So I am trying to figure out how to bring this up appropriately without being perceived as bragging or whatever. There are 4 other rising 6th graders in our small neighborhood. I want to tell them now (dd is out of town for a week) so if there is discussion about it they can get that out of the way before she gets back, and so that questions can be asked and answered if they have any and she won't be in an awkward situation. It would be wierd to *not* say anything and just have her suddenly be in 7th when school starts.
I thought I could say, truthfully, that because she is old for grade and had been working 1 yr. ahead since she started at Montessori, that we could have had her declared a 6th grader and start at the middle school when we moved, but that seemed too much of a change, and the school agreed that she would do well with a skip in the fall. Please pass the bean dip.
That sounds reasonable, right? Hoping it is fine. There seems to be tons of red-shirting of the "we don't push our kids" variety. There are also though some clearly gifted moms and kids (the one I like the most is in some deep gifted denial).
Thanks!
I think less is more. Just tell them that you and her father, her teacher, her principal and she decided that this would be for the best.
You aren't responsible for their feelings about it and you don't have to answer questions that are inappropriate. Let them know that your dd still wants to be friends with their children. Be confident in what you've chosen for your family! You've clearly thought it through and are taking the best course of action you know! There is power in that confidence!
We didn't have kids so near in the neighborhood, so we didn't tell many people except the friends who know him best and were not surprised. we just waited for questions after school started and said that the principal and the teachers thought it was more appropriate. But our DS was younger--skipping 1st. I would say in your case keeping it simple would be good. E.g., "just wanted to let you know that the school thought that 7th would be a better fit for DD. I'm glad that she has such good friends nearby in the neigborhood so it will be easy to stay friends after school."
I can't offer much sage advice because I really wimped out on telling people. It sounds like you are in a bit of a different situation, though, or at least I hope that you are. We had concerns with competitiveness, jealousy, and I guess some of the same worries about sounding like braggarts.
I wound up not telling virtually anyone and waiting for it to be found out via the grapevine, which is what it sounds like you are trying to avoid probably rightly so. The only people I had to tell were family members who were less than supportive as well and I was almost apologetic in telling them.
The only thing I can say that we did that probably made it sound less "braggy," when we started getting questions from others when it came out via grapevine was to say that we were approached by the school who felt that placing her in the next grade up would be a better fit. That was honest and it also seemed to go over better than suggesting that we felt that she was so advanced that she needed to be skipped. I tried to be short, simple, and not expand unless pressed.
I did get some questions about how we got her skipped, what types of information they needed, etc. and I probably didn't handle those as well.
I think less is more. Just tell them that you and her father, her teacher, her principal and she decided that this would be for the best.
You aren't responsible for their feelings about it and you don't have to answer questions that are inappropriate. Let them know that your dd still wants to be friends with their children. Be confident in what you've chosen for your family! You've clearly thought it through and are taking the best course of action you know! There is power in that confidence!
Thanks for the encouragement, this is always good advice!
We didn't have kids so near in the neighborhood, so we didn't tell many people except the friends who know him best and were not surprised. we just waited for questions after school started and said that the principal and the teachers thought it was more appropriate. But our DS was younger--skipping 1st. I would say in your case keeping it simple would be good. E.g., "just wanted to let you know that the school thought that 7th would be a better fit for DD. I'm glad that she has such good friends nearby in the neigborhood so it will be easy to stay friends after school."
I think this is the right approach. We did just move here in March, so she is not close with the other 6th grade girls in the neighborhood. (the girls at school she hit it off with are going to the other middle school) They don't seem to have much in common and I have seen them walk right by my daughter and not say hello. (I don't think they are deliberately being mean--just kind of happy with their own group and have not learned or been taught how to include someone new) This is just another reason I am happy for the skip! It makes it less wierd that she isn't really friends with them if she is in 7th.
If you are skipping OUT of the class, I see no reason for you to say anything. Just tell the kids whose class she is skipping into. No need to involve parents--no good way to tell them and their kids will do that for you. My dd told the friends she was leaving--that way, she got to control the message going out.
If your dd knows the rising 6th graders, SHE should tell them. She's old enough to want to control the message, and let her say explain it however she wants to.
