Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums GT Research early identification necessary

I think children in preschool or prep who are gifted need to be identified early. I feel very passionate about this topic since I see too many children in schools going through an educational system which does not adequately cater for them. Is there any support out there for this?

I totally agree with you. In Hong Kong(where I live), there is almost NO such support at all. Most gifted children are treated as naughty and disobedient, not favored by their parents. Well, I was one of them when I was a kid. Anyway, my parents are too old to be "re-educated" now, however, highly intellegient in all other ways. But there are special classes now for children of different "grades/performances", not for the gifted really.

I would love to see preschools and pediatricians take the lead in identifing gifted preschoolers, and helping their parents understand their social and emotional needs! I just heard that some profoundly gifted kids begin underachieving to fit in as early as preschool - WOW!

I also think that many gifted kids would benifit from early work with an occupational therapist to expand their physical comfort in their bodies, and that this should be offered widely. My son was "too smart" to do some of the normal physical development risk taking that was nescessary to learn about how his body worked. 6 months of OT for "sensory integration disorder" was very, very helpful. He is in better shape, healthier, and less troubled by the "oversensitivities."

I have four kids and each time I struggled with the right time to have them diagnostically tested. For the 1st, the school district warned that testing him too early (pre-reading) may give low results and that he couldn't be re-tested for 2 years. His kindergarten teacher finally told me what to do and I proceeded. The next kid had the same story except I figured if #1 scored so high and #2 is doing things earlier and faster, he must be even higher IQ. I didn't fret so much with #3 because he was just plain old scary smart. Now I'm again struggling with #4 who is 4 in preschool. I'm confident he's gifted but in order to be in the self-contained class he has to score at least 145. I wonder if being a fluent reader is necessary to do well on the iq test.
Anyway, the reason I'm going on about my reservations about early testing even though I KNOW early identification is so beneficial, is that most moms I know are even more conservative than I am. The district almost always waits until 2nd grade to screen kids (unless one stands out like a sore thumb or their mom is too persistent). I always advise moms to get their kids tested earlier and not wait until 2nd grade, but when is best? 4? 5? 6?

I have to agree about the early testing. I folded under pressure from the school and agreed not to test my oldest child this year (age 6, 1st grade). The school doesn't want to test until 2nd grade, and despite a lot of "reasons" that were offered, my cynical take is that the real reason for delayed testing is the lack of services until 3rd grade. Parents with concrete information are more likely to push for services that don't exist.

My husband really wanted to test, but when I explained the list of reasons for delay, he reluctantly agreed. I now regret our decision.

Part of what has changed my mind about testing is the time I've spent volunteering in class. The difference between what my son does in class and at home was eye opening. I've always known my kids are smarter than average, but I didn't really have any idea what a typical 6 or year old could do until I started helping at school. My son's teacher is a warm, kind person who really makes an effort to engage him, but he is tuning out, and I now understand why. They practice reading the "ow" sound and make lists of ow words. He comes home and reads Chemicals in Action, which is targeted at 7th or 8th graders. They talk about the fact that animals have different types of homes. My 6 year old comes home and freezes water, milk, rum, and rubbing alcohol with different combinations of salt and sugar to find out which liquids will freeze and whether or not the salt and sugar will change the way they freeze. (Yesterday's experiment.)

I'm not sure testing would make a huge difference because of the lack of services for the early grades, but numbers mean something in a bureaucracy, and my son might have at least gotten a little more differential instruction.

I'm spending this afternoon writing an essay about why my son should be in the one second grade class that has a teacher with gifted training. If I had tested him, this would not be an issue now. Due to school policies about requesting instructors, I can't ask for a specific teacher. Instead, I am left with documenting behaviors that support my request for a gifted/TAG-trained teacher without requesting her by name. Fortunately for my son, his current teacher thinks needs to be there too, so she is providing supporting documentation.

At this point, I plan to test my second child (now 4) in kindergarten.

Jill, even if a school does not have programs available to service younger gifted children, the information you get from testing them really helps you figure out a strategy for them. I think the easiest grade skipping is early-on (I had one kid skip 5th, one skip 4th, and one skip 2nd and by far the easiest was 2nd grade--4th was bad either). Already I dread my 4 yr old going through the alphabet AGAIN in kindergarten next year. One reason I'm anxious to test him is to collect documentation to skip K and go on to 1st grade. More meat there. We have no regrets about grade skipping (except some slight concern about skipping the bridging grade between elementary and middle...here, that's 5th grade, but it's different everywhere). The boys are physically less mature than their classmates, but have no problems with academics. I'm already worrying about when/how to orchestrate a second grade skip, at least for one son. Someday, we'll have to figure out what valuable programs they should do with "time saved" as Miraca Gross calls it. My husband says they should go abroad and do an intensive language study, or explore Europe and other places. So much time is wasted for the really bright kids if they stay where they are, and I find it makes my kids misbehave (when they're bored and unchallenged) and fear that later they would turn to substance abuse or wreckless teenager stunts if I didn't advocate for them now.
Early testing can help justify grade skips, can identify talent search programs (like the Davidson Institute, Johns Hopkins, Duke, Rocky Mt, etc.) that have counselors or distance learning opportunities. My 7 yr old took the Johns Hopkins talent search SCAT test recently and said, "Thank you, Mama, for letting me take that test!" afterwards. He was excited to take an above level test, something that finally approached challenging him and gives him an interesting experience. He can't wait to take other tests in the future. He's so happy to be a Davidson Young Scholar--it has really improved his self-esteem, and I also think it motivates kids to want to take distance learning courses or other opportunities.

