I'm not sure if this belongs here or not. I hope so

This may be a silly question but one I wonder about often. For those who have not gotten their children tested but consider them GT, how do you know? What gives you the confidence to say "My DD or DS is GT." DD7 and DS1 identify with soooo many of the characteristics and academically she has high scores in areas that GT children normally do, especially in reading. With reading so many research articles, posts and things on GT, DH, DD7 and myself identify with much of HG traits I still have a hard time being confident about it. Is this a social thing because most people feel uncomfortable with knowing or discussing GT? I don't talk to many about it and those that I do, do not judge or feel uncomfortable. I guess what I'm wondering is do others feel the same and lack confidence despite it making sense that their child or themselves are GT without the scientific evidence to back their feelings up?

I think there are people around here that haven't have their kids tested; but know they are gt.

I think as a parent, honestly, you know. I knew. We tested mere to help advocate for our ds. I think most people wait to test until there is a need, a benefit to the child. Otherwise, you just follow your dc's lead and enjoy:)

Some kids are clearly beyond the rest to the point that you can't miss it. When you have one, life has usually given you plenty of moments when you realize that no the other two year olds aren't discussing DNA at playdates. Many children discussed here fit that bill before they are old enough to test. Also IQ is highly heritable so if you know you and your spouse were, it's likely junior is too. However, very honestly, I expected my son's IQ to be lower than it was. I had him pegged more as EG than PG. I wouldn't have guessed that. I like testing and data. It's much more effective than guessing and has been very helpful to us in understanding some of our son's struggles as well as gifts. We would know so much less without the testing we've done.

I assume my dad is GT...he graduated from the Naval Academy in engineering and he is one of the smartest people I know.

I have two brother's that tested gifted (one of them I saw his results by accident and he is PG) and he was one of those kids that just knew stuff without being taught and could sleep through class and get 100s on everything.

My dh's sister's son tested gifted and I would assume he is PG just from knowing him. He skipped a grade and could have skipped another (he earned several credits for 9th grade in middle school and only needed to take one online summer school class to skip to 10th grade) but he has a brother in 10th grade and his mom doesn't want them both going to college the same year.

One of my sons has Asperger's and tests gifted (right at the cut off). I often wonder if that is accurate because they didn't use a WISC but used the RIAS and I wonder if his anxiety/Asperger's suppressed the score a bit but it could be right on.

My younger son tested PG on the K-ABC-II and then just under PG on the WISC when I private tested (why our school system doesn't give a WISC I'll never know). I KNEW he was a smart cookie. I didn't know he was that out there. It was kind of a shocker.

As for myself, I had one older brother and one younger brother who were REALLY out there. I always, always felt less than gifted (and was never tested). Chances are I am not PG but I assume I am at least gifted.

DD7 is not the child that it is just very evident such as discussing DNA at 2. It's just not 100% clear. I would be shocked if she was not at minimum MG and would question why she is so different than her peers. I mentioned in another post that I have known something is different about her for a few years. A lot of the posts I read are very similar to her. I'm not around many children to know she is very beyond her peers. The children I am around that are her age, she is clearly very different. From an outside perspective they don't get her, she is more intense in everything she does, i.e excitement, hugging, riding her bike, etc. her peers often times either don't want to play with her or are yelling at her because she is doing her own thing and not what they want or she is so deeply interested in a bug or the like that she doesn't hear them. None of the other kids act this way. We call her a runner because after learning to walk she started to run and never stopped. She runs more than walks and often times as a toddler would run and explore. I'm sure many can relate on here but none of my friends children do/did these things. I often times wished I had calmer children that were satisfied with playing on the floor quietly.

As far as I know DH and I were never tested. I have talked to my mom many times about DD and myself and she has never mentioned that she knows my IQ. DH has always been incredibly smart to me and I recently found out he had a perfect score on a test he took after high school. Academics have always come easy to DH and I and we have never had to study much to get good grades. Unfortunately, because academics came so easily we never developed study skills. It would've been helpful for college as we are both procrastinators because we know it doesn't require much effort on our part to get an A.

Yup.

My DD is almost certainly PG.

We've never tested her, so we don't know.

But her intellectual development places her most solidly into "quite able college student" range most comfortably, and she is 14.