In my experience, telling one key player is all that's needed. It's such a big deal to kids that they will enjoy spreading the "secret". So you want to be sure the message is started with a reasonable person saying reasonable things (your dd to a trusted friend)
If there's an active parent group, you want to tell some adult that will get the word out to any curious minds in a way that satisfies them too. We messed up that one and got a phone call asking for volunteers. I realized afterward that this person volunteered to call in order to pepper me with questions. But, fortunately, it was a lady who likes to talk and it got turned around to me congratulating her on her fine choice in holding back her dd because yes, she is in the GT program and very popular.
I am not sure if there are any 7th grade girls in the neighborhood. I did tell one mom who has a 7th grade boy who sounds like a male version of my daughter (lol!) But she does not strike me AT ALL as someone who likes to gossip so I doubt she will say anything to anyone--but maybe her son will.
As far as her telling the girls--they have really recently been the opposite of friendly. Dd can be shy but I know she has tried and they are just not that receptive. And they seem to be very much into the popular culture and clothes and boys and dd just isn't, which motivates her even less to really extend herself. (I think when school starts she will find people she has stuff in common with in orchestra and theatre) So honestly it would be wierd for her walk up and share this. But there is swim team practice every day, a neighborhood adult social coming up and the parents are always standing around talking--I am sure people will talk about middle school and I want to be proactive and not act like it is something to hide.
Too funny about the lady with the popular kid.
I can't offer much sage advice because I really wimped out on telling people. It sounds like you are in a bit of a different situation, though, or at least I hope that you are. We had concerns with competitiveness, jealousy, and I guess some of the same worries about sounding like braggarts.
I wound up not telling virtually anyone and waiting for it to be found out via the grapevine, which is what it sounds like you are trying to avoid probably rightly so. The only people I had to tell were family members who were less than supportive as well and I was almost apologetic in telling them.
The only thing I can say that we did that probably made it sound less "braggy," when we started getting questions from others when it came out via grapevine was to say that we were approached by the school who felt that placing her in the next grade up would be a better fit. That was honest and it also seemed to go over better than suggesting that we felt that she was so advanced that she needed to be skipped. I tried to be short, simple, and not expand unless pressed.
I did get some questions about how we got her skipped, what types of information they needed, etc. and I probably didn't handle those as well.
Re: family--I was actually shocked but my mother was very supportive. I waited forever to tell her because I thought she wouldn't be, it was a nice surprise. I think the bolded is how I will approach it. Thanks!
Our son is about to skip first grade, and we are trying to figure out how to handle it, especially dealing with his best buddy's family. I think ultimately, it is going to improve their friendship, but the initial adjustment is going to be hard.
Our school is an interesting one, and the group of PTO parents is very small and cliquey. This is going to throw them all for a loop...
Our son is about to skip first grade, and we are trying to figure out how to handle it, especially dealing with his best buddy's family. I think ultimately, it is going to improve their friendship, but the initial adjustment is going to be hard.
I'd be prepared for it not to improve their friendship-- how would that work? It will add some stumbling blocks. Over time, it's more likely than not that the friendship will naturally fall away due to the differing social groups (at least unless you live close by in the same neighborhood), but it's not the end of the world.
Our son is about to skip first grade, and we are trying to figure out how to handle it, especially dealing with his best buddy's family. I think ultimately, it is going to improve their friendship, but the initial adjustment is going to be hard.
Our school is an interesting one, and the group of PTO parents is very small and cliquey. This is going to throw them all for a loop...
When our DS skipped first, we were able to keep his friendship with best buddy alive by signing the kids up for summer programs together and scouts, and playdatesaskd sleepovers. DS has friends from his new school, too, but still loves to do stuff with his best bud before the skip/school change .
Eta: can't type on iPhone!
Incidentally, mom was the one who broke off the friendship, cancelled playdates and didn't return phone calls. A year or so later she apologized and said she couldn't handle the knowledge that her dd could have been as advanced as my dd if she had done things differently. She felt she had failed her daughter.
It probably wouldn't have helped to sweetly suggest that she couldn't have closed the gap even if she'd tried.
I'd be prepared for it not to improve their friendship-- how would that work? It will add some stumbling blocks. Over time, it's more likely than not that the friendship will naturally fall away due to the differing social groups (at least unless you live close by in the same neighborhood), but it's not the end of the world.
