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    #85089 09/15/10 07:49 AM
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    Lori H. Offline OP
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    I enrolled my 12-year-old 2E son with dysgraphia and dyspraxia in two homeschool co-op classes--ancient history and writing composition. He told me he wasn't happy about it and reminded me that all of my other attempts to help him meet other kids like him failed. He said he likes learning at home and having some control over what he learns. It is the first time he has been in a class with other kids (except for musical theater) since kindergarten. Since classes are only once a week I thought he could handle it.

    My son did not like the fact that the co-op classes required parent volunteers in each class and nobody had yet volunteered for this position, so I have to stay in the classes he is in. I agreed to stay in the back of the room.

    His first class was ancient history for 4th through 8th graders. It was the only class available before lunch and I hoped he would meet other kids after that class in the lunch room. My son likes history so I thought it would be a good class for him. I could see I had made a mistake the minute the teacher brought out the coloring sheets for them to put in order according to the order of creation in the book of Genesis. He will be tested next week to see if he remembers the correct order of creation and he will have to turn in his finished book of coloring sheets. After the class someone asked him if he liked the class and he politely said it was okay, then told me he could not go into the lunchroom, which was very noisy, because he had a really bad headache and he had just discovered that he had ADD. He said he could not force himself to pay attention, he was daydreaming, he had difficulty following instructions and stopped coloring long before class time was up, and he couldn't remember what happened on some of the days of creation because he just couldn't focus on memorizing it, especially when the teacher started singing the songs she uses to help preschoolers remember the order. At that point he almost couldn't tolerate sitting in the class any longer. He looked at me and I mouthed the word sorry.

    We ate lunch in the car. I promised a trip to McDonald's if he went to the second class, writing composition, the one I worried about him having trouble in because of his dysgraphia.

    He was glad he stayed. The teacher was young and pretty and talked to the kids like they were young adults. She gave them tips on taking notes in class. She also gave them suggestions on how to come up with ideas for writing stories and how to use the free writing technique. She had them try this in class. I was surprised to see that he wouldn't use his iPad to type notes. He decided to write with pencil and paper like all the other kids. He was slower to write than all the other kids, but he did it. The teacher told him to take his time and finish writing while she talked. He wrote more in that hour than he writes at home in a week. He had to copy notes from the board and they were legible. His dad could read them. I only saw one misspelled word. He never misspells words when he types and he has won spelling bees. It is the same with punctuation. If he types, his punctuation is very good, if he writes by hand he either forgets or is so busy trying to write fast enough to keep up that he just can't do it all. But he knows this is okay for taking notes--the teacher even said so. Most of his writing assignments can be typed and turned in the next week. He is excited about this class and I am so happy we did this, even though he didn't meet any other kids that he would fit in with. His "ADD" was only temporary. He was very focused in the writing class.

    He told his grandfather about the classes the next day. Grandpa told him he should have listened to the teacher and colored all of the coloring pages.

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    I'm glad he's trying something new. I would encourage you to keep a positive attitude. 1 out of 2 is a great success rate. Maybe there would be another option if the history class is not a good fit. It is fantastic that he tried to use pencil and paper to do his writing. This is a helpful skill in life and it is good he's able to improve on it.

    My suggestion would be to try to give him more space. Especially since he's older and wants his independent experiences, it really takes away from that if you are in the classroom. Also, I think it could really amplify his anxiety because it gives you an opportunity to worry over every detail instead of just letting him work it out. It really shouldn't be your job at this point to worry whether he misspells a word or uses the wrong punctuation. He will be fine without you there. There should be many volunteer positions at the co-op. I would explain that your son is older and is working on being more independent and you don't want to be in his classroom. You could work in another classroom or do another job.

    One value of independent experiences like co-ops is that it can be easy at home to get in a rut where you don't expect certain things from your kid. Different approaches can give a kid the opportunity to surprise us - as he did with the amount of writing which is more than you thought he could do.

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    Lori H. Offline OP
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    He was able to switch to a state history class. They also do some coloring in that class, but he doesn't seem to mind coloring maps as much as long as it doesn't have to look perfect.

