Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Twice Exceptional 504 review

I didn't realize until this thread that one could have a entitlement to gifted and talented services. I think that's the disconnect. I will follow up, as this is useful and helpful to know. I still think one might encounter a problem if, say, one's child could complete above level work but more slowly, but age appropriate level work at the same speed as age peers. I think it obviously makes sense to define one's level based on ability, but I think it often doesn't work that way. Nor do I think that it would always be an easy sell that a disabled kid who could do age normal work without services / accommodations had an entitlement to continued acceleration where services would be necessary, and that seems a logical place to go for a stubborn admin, hence a danger. But what do I know? Thanks for a good thread, and good luck to the OP. (From my phone)

To clarify: the entitlement is not to gifted and talented services as such, unless your particular state has such an entitlement on their books - IDEA and 504 are pretty much silent on the topic of giftedness. The 504 and ADA entitlement is an entitlement to the same access to educational programs that would be offered to similar students who did not have disabilities (so, for example, a dyslexic student can not be barred from a gifted program that would be offered to non-dyslexic students with the same ability levels, and the school would have to provide reasonable accommodations to allow the dyslexic student to participate) and the IDEA entitlement is to a FAPE (free and appropriate public education) for students with disabilities which affect their educational performance. A FAPE is defined as one that the student can derive educational benefit from, so there is an argument to be made that acceleration is necessary part of a FAPE for a student with a disability that affects educational performance who has mastered all grade-level content.

Great idea DeeDee. If the evaluator is not a good advocate, I would consider bringing a parent advocate (which is often much less expensive) to the meeting. A good advocate can understands the testing, law, group dynamics and politics and can be a great resource at these meetings. Often her or she can help level the playing field a bit.

I'm not sure if you realize, but there have been some favorable changes in 504 as it relates to qualifying for accommodations. This article may be helpful (it was for me!)http://www.ncld.org/on-capitol-hill/federal-laws-aamp-ld/adaaa-a-section-504/section-504-in-2009

aculady, yep, that's my understanding-- an argument could be made, and I'm sure it's one that we would all agree with. I'm just not sure it would always win. It would be along the same lines as the arguments we make that our children are due an education that helps them learn, like all children should have, but the no-child-left-behind-or-forward focus and thinking can be hard to overcome. I remain unconvinced that gifted disabled kids are entitled to any better education than gifted non-disabled kids. But again, I am shooting a bit from the hip here (despite being a good guesser), and I've put this on my list of things to dig into when I get some time.

Luckily the OP seems to be on firm ground due to the continued need for extra time at least on the standardized testing for her grade, although I think things might get a bit shaky against strong resistance if she pushes the "appropriate level for a child of her intellectual abilities" at the same time as she demands extra time for reading. A lot of third graders would read "The Hobbit" slowly (is what a benighted administrator or teacher might say, though we believe that's not the proper measure).

Be sure to check Wrightslaw for a few tips on dealing with this kind of thinking (related to 2E and qualification for IEP/504).

The single best example of how this works under the law is Lillie/Felton, an OSEP policy letter:

Illinois Due Process decisions


There is another 2007 reference to the same issue in that link.


In my own experience, the surest way to get what your child needs and to not get steamrolled or pushed aside by administrators and teachers (even well-meaning ones) is to know your child's rights under the law.

One of the hardest things that I had to learn to deal with was that people seemed to think I was lying about my son's disabilities (dyspraxia, dysgraphia, hypotonia, sensory issues) because he could achieve at a higher level academically than the average kid his age without disabilities, could write well enough on a short writing test at age 7 that I was told his writing was low normal (they didn't test long enough for the disability to show up), they had never heard of hypotonia and he looked normal, therefore he could not have it, he could not have sensory issues because he didn't have any behavioral issues, although they were more than willing to accept that he might have Asperger's, something he has never been diagnosed with because he read at such an early age, could memorize faster than most people, and always talked more like an adult.

My son's disabilities are not consistent. We homeschool around this inconsistency, as well as the pain from migraines and fatigue and endurance issues. I can tell when he is having an off day either from headaches or fatigue or whatever because he will still at age 12 occasionally write a number backwards. I see him do something like this maybe once every three or four months. It is a glitch that I am sure would cause embarrassment if he were in our public school. He will tell you that it isn't because he doesn't know how to write the number, it is just a glitch that happens and we still don't know how to explain this. When he does math, he feels that for him, it only makes sense to write as little as possible and do as much of the problem mentally as he can because of the dysgraphia. It makes sense to me. It also makes sense to me to take a break on days when his pain or something else is causing enough distraction that he isn't learning as well as he should. He more than makes up for it on days when he is doing well and his self esteem is left intact, along with the knowledge that he really is a smart kid with disabilities that he can compensate for.

When he was tested by a neuropsychologist at age 11 with a migraine and fatigue, his disabilities showed up and the neuropsychologist said if he went back to public school he would need an IEP for his writing issues and maybe he would if he were in a class taught by a strict color in the lines teacher, but luckily his writing teacher believes that what is important is the final typed product so bad handwriting is not really a problem.

My son's dysgraphia also causes trouble with writing out math problems quickly. When he is allowed to use mental math and not forced to show his work he does very well in math. He has had no problems with algebra or word problems as long as I let him do it his way. His mental math ability is so much better than mine because of his writing disability.

This year at age 12 he took his first class requiring a lot of writing and he didn't even tell his teacher about the dysgraphia. He is writing well enough (by typing his assignments) that he is making A's on everything and he one of the youngest kids in the class of 7th - 9th graders. He had no IEP or 504, just an understanding teacher with common sense.

Maybe, in addition to testing kids for learning disabilities, they should test the teachers for their ability to incorporate common sense in their teaching methods.