We do live fairly nearby (about 4 blocks away) and they have a ton in common. What is apparently happening now is that they are becoming more aware of their different academic skills and our son is pretending not to know things and his friend is refusing to try things when they are working together (which happens a lot within the kindergarten setting since his buddy is cognitively similar but hasn't found his stride with reading yet--math is another story, our son's math scores are above the 99.9th percentile).
So, I am hoping that if they can have shared experiences (after school program, summer camp, weekend activities) that don't focus on academics, and get their academics separately, things will improve between them instead of it being the kind of push/pull they have now.
I hope so too. I'm just thinking that their divergent social spheres at school will pull them apart over time. If so, there's really nothing wrong with it, and in the meantime they can still have fun sharing some time together.
I wouldn't say anything, myself, as they will certainly notice it for themselves sooner or later. But DS's neighborhood friends are all up and down the grades, so it didn't really make any difference when he skipped K, and he hasn't skipped anything since. We may have a skip after next year, or the year after, but everybody knows him and wouldn't be surprised. He has three neighbor friends a year younger than he is, who are one and two years behind him in school due to cutoff dates, and one a year older who is in his grade.
When they notice the skip, and ask questions, that's when you can do the "oh, yes, we and the school felt it was best, please pass the mustard" thing.
I wouldn't say anything, myself, as they will certainly notice it for themselves sooner or later. But DS's neighborhood friends are all up and down the grades, so it didn't really make any difference when he skipped K, and he hasn't skipped anything since. We may have a skip after next year, or the year after, but everybody knows him and wouldn't be surprised. He has three neighbor friends a year younger than he is, who are one and two years behind him in school due to cutoff dates, and one a year older who is in his grade.
When they notice the skip, and ask questions, that's when you can do the "oh, yes, we and the school felt it was best, please pass the mustard" thing.
Well, I can't not say anything. It comes up in the first 2 minutes of any conversation.
"So, you're new in the neighborhood! How old are your kids? Oh, so she'll be in 6th grade at xx Middle in the fall? Oh, 7th? So how did she like it for the end of 6th? Oh, she was at xx Elementary this spring? How does that work?"
or
"So, dd will be starting middle school in the fall! Is she excited about 6th grade?"
I just don't want dd to be in the position of having to address it first herself. She is very capable, and it would be different if we were doing it in the town where she already knew everyone, but this is all new for her.
FWIW, it came up with a neighbor today who was totally supportive and who knows dd from the bus stop. She said how mature she is and that she can totally see that it is the right choice for her.
Part of the reason I want to handle this well isn't just for dd11, but for dd5 who will be entering k with a bunch of kids from this neighborhood and I am sure in that situation competitiveness/jealousy/judgment is a strong possibility depending on what dd5's needs are (which are more unique/less straightforward than dd11 prob. also a candidate for a skip or more in the future).
Well, I can't not say anything. It comes up in the first 2 minutes of any conversation.
"So, you're new in the neighborhood! How old are your kids? Oh, so she'll be in 6th grade at xx Middle in the fall? Oh, 7th? So how did she like it for the end of 6th? Oh, she was at xx Elementary this spring? How does that work?"
or
"So, dd will be starting middle school in the fall! Is she excited about 6th grade?"
Ahh, in that case, my planned fallback if we do this exact skip next year (although everybody knows DS and wouldn't be surprised) is the absolutely true, "Middle school is total hell and we'd like to skip as much of it as possible."
I had a horrendous time in (it was then) junior high, and I'm quite sure it hasn't improved since. My sincere wish is that DS could just skip to high school after fifth grade, though I don't see it happening. He could, if he set his mind to it, but he's too lazy to put that much work into enough subjects to do that.
Well, I can't not say anything. It comes up in the first 2 minutes of any conversation.
"So, you're new in the neighborhood! How old are your kids? Oh, so she'll be in 6th grade at xx Middle in the fall? Oh, 7th? So how did she like it for the end of 6th? Oh, she was at xx Elementary this spring? How does that work?"
or
"So, dd will be starting middle school in the fall! Is she excited about 6th grade?"