    He turned in his first typed assignment in the writing class and is working on his second. His punctuation and spelling are very good in all of his typed work. There was a lot more writing to be copied off the board in class this time and he couldn't get all of it copied before the class was over. I had to finish it as everyone else was leaving and I got writer's cramp. He doesn't want to tell the teacher or anyone else about the handwriting problem. During a grammar lesson in the class the teacher asked the students how they would make the name Biggs possessive. My son held up his hand and told her he would add an apostrophe--Biggs'--and she said that was wrong, that it should be Biggs's. He has seen it both ways since different style manuals give conflicting advice for words ending with an s. He didn't argue. He now knows it is wrong in her class and in her class he will do it the way she wants. This is a big change from kindergarten when this kind of thing would upset him. When he was in kindergarten, he didn't throw a fit or anything like that, he would just tell me about it after school and it seemed to bother him. I told him we would look it up on the internet later if he thought the teacher was wrong about something and that it wasn't a good idea to point it out to the teacher in front of other people because nobody likes that. He always remembered that. He didn't want to hurt anyone's feelings.

    Having homework deadlines and disabilities that cause pain and distraction are something he will have to learn to deal with in life. Hopefully he will have less pain if the scoliosis brace works and he learns to deal with the migraines.

    My son lives with more pain than most other kids right now. Although I cannot take away his pain, I will be there to support him as much as I can and my son now thinks I should stay in the class just in case he needs the straps on his brace loosened or occasional help with the notes or needs to take pain medication. I stay at the back of the class.

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    Lori, I had an OT idea.

    But perhaps his skill in typing is related to reading the printed word and he uses his pattern matching skills to compensate for his lack of tactile feedback?

    What if he read the written word?

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    Lori H. Offline OP
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    I watched him in class again last Monday. It looks to me like his biggest problem is the lower muscle strength/endurance that he deals with. It makes it impossible for him to keep up with the other kids. At the beginning of the class the teacher assigns a writing exercise, one paragraph minimum. She allows about ten minutes to finish before she starts going over grammar lessons with about two written pages of notes that he is supposed to copy off the board. He usually gets a couple of sentences of his writing assignment down before she starts grammar lessons and then has to try to finish his in-class writing assignment while he is also listening to the teacher. I watched him try to copy the grammar notes fast enough to get it down before she erased the board and then write a few words on his writing assignment and even with his multitasking ability his mild muscle weakness and his hand cramping slows him down. If he switches to his left hand to write for a few minutes, his writing is still legible but he loses even more speed.

    When I saw there was no way he could do all of the writing before the teacher erased the board, I got some paper from him and told him I would write the notes off the board while he finished his writing assignment that had to be turned in by the end of the class while the teacher finished the grammar lesson. It is a good thing that he is very good with grammar to begin with because I don't see how he could finish his writing and really get any of the grammar lesson.

    At the end of the class the teacher assigns another writing assignment to be done at home and turned in the next Monday. He can type it so there is no problem. If he is allowed to type he can produce A+ work and he feels really good about this. For the first time he is getting other opinions of his writing instead of just his parents. He says he likes writing and would like to write a book some day.


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    Originally Posted by Lori H.
    During a grammar lesson in the class the teacher asked the students how they would make the name Biggs possessive. My son held up his hand and told her he would add an apostrophe--Biggs'--and she said that was wrong, that it should be Biggs's.

    The teacher is correct. I used the same style as your son for many years but decided to make the switch after more indepth research on the topic. While the 's style is incorrect it is used so commonly that to many people it looks right, but many experts would prefer s's. This is a great example of the value of taking classes. It is a wonderful thing to be exposed to different ideas and different ways of doing things.

    Perhaps the experience of the class will improve your son's endurance or give him more motivation to work on his handwriting. When the main issue is endurance practice will lead to improvements. Ultimately I believe it would help him more to independence and self confidence if he could have the chance to take the class on his own. Giving him space would show him you have confidence in him and it would allow him to find ways to advocate for himself. It may be helpful to look to the future. If you hope he will be able to go to college without you at age 18, he needs to start taking the steps to get there. Being able to take a short homeschool class at the age of 12 is a step on that path.

