My husband and I need some advice.

Our son, (6.7) has had an ongoing problem with selective hearing loss. Or so it seems. Maybe he has auditory processing disorder or something, we don't know.

The problem is summed up nicely by an example from this morning at school drop-off:

DS' backpack had a note in it that needed to be given to the teacher today. I attached it to his vocabulary notebook (that was supposed to be returned yesterday, but he forgot) and told him when he gets into class, to give the notebook and note to his teacher. I even opened his backpack and showed it to him. He looked as if he was paying attention and so I put it back and quizzed him, "Now what are you supposed to do first thing when you get into class?" He answered give the teacher his note and vocab book.

Well, not one minute later, he's out of the car and just walking off. Leaving his backpack and lunch on the front seat where it always is. He gets about twenty feet away from me and turns around and waves goodbye. I say, "What is WRONG with this picture??!!" He just hesitated. I said, "What did you forget?"

Only then did he realize he didn't have his backpack and lunch.

He's been in school since the first part of September and the routine is the same every morning, so it's not like he didn't know to put on his backpack and take his lunch.

My husband thinks he was so busy in his head trying to remember to give his teacher the note/notebook that he forgot the backpack it was in.

This is a classic example of what we deal with off-and-on with him. We give him instruction and it's really like "in one ear, and out the other" without making contact with his brain.

Does anyone have an idea of what is wrong with him? Is it just immaturity? We thought he would have outgrown this by now. We're concerned he is missing important instructions in class and not telling us he needs to bring in things. Like his reading minutes log, for instance-of which on his progress report the teacher gave him a fat zero when he has in fact logged in over 600 minutes so far! I sent that today, too.

Does anyone have an idea of what is wrong with him?

Yeah-- he's six.

Honestly-- even teenagers do stuff like this with some regularity. It's because they are still getting used to the cognitive controls, that's all.

This is why children lack certain rights and responsibilities under the law until they are a lot older. They're pretty flaky until the executive development is complete, and with HG+ kids, that's not until their mid-20's, it seems. Actuarial science doesn't lie, there. There's a reason you have to be 25 to rent a car. LOL.

My husband wants to ask the teacher to send home notes with DS to help him remember, but I said that is just going to enable him to continue along as he has been.

Sympathy. I agree with HK - nothing you say here suggests he's out of the ordinary in this respect for a 6yo. Of course it's possible that he's doing this kind of thing even more than normal - but honestly, I don't think many 6yos can be trusted to remember to do something at a given moment, even once, i.e. I think a 100% failure rate at that kind of challenge is still within normal.

Well into the 20th century it was common for young Americans to find jobs and get married in their late teens and early twenties. There are countries today where if you want to be a doctor, you take the pre-med courses during the equivalent of our 11th and 12th grades and then take a competitive entrance exam for medical school. To some extent, children will grow up faster if they allowed and encouraged to do so.

I was super forgetful as a kid and my mom was a complete enabler. I would leave stuff at home, get sent to the principal's office, call my mom and she would bring it to school. This happened a lot.

I out grew it.

I didn't end up dependent on my mom to help. In fact by high school I was probably unusually independent. I worked, had a packed extracurricular schedule, was in the top of my class, registered and drove to my SAT and ACT on my own and did all my college and scholarship applications on my own with no parental involvement or even awareness.

So at six I was constantly hearing "That girl would lose her head if it weren't attached to her body" and ten years later I was completely independent.

Beyond the age part, absent-minded professor is an archetype because it exists. I think there is a mixed blessing in the configuration of some gifted brains, where it can be 100% on focus on a single task. So anything being reinforced in short-term memory is at risk once they've turned their exclusive attention to something else. Also that 100% flow state is an enjoyable place, so may take longer to balance out for someone wired that way.

I was thinking about the term executive function, and how often I see C level executives with executive secretaries. They are inseparable, because the executive is 100% on game running the company. Schedules, appointments, timelines, briefcases, anniversary presents are the domain of the person 100% on game in managing a wide range of interrupt and time-based functions.

For some kids they have great executive function in what they've specialized in, but what they really need to develop is their executive secretarial function.

Somewhat ironically, teachers seem to have the same issue in reverse.

I'm feeling encouraged that this will work itself out. Meantime, anyone have a recommendation for a good downer for mommy?

I was going to ask if you had borrowed my (7 year old) DS. :-) He will put his shoes, which are next to his backpack on, and walk write out the door, sans backpack.