We were grossly mistaken about her when she was tiny. We thought MG at that point. Then she learned to read-- and the trajectory was simply superhuman. Nobody who ISN'T EG can master a complex domain like that with THAT little practice in that short a period of time. When I say "learned to" read, what I mean is, from phonetically controlled Bob books to adult level material in a matter of months, and at an age where many children lack the capacity to learn even with a lot of targeted instruction.

Kids who are autodidacts are really easy to spot.

The ones who aren't, and who are socially adroit, tend to be tougher, in my experience with my DD, because those kids only "show" facets of themselves that match others' criteria/expectations at any one time. Who expects a conversation about existential philosophy with a 7yo?? Nobody-- and my kid was one that would immediately adjust to that flicker of cognitive dissonance in a listener...
Ahhh-- no meaning-of-life stuff, then... right-- Legos and Care Bears it is.

These are the kids that run through elementary school without anyone REALIZING that they aren't learning the material as they go (because they already know it)-- just 'demonstrating' it.

We just had the testing done a few months ago for DS7. We had a pretty good idea that he might be gifted based on how early he knew letters and numbers (counted to ten at 14 months, was able to spell simple words with moveable letters at 2 years, etc.). He was also super-advanced with puzzles, blocks and games.

We had a few teachers and the head of his prior school, which was a Montessori school, comment on how off-the-charts bright he was and how he kept them on their toes. We also had the mother of a PG son tell us she thought our DS was very gifted and that we should consider testing, but last year's issues with a new school had us second-guessing ourselves.

Testing has helped us understand his abilities and achievement so far, which truly has made a difference in advocating for him at a new school. Granted, they were much more ready to do differentiation from the start, but knowing how far ahead he truly is made us more comfortable in asking for more.

Prior to testing, I read the Five Levels of Gifted, (which I know many don't agree with, for various reasons). It was very accurate for our DS, and the first indication that he might be HG or PG. He tested as PG. Before reading the book, I had no idea there were differences in levels other than just being gifted vs. NT (whatever that truly is...).

To be totally honest it wasn't until I saw test results that I finally admitted it. DH and I both relocated for work after university and 99% of our friends were found through work (everyone has some sort of BSc+) so we're almost always surrounded by crazy smart people. Coincidentally enough most of them have pretty smart kids so we live in a bit of a bubble. Admittedly, DS7 stands out even among them but we still never really thought that much of it until school was a complete disaster so we got testing to prove them wrong and it was a bit eye opener even for us. In retrospect there were a lot of indicators but really it didn't matter until we entered the school system.

DD5, I still don't know. She is completely different than DS so I guess we'll have to wait and see. We'll likely get her tested eventually but are hopefully holding off for a bit.

I am in the same boat with DS5. We have not tested yet, but my gut tells me he's gifted. I find that some people are offended by my assumption and so I'm careful about how I talk about it in certain settings. On this forum, though, I feel I can speak openly about my concerns, beliefs, expectations, etc. In the interim to needing testing, I'm educating myself...through this forum, books, etc. Am I 100% confident all the time? No, I have my doubts, but I've learned that until the time comes for testing, I just have to trust my gut.

Did you know your kids were more advanced than their peers in those areas that were less obvious? Does everything stand out clearly?

Things that stand out when on this site but things I considered normal (naive I guess) is DD& knew her numbers, ABC's, a few songs and things of the like by 2. I know she could count in spanish and english around that age too. I never really kept track of milestones like that because at the time it didn't seem out of the ordinary. I know she was usually ahead on the baby milestones but thought they were low ends anyway. In hindsight I knew others whose kids were older by 2+ yrs than DD at the time and didn't know those things. Another thing that struck me is how quick DD learned to read. She read a book to me at 5 prior to K and we thought it was a fluke since my mom read her the same book the night before. After starting K last August she was reading well by Sept. I figured this was pretty common as I really don't have a comparison.

I've always felt DD was different. Not in the intellectual way though. When we got together with friends and family DD was always the most energetic, eccentric and intense child. If we went to the park or museum it was hard to get her to walk instead of run. As she got older it got a little easier. Friends kids were always so well behaved and calmer. They wouldn't have tantrums at 5 or 6. I didn't always feel comfortable around certain people because I felt judged by DD behaviors.