    Last edited by passthepotatoes; 09/29/10 04:26 PM.
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    Lori H. Offline OP
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    This was what I found to support my son's use of the ' only:

    http://www.ncsu.edu/ncsu/grammar/Apostro3.html

    When he is college age he will no longer need help with his brace because he won't have to wear it any longer. His migraines, hopefully, will not be as severe and he will be allowed to keep his medication with him and take it when he needs it. Using electronic devices to take notes will be allowed so that won't be a problem either. He will not need any help from me.

    I am not sure how much his endurance can increase. I would think with the piano practice, typing, and writing that he already does there would be more improvement, but his endurance does not seem to improve at the rate that other people's endurance improves with the same amount of effort. There is a difference. With a lot of work he seems to improve only a little. It is the same with the muscles in the arches in his feet and legs. He gets a lot more exercise than I do with the musical theater dance practices. He also uses a weight machine at home. I am a lot older than he is and I don't have any pain or endurance issues. His dad is a retired army first sergeant who has more energy and endurance than anyone I have ever seen. My son's cousins are football players; one of them was good enough to get a college scholarship. Nobody else in our family has any problem with muscle weakness. My dad is very physically strong even at age 76. My son noticed this difference years ago and asked me if his problems were because of a genetic mutation. The neurologist recently mentioned this as a possibility. He also told us that kids with mild hypotonia and muscle weakness are difficult to diagnose. Sometimes, even with all the tests, you don't find the answer. How do you explain this to other people who think anyone can go to the doctor and get a diagnosis?

    So, really, how is he supposed to advocate for himself when I have had difficulty explaining his disability? When his doctors have trouble explaining his disability? We have had people act like they don't believe us--like in Scouts, which is one reason we felt it was best for him to drop out of this. Advancement was based on physical skills, hiking was required, and my son didn't want to be constantly reminded of his disability. It wasn't until he had to start wearing a scoliosis brace that some of the people that didn't believe us finally realized that he really does have some muscle weakness problems and he is not just lazy. They could not see his pain when he tried to keep up physically. They would tell him to stop whining if he mentioned his pain so he didn't until the pain became unbearable. We live in a football obsessed community and when boys are in pain they are taught to "suck it up, don't be a wuss."

    He can't tell people he has developmental coordination disorder/dyspraxia which is what he was diagnosed with last year because if they look it up on the internet, it describes some things that don't fit him at all. He is not clumsy on stage, his balance is good, he sings and acts and dances and he plays piano. His handwriting is legible but he can't write as fast or for as long as other kids. He can't do costume changes as fast as other kids and needs help if he has to button his shirt quickly so I have to help with that too. I know that has to bother him but his musical theater friends understand and don't tease him about it.

    I can't imagine what it is like for him to try to explain his disability and get told by people who don't understand that his only problem is that he doesn't exercise enough.

    Last Saturday, after a rehearsal and two performances and a quarter mile walk to the stage his muscles could not take any more. While all the other kids in his musical theater group went on to have fun at the fair, he had to leave because of the foot pain. A volunteer at the fair noticed him and asked him he needed help getting back to the car. He said no, he just needed to stop and rest along the way. He made it back to the car but the muscles in one of his feet were trembling. Later than night his legs hurt and he took two Equate brand Extra Strength Pain Reliever PM hoping to be able to sleep. It took him hours to fall asleep.

    He is looking forward to going to college some day. He just needs a little extra help right now to get through some things other kids are not dealing with. We have not found anyone else with SPD wearing a painful scoliosis brace and also dealing with frequent migraines. Right now I think he needs a little extra support and understanding so that he can be successful and I will try to provide that support as long as he needs it.



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    While hopefully things will get easier for your son once he doesn't have his scoliosis brace, the reality remains that ALL kids, disabled or not, need to learn to be able to be independent. That involves skills such as: being self aware enough to identify your own limits, learning to ask for help, letting other people know your needs, handling frustration, persevering in the face of failure, handling it when other people make mistakes, etc. ALL kids face challenges they will need to be able to handle and that comes through experience. You can't skip that step.

    I think you are really overthinking the diagnosis part. We've had zero problem with simply using a more general description such as "hypotonia" or "muscular disability" or a "condition causing muscular weakness". We follow that up with an explanation of what is needed in that situation. People really don't need to hear your life story and I really can't think of a single daily living situation where that sort of explanation has not been sufficient. Most people in the world are good and want to help and never once with these sorts of explanations has our child been told he just needs to exercise. Rather than trying to make it complicated, I would focus on empowering your son to know how to explain clearly what he needs.