Perhaps I am enabling, but on a crazy morning, I have been known to toss said backpack in our van myself before anyone heads out the door.

We've been having some of this discussion in the 2E section, here:

http://giftedissues.davidsongifted..../Remembering_Assignments.html#Post171364

I bought the book recommended in the middle of that thread, and have been reading it -- I hope it provides some help. Mine is 11 and only has his head because it's screwed on really tightly.

Forgetting my own head if it wasn't screwed on pretty well described me until maybe my mid teens. Especially at 6 I think it is normal to be forgetful about mundanities. Further, no amount of ranting and raving at me about it, up to and including corporal punishment - yes, it must have been truly infuriating for adults - did a thing to change it.

Within reason, I think vigilance together with grinning and bearing it is your only option.

I thought that I had made the original post when I read it! My child cannot remember and follow multi-part instructions to save his life. It is a hit or miss scenario and a parent needs to closely monitor every single thing. He is also 6 years old.
In my child's school, this has become an epidemic - the principal wrote a letter to parents that beginning this month, we were NOT supposed to help students remember to take backpacks, lunchboxes, homework, notes, library books etc. He wants them to face the consequences of not remembering and hopes this will teach them to be more responsible and not forgetful. He says, the school would provide a free apple to kids who forget their lunches (they will remember to bring it the next day onwards, hopefully). And the homework will be graded as incomplete if missing and the child cannot borrow library books for forgeting to bring in theirs.
I watch my kid closely and give him hints instead of telling him what he forgot. I am hoping that spending time puzzling over what it is will make him remember it next time. I also make him repeat the instructions verbatim and ask him "what does that mean?" for good measure. I think, for him, this is related to age, stresses at school and too much stimuli in his life and little downtime. I don't see any cure for it - just more habit training.

You can't make that part of their brains develop any faster or slower. It will develop at it's own pace.

At age 6 there should be a binder or folder or planner that goes between the parents and teacher every day that contains homework information, field trip notices and the like, and a behavior report.

The charter school didn't have that in place last year and I brought it up about a million times - this year it's in place. Yay for planners! As the kids get older the teachers have them write in it more and more, and hopefully by middle school the kids basically handle the planner all on their own.

I just don't think it's fair to expect elementary school aged kids to remember everything on their own. I can't remember squat and I'm 33! I have to put everything down in my phone. They need someone to teach them about writing down information on a regular basis.

I still forget my head sometimes!!! (ok, not really... but...)

FWIW, out of my three kiddos, one has a 2e challenge which organization *was* a huge part of - he was doing things like you mentioned all the time at 6 (and even at 9-10), but he was clearly disorganized in other areas too. We heard a *lot* of feedback from his teachers starting around 2nd grade that he had organizational challenges. At 6, we heard nothing from his teachers - not because he *wasn't* challenged with organization, but because every other 6 year old was too - totally developmentally typical.

My dds are not 2e (with respect to organization). My older dd is not the most organized kid ever, but I'd say she's relatively typical. Remembering lunchbox, backpack, turning in homework etc started happening for her regularly around 2nd-3rd grade. My youngest dd is eerily uber-organized - I'd go out there on a ledge and suggest she's teetering on PG with respect to organization. Even for her the regular remembering and not getting lost in other thoughts etc didn't really happen until around 2nd grade. She's in 4th now, and she's clearly an outlier with this one particular skill area compared to her classmates.

I also think you'll see clues to this in most teacher's classrooms at 6 too - communication via weekly folders, notes from teachers that spell out everything that a child needs to bring to school rather than having the kids remember or copy from the board etc.

So hang in there - chances are this will all go away in just a few years!

polarbear

This is just a side note - but fwiw, remembering and not being able to follow multi-part instructions are possibly different skills/challenges. Forgetting to pick up your backpack from the car seat and then 10 seconds later being reminded by your mom and not knowing what she's talking about sounds like a typical 6 year old excited to be out the door and off to school and simply not *thinking* about the backpack. Not seeing a backpack next to your foot also sounds typical of a 6 year old who's thinking of something else like tying his shoe. Not being able to follow a multi-step direction when you're told, for example, to pick up a book and take it to your room, then come back downstairs (totally just an example) ... isn't necessarily typical at 6. I suspect this isn't really what was meant here... but I wanted to point that out simply because this *was* a challenge for one of my kiddos at that age (due to vision challenges) and it really wasn't typical.

polarbear

I fall somewhere in the middle. I will rescue food forgetting for my one son because he has limited food that he will eat and if he misses a meal it affects his ability to function.