Ahh, in that case, my planned fallback if we do this exact skip next year (although everybody knows DS and wouldn't be surprised) is the absolutely true,
"Middle school is total hell and we'd like to skip as much of it as possible." I had a horrendous time in (it was then) junior high, and I'm quite sure it hasn't improved since. My sincere wish is that DS could just skip to high school after fifth grade, though I don't see it happening. He could, if he set his mind to it, but he's too lazy to put that much work into enough subjects to do that.
Haha! Too funny--I will have to try that one!
Heck, if you're totally new, you can just correct them and say the school put her in 7th. And since the girls are not good friends, it's fine if they aren't up on the latest. It will open their minds to the idea that they don't know everything.
This, or when they ask how old she is, reply, "She's going into seventh grade." Kind of like how people respond to "How far away is TownA from TownB?" with, "Three and a half hours." Not exactly answering the question that was asked, but giving pertinent information nevertheless.
I don't have much insight, as my kids are nowhere near this age yet, but catty neighborhood politics can be pretty ridiculous.
This, or when they ask how old she is, reply, "She's going into seventh grade."
My dd 13 does this all the time when asked her age. She just responds with her grade. I'm not totally on board with it b/c it seems like sidestepping the question, which I guess it really is, but no one has of yet followed up to ask for her actual age. It helps that she is wearing make-up, has gotten really tall (at least for our family), and generally is assumed to be a lot older than she is anyway. So, when people hear "I'm going into 10th grade," for instance, they seem to hear "I'm 15," or "I'm 16."
I thought I could say, truthfully, that because she is old for grade and had been working 1 yr. ahead since she started at Montessori, that we could have had her declared a 6th grader and start at the middle school when we moved, but that seemed too much of a change, and the school agreed that she would do well with a skip in the fall. Please pass the bean dip.
That sounds reasonable, right? Hoping it is fine.
yeah. I like that. You can emphasize the "cut-off birthday kids and how hard it is to figure out what grade to put them in, and then with the move, and the change from Montessori... as long as you mention it was the school's idea, seems to me you're good to go. I know some posters like to keep it simple, but I also see some point in explaining too much. I think other parents start to think that in your shoes they wouldn't have known what grade to put their kid into either..
(not that you didn't, but just a little muddy water doing its trick)
I am faced with this same issue. Last year we subject accelerated our DS8 in Math and I chose not to say anything to the parents of my sons friends. One of his friends (one of his best friends) moms is a pretty good friend. However she is really competitve and I didn't want to bring it up. So I didn't. It ended up coming up in the teacher work room when his math teacher came in and we started talking about him. It was the first week of school. It was very akward and then had to say something. Just very uncomfortable and has been the entire year. So this year he is being grade accelerated and once again I am struggling with what to do. As soon as the mom asks me what teacher he has it is going to come up and again by akward. I want to bring it up so it isn't as weird but just not sure how to do it. Any ideas?
Wow!! I guess I have a long road ahead of me because my gifted child is only 2 1/2 and moms are already acting really cold when they see that he is more advanced than their children in some ways.
This is so sad that people can't just be happy for each other and that they are constantly competing with their children. These are the same moms that openly brag about everything their kids do too and we have to be quiet just because of the gifted issue. I can see not going around bragging but I think you should be able to be honest.
If someone asks a question and is disturbed by an honest answer, it is their fault for asking the question, not yours for answering it.
So this year he is being grade accelerated and once again I am struggling with what to do. As soon as the mom asks me what teacher he has it is going to come up and again by akward. I want to bring it up so it isn't as weird but just not sure how to do it. Any ideas?
So, he's skipping a full grade not just subject accelerating again, right? I don't know that you did anything wrong with the last occurrence in that I don't see any reason why subject acceleration needs to be mentioned to other parents. My dd11 is taking Algebra I next year, as are a number of other kids in her grade, but I'm sure that there are friends of mine, family members, parents of kids with whom she attends school, etc. who still do not know that she is subject accelerating in math even though she did last year as well. I'd agree, though, that grade skips tend to be so obvious that you won't be able to keep in under wraps and you probably should let friends who will find out anyway know.