    Even if you somehow could find the exact perfect diagnosis that isn't going to absolve him from the responsibility to communicate his needs to other people. Say we pick out an illness that has a name that is recognizable to most people - let's say muscular dystrophy - that still doesn't tell us that much about what a specific individual needs. He would still need to be able to communicate his specific limits such as I need to use a keyboard or I need to take the elevator.

    In college, students may receive approval for accommodations based on disabilities, but it is still the student's responsibility to be communicate to their professor what they need. I understand it comes from a place of trying to protect him but I believe you are doing your son a disservice to deny him the opportunity now to start to learn to be comfortable with communicating to other people what he needs. I would get out of the room and let him work it out. Probably he will stretch himself to do some things that are hard for him. Very likely he will do things you would not have guessed he was capable of. And, sometimes he'll find he needs to ask the teacher for help. Maybe he'll need to go out in the hall and find you and ask you to adjust his brace and that's okay. Through all of that he can have the pride that he's able to take on levels of independence appropriate for his age.

    Is the real concern about the lack of a specific diagnosis that people don't take it seriously? If that's part of it I'd say that is all the more reason for you to step out of the picture. If people see you not having an appropriate level of distance from your child it sends the message you are a helicopter parent which is automatically going to predispose people to thinking you are exaggerating or creating problems where they don't exist.

    You can dwell in the place of feeling sorry for your son but that isn't productive. Yes, strengthening comes more slowly. That's part of it, but with work it can happen. It likely will never be the case that his tone will normalize or he'll be a super athlete but he doesn't need that to have a good life. Strengthening is vital for health and for living a good life for people with hypotonia. Better core strength helps cut back on fatigue (which may also help cut back on the migraines as fatigue is a common trigger). Strengthening also offers some protection against the real problem of hypotonic people wearing out joints and muscles. It also offers some spinal protection because as you discovered low tone can be problematic in this area too. Again, it isn't to say it is all easy, it isn't, but it can be done!








    Last edited by passthepotatoes; 10/01/10 09:06 PM. Reason: missed word
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    Lori H. Offline OP
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    On another message board I visit regularly, a bright 20-year-old college student and dancer with hypotonia recently posted about her experiences growing up with hypotonia. Some of her experiences sound very similar to ours and she posted this:

    "I agree that kids can be so cruel, but it's not just kids, it's adults.... Because of the lack of diagnosis, it's very difficult for me to be taken seriously. My older cousin, who is a naturopathic doctor, believes that I do not have hypotonia because she read one measly textbook article on it which led her to believe that people with hypotonia all act the same way, and thus I must be "faking" my disorder. My own brother denies that I have it, but I wouldn't take his accusations too seriously - he has no knowledge of biology or anatomy, and can just be a little silly sometimes. The biggest supports have been my mother, my sister, my ballet teacher, and my boyfriend, who had no idea what hypotonia was when he met me six months ago, but considers it legitimate and always helps me out."

    In our experience, like this young woman posted, it isn't just the kids that can be cruel, it is the adults. My son's experience has been that if he tells an adult, like the swimming teacher several years ago, he doesn't get help or understanding, he gets called a wuss. I used to think most people were good and would only want to help or offer encouragement, especially at church, but in our little Oklahoma town the reality is if a boy is in pain or shows weakness in any way the message from a lot of adults (not just a few) is "Be a man, suck it up, don't be a wuss, etc." My husband didn't realize it was this bad at first, but he finally saw it. My very sensitive son learned this message well and would rather try to keep his disability a secret if it is at all possible. My son and I have talked about it and right now he would rather have people think he has a helicopter mom until he gets used to the pain. I have not seen anyone else on any message board with a smart sensitive kid who has to learn while dealing with daily pain. It is frustrating to be in pain and he is persevering and learning.

    I don't think leaving my son alone to deal with the pain without support, with people who don't understand and don't care to understand, is the right thing to do right now. My husband, once a tough army first sergeant, agrees with me.