School work if I can help I will because I would hope someone would for me if I forgot something important. But usually that is once or twice a year. I just fetched a pair of glasses for the 8 year old...he can't see...not going to let him suffer the natural consequences.

BUT I also teach my kids to do a verbal checklist each time we leave the house and am teaching them other organizational skills. So proactive, not punishing. And if it is a daily thing then no, I wouldn't but random oops I do help if I can.

Yes, I too am in the middle on this - doing my best to help DS get organised but also happy to help/rescue if he needs it and I can. I ask my DH to rescue me from time to time too... I will say, though, that over the last year or two DS9 has made enormous progress in this area, and I really can't complain now. So hang in there, improvement may not be that far off...

Thank you for pointing this out, polarbear. In my child's case, if I told him "Don't forget your backpack, take out the note for the teacher and give it to her and then zip the backpack shut" - he would only remember the first part of it or none of it most of the times, occasionally he would do all of it. Since I am always giving multipart instructions, I am not sure whether that is the problem or it is just forgetfulness.
I am going to test him using simple/single instructions to see how well he can remember/follow them. So, thank you for suggesting that I pay attention to this issue.
OP: sorry for taking your thread off-tangent ...

My son forgets everything- just simple things like to comb his hair. His routine is the same every morning. I have notes all over the house, that remind him to do things. On the mirror, I have Don't forget to comb your hair, on the light switch I have Don't forget to turn off the light, just reminders all over the house. Is there a way to attach a note to his backpack, to remind him of something he needs to do when he gets to school?

I replied earlier.. but I don't see my post.. I may have responded wrong, so I will try again.. hopefully I don't end up responding twice..
My son forgets everything.. just the simplest tasks, and things he is suppose to do every single day. I made little signs all over the house- in the bathroom I have a sign on the mirror that says, don't forget to comb your hair. I have a sign on the door that says don't forget to wash your hands, I have signs in the shower that say don't forget to wash your hair and rinse it out. I have a sign on the front door that says "don you have your backpack, lunchbox, and glasses" These signs do seem to help remind him of just daily things that he forgets.. is there a way you can put some kind of sign or tag on the outside of his backpack, that isn't obvious and embarrassing that reminds him to give the note to his teacher- or whatever else you want him to remember?

My 6 yr old would get on the bus every day without his backpack if I didn't put it on his back. Also he loses his glasses many times per week even though he wears them all day until bedtime... How this happens I have no idea. Yesterday I let my kids get a box of lollipops for Halloween and my daughter asked me where the box was and she was holding it in her hands. When kids are that little they think whatever they are thinking about is the most important thing in the world and my kids are probably thinking about things 24/7. I think they are just not super focused on things that are less important to them. Of course if you say something they are not supposed to hear they will remember it for the rest of their lives ha! Hopefully it's just your son being a 6 year old.

I just don't expect much of ds6. The other day i put his hat on his head and he took it off and lost it before he left the house. I didn't notice so i guess he was only allowed to play in the shade at lunch time. I am starting to expect a bit more over the next few years but i don't feel the need to create more stress for myself by expecting more from him than he is able to manage at this point.

This happens all the time with DD18 and DD16 (though DD18 is off at school, so it is her problem now). The worst is that they insist on wearing flip flops when traveling to a softball tournament. They say that they will put on the cleats when we are approaching the field...which is great, but you can't put on your cleats if they are sitting at home. More than once we have been driving on a toll highway when I look around and don't see cleats...I do usually remember to take inventory before we leave so this doesn't happen too often. They get annoyed with the inventory and have insisted they have everything, only to arrive at the field without some key piece of equipment. They are not the only ones to do this though. I see plenty of teammates do the same thing - I think it is pretty common among all sorts of kids.

This may sound mean, but maybe as they approach adulthood they have to face the consequences of forgetting. You could ask them before getting in the car if they have everything and then drive them to the game. If they don't have cleats or other needed equipment -- they don't play. You would explain beforehand the new approach.

And maybe even help them type up a list to keep in the equipment bag that they can check when you ask the general question with the new approach.

That is true to a point, but I think this method should be deployed with care.

We have a super-forgetful DS11: turning in homework and keeping track of papers is an especial problem. While some would advocate a "cold turkey" approach, we are doing this more gradually.