Like I said earlier up in the thread, I don't think that my trying to avoid telling people when dd13 skipped 5th worked out too well and I'd probably do it differently now even with people who are insecure and likely to get defensive or hurt. I'd probably take one of two approaches:
1) approach the mom and tell her that you realize that last year you didn't handle it well when you didn't tell her that your ds was subject accelerating in math so you wanted to be the first to tell her this time that he will be in a different grade in the fall than expected. I'd stress here that the school approached you (if that is true), that there was an evaluation process that looked at a lot beyond ability and achievement (in case it sounds like you saying that your kid is more able or a higher achiever), and that you hope that he is able to find friends in his new class and very much value the support of the friends he holds close now.
or
2) I'd wait for her to ask about his teacher for next year and then go into essentially the same spiel.
We have not grade-skipped, but we moved DD to a gifted magnet, and dealt with some fall-out. On reflection, I wish I had been more confident with my little "speech" when I explained my choice (even though I was not that confident). I think people saw my feelings of hesitation as the a-ok to attack. So...be firm and cheerful and suggest with your tone that you brook no opposition...even if you do have doubts.
Thanks everyone and keep the ideas coming! So worried about this. Really with just the one mom. I like the suggestion of making sure we are confident, thanks!
Good idea on telling the mom I didn't like how I brought it up last year so this year trying to loop her in earlier...
I can't say the school suggested it because they didnt. Our principle would never suggest it so we have had to fight for everything that we have gotten for our DS8. So unfortunately I can't say that. Plus this mom is the PTO president so she will know it wasn't the school.
Its just a hard sitatuion because I don't want to upset her to much as her son and mine are really good friends and it will hurt the outside school relationship as she will not be as open to it...
You can probably tell there is a lot more to the story then she is a friend. She used to be a really close friend and as I got to know her couldn't handle the competitive stuff so have tried to give space but keep something there so the boys are still able to hang out. Because a true friend I wouldn't stress this much about telling! UGH!
In our district, accelerations and skips are handled in the same way: only at the parent's request, and based purely on testing. It makes it really hard to not look like a pushy parent with a higher-achieving kid.
When DD skipped 2nd, I had a long discussion with her first grade teacher before we decided to attempt the skip, and one thing her teacher said was that there were several kids in DD's class who were ahead enough to skip. So I played up that idea when I was talking to other parents. The kids came up with it all on their own - "I could have done that if I'd wanted to" was the most-common reaction DD got, even from kids who give no sign of being high achieving.
Particularly in K and 1st, there's enough spread in achievement that my kid did not stand out as unusual. (Her first grade teacher said the reading abilities of kids in her class spanned 9 grade levels, and my DD was not the best-testing reader.) As the kids get older, though, she stands out more. If she does a subject acceleration for the coming year (as a 5th grader taking one or more 6th grade classes), I don't know that there'd be any "I could have done that if I'd wanted." OTOH, I don't know that any of the kids would be the least bit surprised that DD was doing it.
Also...unfortunately...be prepared for it to come up if there are ever any issues with your child farther down the road. DD has recently been dxed with anxiety and depression and I was dismayed that my friends' reaction was almost uniformly, "Do you think it's all the PRESSURE at the GIFTED MAGNET?" (Answer: No. Not at all. DD breezed through the year with straight As every quarter, though homework was a bit of an issue. And since you've known my super-intense DD since she was a baby, how on earth could you think this? Sigh.)
Yeah I am expecting that to be the reason for everything go forward which is just ridiculous! Every child growing up comes across different issues but I am sure it will always be because we grade accelerated him. I have an older child and we have issues and changes in him all the time. Thats what happens as kids grow up! We would have that if we grade accelerated or not!!
so thanks for all of the feedback again, and good luck to those facing this issue!
I have to say--it went just fine. I guess I sort of, ummm...stretched the truth a little by saying the school suggested it...but the school was extremely supportive of it. The reception has generally been just fine--(or at least they are good actors). I think the kids weren't surprised either, (even though I think it is a very rare thing here). One woman who subs in the middle school was sort of open-mouthed incredulous (how on earth could a kid need more challenge than what is offered, are you crazy sort of look) but other than that it has been fine. It was a different dynamic though since we are new so less competitive. I predict it will be a different experience with dd5 starting kindy. (who I think could prob. benefit from a skip but she is more complicated)
Dd has finally made a great friend in our neighborhood--sadly she is only going into 5th. (dd wishes she could skip into 7th--and this is a kid who probably could easily skip. dd finally has someone to talk about books with--just funny that she is younger!) This girl also has an older brother who will be in 7th like dd--the mom has been very nice and supportive. Brother will be in the advanced content classes with dd and seems like a nice kid.
soooo...that is our update.