    The young woman who posted about her experience with hypotonia went through some similar difficulties and is now enjoying college and independence and I think she was stronger because of the support of her family and friends.

    My asynchronous child, who was talking in sentences before he had the muscle strength to walk and totally skipped crawling, and somehow learned to read without being taught way before he started kindergarten and found that he was supposed to know how to color in the lines well first, has a different timeline than other kids. He wants to go to college. He has friends who are already in college. He has been reading a college level CLEP book on history to go along with his history studies. He might try to take the test (all on the computer, no writing required) at the community college testing center before the school year is over. I think he will do well in college and enjoy it just like the young woman who posted about her experiences.

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    Originally Posted by Lori H.
    I used to think most people were good and would only want to help or offer encouragement, especially at church, but in our little Oklahoma town the reality is if a boy is in pain or shows weakness in any way the message from a lot of adults (not just a few) is "Be a man, suck it up, don't be a wuss, etc." My husband didn't realize it was this bad at first, but he finally saw it.

    I had a long talk with my dad a few weeks ago. Turns out he read a lot when he was very young, but he was singled out for being a "bookworm" and learned to hide it. He had a very distinguished military career and can be very gruff - something he developed to keep people from seeing his perceptive and sensitive side.



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    For me it comes down to a choice. You can seek out and dwell on negative stories and define your son's life by pain, pity, and fear. Or, you can decide to approach life with a strong sense of appreciation for many gifts he has and with an openness to allowing him to develop a positive sense of self which includes both an appreciation for his own capabilities and trust in the kindness of other people.

    The more you put out this negativity the fewer kind and supportive people you will draw into your lives and the more isolated and unhappy you will feel. To me it makes sense to balance risks. There is a 100% guaranteed negative outcome of making your child fear other people and feel like he has to hide who he is and what he needs and that he can't have age appropriate independence but instead needs his mom by his side at all times hovering and monitoring. That is the road to depression and anxiety - which often play out in the form of physical pain, headaches, and sleep disturbances.

    Yes, if you encourage more independence sometimes it may not be perfect. Perhaps there will be an insensitive remark or perhaps someone won't understand. It is not the most likely outcome, but a possible one. That is something ALL parents need to face as their children are on the road to independence. At the same time allows him to develop in an age appropriate way and be confident enough to become an independent person. It allows him to develop resilience and the ability to advocate for himself. For me it makes no sense to choose a guaranteed negative outcome over a path that offers huge positives with small possible negatives.

    "My son and I have talked about it and right now he would rather have people think he has a helicopter mom until he gets used to the pain. I have not seen anyone else on any message board with a smart sensitive kid who has to learn while dealing with daily pain."

    What you may be overlooking is that his pain may be intimately tied anxiety and that helicoptering is feeding that. The mind-body connection is a powerful one. I would suggest looking at the long term goal and working backward. If you want him to be independent on a college campus at age 18 how do you see that happening. Let's say his pain can't be resolved, is he to just let go of college or will you come with him?

    As far as people on the board with smart sensitive kids with disabilities, you may be surprised. There are many kids with medical problems, including hypotonia, who are MUCH more affected than you are describing but they go on with their lives happily. We've pursued all sorts of approaches here (occupational and physical therapy, setting small manageable goals and working toward them, supplements, work with a psychologist, biofeedback, relaxation exercises, orthodics and shoes, conventional medical treatments, lifestyle choices like limiting screen time and having calming routines, daily strengthening exercises, building a supportive network of friends, and connecting with the disabilities community where we are forever reminded that our lives are a walk in the park). Yes, it all takes effort and work. It isn't always easy. But, that's life. You do it because the alternative is far worse.


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    Sorry to butt-in with something a little different, but have you seen this magazine? It's written by kids for kids. It's listed on hoagies and Prufrock press. I thought about it when you mentioned how creatively your ds writes when he's allowed to type it out. http://www.prufrock.com/productdetails.cfm?PC=864. It'd be pretty awesome if he got his homework published at only age 12. Maybe he's the next Dean Kontz.

    Good luck with the local Community College. I can see why that would be a very reasonable plan in your circumstances. More appropriate accommodations (electronically?), more appropriate subject level, less likelihood of being teased.


    Youth lives by personality, age lives by calculation. -- Aristotle on a calendar
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