DS1 is easier to know something is up because he is still so young. I'm also more aware of what is typical for his age. He walked at 9m and has a vocabulary of many words compared to his peers. I've had a few people tell me he is different and very alert and observant from birth.

DD is only 3.3 so she hasn't been tested and I am not at all confident. She certainly has skills that are above developmental expectations when it comes to reading, math (that is her main area of strength/talent), puzzles, and such. She also makes me think scientists are born, not made; when she scraped her knee badly a month ago, she had to research into how her body is healing the wound.

I think she is an amazing child but doesn't every mother feel that way about her children?

The idea that she may be a PG tickles my funny bone. No, I really don't think she is one. I think it freaks people out to see her be able to read anything put in front of her and be interested in grand scientific concepts but how much of that is exposure? I was talking to another mother yesterday and she had never taken her child to a library, like ever. We go every other day and I get nervous if we have less than 30 unread books piled up in the apartment. SO and I read to her about an hour a day and she reads to herself for another hour. She spends at least an hour on mathy activities a day and if I don't put a cap on that, I think she'd go all day exploring numbers. So yes, I suppose she might test rather high on achievement tests during earlier years but I have no idea where her IQ would fall.

I though ds6 might just scrape in to MG. I am only just accepting (nearly a year after testing) that he is in fact fairly well in to the PG area.

One other thought: When ds6 was younger (1-3), we didn't know/ realize ds was different. We thought all kids knew/ did the things he could do. It caused some major problems with my sister-in-law. Not only was it then obvious that our kids were on 2 different plains, but made it seem (to her) that we were bragging and/or showing off.
Also, when ds3 came along, my dh thought he was behind- always (slow to talk, just recently mastered letters and numbers). Yet, he is a very different child and is VERY interested in how things work. We'll have to wait to see with him.

Yep, that sounds like my DS. ABCs early, reading early, adding and subtracting early. I didnt realize he was different until preschool when the other 4 year olds were just learning their ABCs. So maybe our kids arent PG like some on this site, but they still have special needs and extra challenges.

I don't find there's any need IRL to say that DS is GT, though I sometimes say things that relate. So being sure about it doesn't really seem to matter very much. But at this point, if he had an IQ test and it didn't show +3sd on at least some indices? I'd mistrust the test, honestly. What makes me that sure is what he can do. He also presents similarly to many children here with intensity etc. DH and I are similar so we half expected it, too.

Totally agree with Colinsmum on this one- no one in our area really cares much about testing or labels (unless you're talking about the school program, which is a different thing altogether). It's about what one can do. And our DD isn't subtle about showing it, so we have never really had much in the way of doubt.

The school pullout is different, parents want their kids in it, but to be honest, our kids have been so far beyond what I see the others doing that again we didn't have much in the way of doubts. (One of the GT teachers was just smitten with DS and loved working with him- she would get excited telling us what he was doing). I think as they get older the differences have been reinforced, so I guess that has made knowing clearer, if you know what I mean. (The limited standardized testing done through school, every darn teacher's initial reaction when working with DD, the academic competitions, the SCAT testing we did for enrichment programs, all helped confirm for us, but we really didn't have doubt).

Our DS is more subtle in how he "shows his stuff," but this is I believe due to his personality (and perhaps following in the footsteps of an accomplished sibling) and I don't have doubts about him, either. But again, it may be because I know what he can do- I don't mean to sound arrogant, but for us knowing specific numbers wouldn't change anything- we just don't need it in our case.

Our school saw no need to test my DD for a 3y acceleration. So yeah-- that would indicate to me that she's very, very obviously PG. It is still sometimes hard for me to wrap my head around that because I have an image in my head of "PG" which is probably more along the lines of "way, way out-there PG with a single area of focus, and likely ASD" and she is NOT that kid. She presents as hypernormal, and perfectly good at most things, or COMPLETELY average at them. (MarySue.) If you're paying attention, she's too normal; Stepford-ish. Even we only get tantalizing flashes of "otherness" but they are things that agemates can't-- developmentally-- do.

Anyway--the school won't accelerate ANY kid beyond what will test well on standardized annual testing. They certainly didn't seem to be worried that other parents would be beating down the door asking for the same luxury treatment.

