Hi everyone.

I posted not so long ago about the trouble I was having with my five year old ds. Well things have really gone down hill from there. We are now on the summer holidays and I am finding it impossible to keep him entertained.

Well today in the car we had the following conversation.

ds, "Is zero a friend or not a friend?

Me, " I don't know what you mean?"

ds, "Well, Eleven isn't a friend, neither are one, three, five seven, nine or thirteen. Two, four, six, ten and twelve are friends. So are minus two, minus four, minus six and so on. So if minus one, three, five and them aren't friends then what is zero?"

Me, "How did you work that one out?"

Ds, "I just see them and know it. If there are two, four or six then that is like two friends and they can share, but if there are one, three or five then that is one spare and they can't share. So is two a friend or not?"

Me, " I have no idea."

What I think he is talking about is odd and even numbers. Is this possible for him to work out by himself? About six months ago he worked out minus numbers. How odd is this or is it normal for a not quite five year old?

I may be way off track, but it did freak me out a bit.

Oh, and does anyone know if zero is a friend(even) or is it not a friend(odd)?

Zero is considered even. Here is a link that will help explain why.

http://mathforum.org/library/drmath/view/57104.html

That is a great question, BTW!!!

LOL! This sounds like a conversation I would have had with my son when he was 5.

I think he's picked out prime numbers! Smart kid!

Sorry for the briefness of my reply, but I'm being bumped off of my own computer by DS8 who wants to play Lego Star Wars. May the (lego) Force be with you.

It's very, very advanced for a five year old, especially if he figured it out for himself.

He's probably going to be ready for multiplication soon (he's essentially thinking about how division of 2 works). That might be something where a little bit of guidance would really help him out.

Good luck. You've got a smart one there.

JB

Yep even and odd numbers and what a cool way to think of it! All on his own! Triple WOW!

I have a great book for him "The Cat in Numberland."

I don't recall when my boys figured out odd or even or if they figured it out on their own or was taught. They both were adding and subtracting negative numbers at 4-5yrs old. The older one figured it by studying a thermometer and noticing numbers less than zero. the younger one....I think he heard his brother and figured it out for himself. I don't know how common it is.

wowzie I remember that feeling of "oh my gosh did he really just do that?." Yep, that's pretty special and I really love his descriptions.

Our "familiar" ds is now 8 and has continued his math exploration pretty much on his own.

There are some great resources out there- a fun book is "Can You Count to a Google?"

take a deep breath, go with the "flow" and enjoy!

A thread that you might find helpful for a while ago. There are a lot of good math resources out there.

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JB

Two is the loneliest number!!!

We have had very similar conversations over the past year with my DS5. He loves to talk about numbers and relationships that he finds with various numbers and patterns. Sometimes he makes my head spin.

How neat the he figured it out by himself. I remember way back when DS5 then 3 had a nasty fall. To make sure he was ok, we asked him questions like "Is 24 odd or even?".

Signs your child is GT...LOL!

When our DS starts throwing a fit I ask him to count backwards from 12 ... by 3s...

Ah the little rascals...

JB

Yes, I think we had similar discussions with our DS when he was that age. He was also fascinated by negative numbers and infinity, which sounds like a common theme on this board.

I have a very vivid remember having a conversation with my mother-in-law when DS was four, and she was adamant that kids could not understand abstract concepts until the age of 8 or 9. She had studied this in some childhood psychology class in college. I kept pointing out examples of very abstract concepts that DS understood: negative number, infinity, even the concept of zero, which the Romans never grasped (there is no Roman numeral for zero). She would not except it.

JB: DS8 had to go through allergy testing about a year ago... 72 shots in both arms. Needless to say he was not particularly happy, even with a large amount of numbing cream on each arm. It was the sight of the needle that bothered him, not the actual injection. DH kept him occupied by making him count all the prime numbers as high as he could go. That was a life-saver for getting through that ordeal. Math is a great way to distract or calm a kid down!

Dazey: I had heard of the book, The Cat in Numberland, through this message board. It is a great suggestion. DS just read in and liked it a lot. Are there any other books by this author? Or other math books that people can suggest?

I have a difficult time knowing what "level" means - so this might not be right on, but we have recently discovered the author Marilyn Burns who has written numerous books for kids about math.

Two we have been enjoying are "Math for Smarty Pants" and "I Hate Mathematics" both are somewhat cartoon like and follow a group of kids while they do number games and riddles and puzzles. Very accessible books, and fun, too.

That's so cool! i love conversations like that. What a great little thinker you have. Of course, i would have said "why can't we all just get along - of course 0 is a friend."

dazey - we just got The Cat in Numberland from the library based on your suggestion too. DS4 loved it. We also got G is for Googol, but haven't started that yet, since DS thinks all books must be read through in one sitting, and a glance at this one tells me it is not your average alphabet book.

Thanks all,

He too is obsessed by infinity. It took him lots of experiments to "see" infinity. One day, about six months ago I was upstairs and heard a crash. Downstairs ds is on the sofa with a mirror in his hand shining it into the mirror on the wall behind a sofa. "look mummy. That's infinity."

He is very much a "flash of brilliance child. Now and then.

We have tantrums at roundabouts when I turn off as he is counting things. He also seems to be grasping multiplication all by himself. I let him lead and I follow.

Cool. That's very impressive that he could figure it out just like that!