needs to leave the room. When she was little, she'd just act out because she didn't really understand the connections plus she had no way to "escape".

Mold allergies are tricky to catch - I'm glad your NP was aware of them and recommended seeing an allergist. It might be nothing, but by testing at least you've crossed that question off your list. If it is mold allergies, the symptoms are easily controlled with daily medication during mold season, and it is the type of allergy kids can (if and when a parent wants them to) go through allergy shots for desensitization and the shots work very well for most of the people I know who've gone through them.

Best wishes,

polarbear

Hmmm-- and on that subject, don't necessarily discount the impact of dust mite allergies as a "seasonal" allergen, either-- more time spent in indoor, carpeted, upholstered environments in the winter months can make that one SEEM like a seasonal allergy, too.

Also-- pet allergies if you yourself have a pet-free home, but classmates don't. Coats, see-- only a problem for some of the year in our part of the world.

Mold allergies can really impact quality of life a lot without you really registering that something is wrong. It is amazing what it feels like for any one of our family to go without daily antihistamine for a few days. Unreal how awful it feels.

Thanks for the suggestions everyone. The appointment with the allergy doctor is Monday and as I understand it we'll get answers that day. I'll update then.

A common mistake with supplements is taking them without food, or even the right kind of food. Certain vitamins and minerals come in a fat-soluble form, and taking them without some dietary fat accompanying them renders them completely inaccessible to your body, and they just pass through the urine.

Vitamin D falls into this category, so it's possible that this is still the result of a vitamin D deficiency, even though he's chewing his Flintstones every day.

So he wasn't terribly allergic to anything. The only ones that were confirmed were grass and dust mites. She gave us instructions on modifying his room and advised us to give him Zyrtec as needed. So while it is good information, I don't think it explains what has been going on with him. I suppose we'll see once we make the changes.

Where we are (southern BC) in the winter it's dark by 4:30ish (ugh). I think I've suffered from SAD in the past. Interestingly this is no longer the case and I've often wondered if it's because of the time I spend in front of a computer screen?

My kids seem fine. We walk outdoors a lot, though (thanks to the relentless ADHD motors! lol) and I also give them Vitamin D drops. The fat solubility issue is solved because I add the drops to their protein shakes, which contain fat-laden milk.

Try the zyrtec for a week or two. (Helpful tip, by the way, is that Costco has the generic in quantity and at low cost.)

That's really the only way you'll know if all of this is tied to sleep issues that can be the result of a dustmite allergy.

CCN, we have definitely not found that screen time is helpful-- if anything, just the opposite. Maybe it's less of a problem because you're out and moving around more because of your kids?

I was out shopping for allergen and dust mite proof mattress and pillow covers and ended up getting one of the natural light lamps someone mentioned. While I was looking at them two random people walked by and highly recommended them so I figured why not.

A couple of good examples of what is going on:
He had some experiment going in the backyard involving food in Tupperware. He was trying to see what mold grew on what food or something like that. A raccoon ate his experiment and he became a sobbing mess. It took a lot of talking about scientists making unintentional discoveries (raccoons can open Tupperware and will eat moldy food) and redesigning his experiment for next time.

His teacher told him blood that had oxygen was red and blood that didn't have oxygen was blue and this is why veins look blue. Independent study revealed this is all false. Cue huge sobbing melt down about not being able to learn from a person who doesn't know things.

These things four months ago would have been a bit disappointing but now they are overwhelming. Plus his attitude towards school has gotten bad in the last month or so. He thinks it is boring. It isn't level of instruction. The math worksheets, spelling tests, etc. are all appropriately challenging, he just thinks math worksheets and spelling tests are boring.

Boring school....yes my ds6 is depressed with this also. Just wanted to add to this complex mood situation: just as allergies can suppress moods, so can allergy meds. My ds gets very moody/tearful/irritable on Zyrtec and ESPECIALLY Singulair. So we have to deal with him not feeling good WITHOUT allergy meds but also not so much WITH.

Light is an amazing natural antidepressant. Even daylight filtered through clouds is helpful with mood enhancing vs only incandescent light. I hope you see success with the lamp. Please let us know.

A good friend of mine has been discussing vit D deficiencies. I think we may start drops in addition to our gummy vits.

Ugh. And here we are again this year. I thought the special light and more free time with friends in after school care would help but apparently not enough. Cold weather and short days have meant little outside play the last few weeks.

DS6 is now an emo mess. Crying over every little bump in the road of life.

Maybe go to Hawaii for Christmas?

I think I just need to make exercise in the outdoors a priority. We could walk to school three days a week. It would take about 45 min. We could make taking the dog to the park a daily after school activity.

Any other tips?

KJP, we definitely noticed a downward trend in DD over the past four days-- when it has simply been too icy out for her normal routine to be SAFE.

She was back to it this morning, and much better this afternoon.