(When they are still 99-ing out-of-level assessments year after year, then you know, I guess.)

Fwiw, I think that many of us posting here are not mental midgets so there is a danger that we can think our kids are 'normal' in terms of mental ability. It's only once they hit school that it becomes apparent In my experience.

Thanks for saying this. There are times I wonder what's wrong with me that I didn't recognize just how gifted he was sooner or even now, sometimes underestimate ds11. Part of the issue is asynchronicity, part of it is he doesn't fit the precocious stereotype one sees in the news, part of it is his gifts present differently than his brother's, and part of it is I suppose I don't know what's typical since my ds24 is gifted and ds11's friends are all gifted.

Maybe I worded things wrong previously, as a number wouldn't make any difference for us other than knowing how to advocate appropriately, where she stands and whether I should seek out other options academically. She is not testing 99% on the normal school assessments, all but 3 areas came back in the 90+%. I personally would like more confidence as I feel when advocating for her, right now I'm kind of going in blind, if that makes sense. The under performance throws me off a lot and lowers my confidence in the whole thing.

I'm more so wondering if it is very clear for all kids. As they get older I see how it would be but when school age and below I'm not sure. Most of what DD was doing prior to school I assumed to be typical of her age and I guess when you look at a child individually and not in comparison it was typical-for her.

A PP mentioned Five Levels of Gifted so I looked into it and found an article written by Dr. Ruf on the levels. I don't recall everything DD was doing at certain ages but have a good idea. I know from the levels in the article she is at minimum level 2 and DS1 exhibits all characteristics of level 3 so far. That helped me feel as though I am on the right path.



I'm fairly certain this is what has happened. We never blinked an eye at DD's abilities as a toddler or the fact that she read us a book for the first time at 5 (prior to school). We knew we didn't teach her but I just figured it's what kids do. You read, sing and interact with them and they pick things up as they get older. It wasn't until she went to K and I found out most children don't know how to read, all their ABC's, basic math, etc. With DS1 I'm more aware his abilities are not typical but as an infant I thought he was just really high needs and demanding. I've been researching GT for about 9m and it's all fairly new.

I will say that out of all friends and families children we have encountered since becoming parents this forum is the first time that I feel DD is "normal" and not "something is wrong" feeling. She can identify with many of what I read here.

I feel this is probably our issue and why I'm not so confident. DD is definitely asynchronous. There is not a doubt in my mind about that. I have questioned many things that relate to asynchronous without answers from those such as Peds. I would hear it wasn't typical but she'll outgrow her intensities etc. DD is also not the idea I have in my head of the precocious stereotype as you mentioned. Thus leading to me questioning if I'm seeing this all correctly.

The moment when things 'came into focus' for me was at a soccer game DD was playing in our township. It was at the start of 2nd grade and parents there were still moaning about a Maths test that had been given early in 1st that DD had aced complaining about how hard it had been. I realized there and then that this was not the place to mention that at that age DD had out of the blue announced at dinner table:-

"Hey, did you know that 3 squared plus 4 squared equals 5 squared?
Funny how numbers work out like that sometimes!"

LOL

We didn't know- DS is an only child. He did things early that made us think he was advanced or at least had an excellent memory (he could recognize the alphabet by around 18 mos.). We had some people comment on his language skills, but we facilitated some of that we a lot of conversation at home.

We considered "gifted" around 4 when he began to pick up on math concepts quickly was adding and subtracting large numbers in his head by pre-k. He didn't read at 3 (more like 5), but accelerated so fast that he now reads books at around the 4th or 5th grade level (he's in 1st).

I think that a WISC or other IQ test may provide good information about our kids, but even after we had him tested (he's HG), some days we wonder. Gifted kids don't "act gifted" all the time. Sometimes my kid (now six) sits around and makes up complex multiplication games. Just as often, he screams and throws a tantrum because I tell him he can't watch another episode of Ninja Turtles.

Also, (sorry for the disjointed post), my DS likes to go "fast" and will make some careless errors or misread instructions on schoolwork. It confuses the issue- because he's far beyond the "work" but he makes mistakes.

Thanks for all the comments so far. I feel like I have a better perspective on it and should trust myself more. I am probably over thinking it all.