In some cases, he truly doesn't have the skills yet, so we break them down and teach/support until he has them. In the case of soccer cleats, that would look like a leaving-the-house checklist. I'd probably prompt the use of the checklist but not the actual items. In the case of homework, it's a reminder to use the planner and checking on completed homework going to the right folder, but less and less support of the doing of the homework itself. We are no longer micro-managing content, but we sure used to.

We are over time gradually raising our expectations and withdrawing our support according to our estimate of what he can do successfully. Crises stress him out and make him feel he's incapable; he does better with gradual work on these issues and a track record of success that boosts his belief in his ability to organize.

We are also having him serve as his own advocate when he messes up: you forgot to turn this in, you go make it right with the teacher. That's a natural consequence, too, but one that builds problem-solving skills.

While the list would help, I doubt that they wouldn't play if they forgot their cleats. (I actually have a list for overnight tournaments, so they could easily access that on my laptop.) Either someone would retrieve the cleats (me, DH, grandparents, another team parent) and would get them there before the start of the second game, or they could borrow footwear. Maybe there wouldn't be an extra pair of cleats, but certainly players and moms would have sneakers (and my kids wear a very common size).

If I didn't enable, certainly another parent or coach would. This approach is easier with school stuff though, since other parents would not be enablers.

I think that DD18 has gotten better over the past few years since she has had to pack her own bags for various overnight trips. Also, now that she is 3 hours away, we can't be running things to her, so she has to figure it out herself. I suspect DD16 will get better once she is off at school. DD9 doesn't seem to have as much of an issue with forgetting stuff.

If this were my family, there wouldn't be the retrieving part--there would be a prompt before leaving the house, but no parental scramble to fix the situation, not for an extracurricular activity. Borrowing shoes is itself a natural consequence (ew, plus they won't fit well).

But only you know what works for your family! If this is really OK for you, DH, the grands, etc., that's yours.

We have made more effort to "fix" things that WE think are important, like retrieving the homework paper he left at school *with him* (not retrieving it for him). Our feeling was that in elementary, if he left the paper at school and undone, he would get extra free time (because less homework) and be allowed to recognize that it wasn't that important. We chose to cultivate the feeling that school is very important, even though it was inconvenient for us-- and the natural consequence was that he lost free time in going back to school and retrieving the paper, as well as then having to do the homework.

We tend to think it through as "is the right behavior being rewarded?" We try to set it up so it's really easiest and most pleasing if they do the right thing.

This is useful not just for testing, but for practice. We started with "go to the basement and bring me a can of chicken stock" and have progressed to 2- and 3- item lists...

I'd solve the cleats issue differently. The consequence would be the loss of privilege of wearing flip-flops in the car. The child would wear cleats to the next tournament. They can't forget to bring something they're already wearing.

Of course, she'd probably forget something else next time, but a cap, glove, or bat are easier to borrow.

Yep, this is the best solution, and I constantly tell them to just put the cleats on. Glove, bats, sunglasses, mouth guard and face mask are in the softball bag (along with dirty socks and countless half finished Gatorades), which they do remember.

I'm embarrassed to say I purchased that book earlier this year, yet only have read about one third of it. It's in my dresser drawer along with at least three other orphaned books. (My trouble-I get distracted by a new, shiny book and move on before I'm through with the first. Or second; or third...)

I will definitely get it back out! Thanks for the reminder-HA!

As I read the comments, I recalled my son yelling for help in the tub last night. I was making dinner and couldn't leave the stove, but my husband went in to see him.

He came back out to report DS wanted help washing. He's entirely capable of doing that, at his age.

It occurred to us that DS is going through a stage of wanting to be babied and missing the close, one-on-one attention and help he used to get.

Perhaps his recent excessive "forgetfulness" is a reflection of that?

Today when I dropped DS off at school, I went in to talk to the teacher about the note, etc. She told me she got it and as for the reading minutes, no log had been requested of the children. Huh? I'm still at a loss as to why the minutes are even a category on the progress report, but if she's not worried, I'm not.

As for the communication folders mentioned, she had those for us, but they aren't always in DS' backpack. I think they spend some time on her desk getting stuffed with flyers and such. I couldn't send a note in that because it wasn't in the backpack that morning. *shrugs*

Oh, as a side note-I asked her about how the kids are notified they are to bring things home to complete, etc. She writes the instructions on the blackboard. She said not all the kids remember to look there. I would expect her to call the attention of the class to it and tell everyone to copy it down daily.

You can tell we are still trying to get a feel for the teaching style of this teacher. (And the overall culture of this school, to be frank.)