My son skipped mid year from 1st to 2nd and is now going into 5th. He is taller than most of the kids in 5th so we don't get many questions now, but they do still come up occasionally. I prefer the blame and dodge method. It goes like this "Oh my husband met with some people and it just all came out that way. Can you pass those delicious cookies?" Despite the fact that my husband was only in the meetings to be the "suit" and really just nods and agrees with me :-)
We have gotten the blame of anything he ever does wrong is because of the skip. Again blame and dodge "The doctor/principal/teacher/psychologist/grandparent/other adult says it's totally unrelated. Can you pass those delicious cookies?"
My son skipped mid year from 1st to 2nd and is now going into 5th. He is taller than most of the kids in 5th so we don't get many questions now, but they do still come up occasionally. I prefer the blame and dodge method. It goes like this "Oh my husband met with some people and it just all came out that way. Can you pass those delicious cookies?"
When I have been asked why my eldest child is a year young for his grade, I say we put him in a private KG at age 4, because he was reading fluently and we thought he was ready for KG. This is a true, non-defensive statement, unlike many of the things I have read on this thread. Society needs to be more realistic about differences in intelligence and their implications, and clarity rather than obfuscation by the parents of gifted children can spread such realism.
I don't know that most or any of us are attempting to be dishonest or defensive. I think that we wind up straddling that line, though, when we recognize that we will be met with hostility. Whether it is the right thing to do, maybe not, but unless one has a tough skin or feels okay with other parents being hurt, it can be very, very hard.
Like a pp mentioned, one of the people I really tried to avoid telling was a mom who I believe is insecure. There were years of comparisions btwn our kids to the point that it damaged not only my relationship with the other parent, but the kids' relationship such that they really aren't friends anymore. Dd got really tired of being quizzed on what she could do and being told, falsely, that the other child was one upping her on everything when she responded honestly. Honesty hurt this other parent's feelings.
I thought about it a lot and really don't think that there was malintent. I also came to the general conclusion that I was being unkind by being totally upfront about my dd. I also had to realize over time that I could not allow my other dd, who is a less obvious HG kid on the surface, to be thrown under the bus, which is what happened after it became more and more clear that my other one could not be 'kept up' with. I've been a bit more upfront about my less traditional high achiever's abilities b/c I don't want her to be the consolation prize a la 'at least my kids are smarter than her other child.'
My point is that, while my children's self image comes first, I try not to be blatently honest when I don't need to be if I am aware that it is going to damage someone's already fragile self image or set off another round of parental competition.
Society needs to be more realistic about differences in intelligence and their implications, and clarity rather than obfuscation by the parents of gifted children can spread such realism.
I don't go around telling other parents how beautiful my kid is, either. The goal of social chit-chat is not to enlighten other people to your received truth, regardless of how true it may be.
The uncomfortable and awkward discussions, IME, come up as social chit-chat. I've had some parents take me aside privately and ask for details for reasons related to finding the least-worst placement for their own kids, and I don't find those conversations to be difficult at all. A whole 'nother conversation than, "So, which teacher did your kid have in 2nd grade?" "Um, she didn't have a second grade teacher."
When I have been asked why my eldest child is a year young for his grade, I say we put him in a private KG at age 4, because he was reading fluently and we thought he was ready for KG. This is a true, non-defensive statement, unlike many of the things I have read on this thread. Society needs to be more realistic about differences in intelligence and their implications, and clarity rather than obfuscation by the parents of gifted children can spread such realism.
I agree with what you are saying, but in the era of Tiger Mom it doesn't always work out that way. I certainly had non-defensive conversations with people that asked earnestly and kindly. But those that approach on the playground/park/PTA meeting with a snotty "So, I heard you got (DS) moved up to 2nd because the 1st grade teacher is too boring" or "Janie reads far better than (DS) so why did you think he should get to move up if she didn't?" (real statements, both) it's hard to remain calm and carry on. People who want to understand my DS, or who care about the system or need info for their own child are those I'm more than open with.
But the super cheery-yet-vicious questions are not worth my time.