I have mixed feelings about early testing, based mostly on the fact that I had such a lopsided PG child for quite a while--extremely early math but no early reading at all (and contrary to what you will read from Linda Silverman, my son had no visual or learning difficulties to account for this. He simply was not an early reader).

It took him until age 7.5 to even out, and in fact his verbal abilities have now outpaced his math abilities every time we check But the difference between his IQ scores at age 5 and at age 7.5 (two different tests) was really quite striking, simply because of the change in his ability to read. If we had gone simply on those early scores, we would have had pretty poor information. In fact, I am very grateful to one gifted school administrator who told me that she saw a real dissonance between his 5-year-old IQ test and his WJ scores at 6 and recommended further testing for that reason. She was absolutely right.

Fortunately or unfortunately, since we had no access to a gifted program of any kind before 3rd grade (and not much after that ) .. class placement was not an issue in the testing, we were simply looking for diagnostic information. I hate to think what would have happened if we'd been dependent on the early testing for educational placement reasons.

You know, I think there is a need for early testing for many children, but that perhaps Cat Smith's experience points to the need for continued monitoring. The point of discussion that I've heard made re early IQ testing is that there is a basic, early development which must occur before testing is accurate -- and it seems clear enough that the timing for that development varies individually. That said, I think there are clear and compelling reasons for early testing for some individual children -- and in our case, waiting until 4 years old has just been too long. No way can I place my daughter in any public or private school -- they suggest (1) that she be placed with kids her age because socialization is so important, and then (2) that she be set apart in the classroom when she does her regular work, which is currently at a level around twice her chronological age -- as if that won't be strange socially for her. She conceals so much already -- and has been since around 11 to 13 months when she first realized that other babies wouldn't respond to her greeting, "Hi! How are you?! I'm __. I'm __ months old! What's your name? How old are you?" It's sad to see her going underground. We -need- to find other kids like her. It isn't that we want to rush her or hurry her -- it's that we don't want her to get so used to hiding her abilities, to grow used to not learning. Those are bad lessons, the wrong things to teach. That's why we need early testing -- earlier than is now available.

Perhaps "early testing" needs to be thought about in terms of milestones, rather than ages?

Here are some ideas - please post yours:
-test the minute you become aware that the child is conceling their intelligence.
-test when other people's eyes start bugging out.
-test when your child becomes a reader, and there is reason to suspect that they are gifted.
-test when there are behavior problem in the classroom, or at home.
-test when you need to start making plans for your child's educational path.
-test when you throw away the baby books in frustration because the "timing is all off."

Perhaps we can come up with a working list of "developmental" triggers for testing that aren't age based.

I�m feeling less cynical today, so I have to admit I sort of understand why our school doesn�t want to test kids before 2nd grade. They use a variety of group tests. Some are achievement-based and some are more like IQ tests. From what I�ve read, the group tests are a lot less accurate for young children. Once the tests are given, the school won�t retest for 2 years to prevent parents who want kids in gifted programs for status reasons from training their kids to improve their scores with each retake. As a result, an inaccurate test can deny services for 2 years. Given that the tests become more accurate after about age 7, they discourage parents from testing younger children.

I think the school needs to administer tests designed specifically for younger students. In practice, I don�t know what that means. Would they need to move to individually administered exams? I suspect that part of the problem is money � more expensive testing for younger kids and requiring more services as more K-1 students are identified.

Does anyone have experience with these types of group tests? How do they compare to a more traditional IQ test, which is done individually? More to the point, what type of test is truly useful when working with a 4 or 5 year old?

The school will test my son next fall. He will be 7 later this summer, so he is at the point where most of the tests are reasonably accurate. My daughter, on the other hand, is 4 and I think that this time around we need to get the information up front instead of waiting as we did with out son. I�ve pulled her out of preschool because she complains constantly that they don�t read and she is tired of �baby math� and wants to subtract. (She�s only going a total of 8 hours a week, but apparently even that is too much. I just wanted a little break!) She�s not old enough for kindergarten this fall, so I am going to keep her home this coming year and let her explore her interests.

My daughter is less compliant than her brother, and a lot less tolerant of busy work. (He tunes out and contemplates his latest interests when bored.) This time around I want to know enough to make a better decision for her than we did for her brother. For him, I�m hoping that having a TAG-trained teacher next year will help him re-engage in school. For her, I�m really hoping that we don�t have to get to that point.

PS Speaking of eyes bugging out... My daughter was an early talker and I nursed her for a long time � 2 years. When she was about 16 months old (still bald and looking like a baby) she would pop out from under my shirt and say �I switch sides now�.

LOL!

My parents used to say, dissaprovingly, "If you can ask to nurse you're too old to do so." - hogwash!

As a toddler, mine worked out a method to let me know what was on his mind. I remember him grabbing "Mothering Magazine" and holding it out to me temptingly. Ouch!

My son also had the bald baby look for a long time and once when he was about 18 months old, in a moment of temptation, he pulled the soap spout at a natural foods store and a splat of soap spilled onto the floor. Some old lady started cooing "oopsy" and he looked at her annoyed and said "allright, I go get a mop" and stormed off.

On another subject though, my son is now five and ready to enter kindergarten this fall. We are in a pretty rural area and I am afraid that even if he is tested that there won't be any services for him that don't isolate him. I don't know when to ask for him to get tested - or who to ask. I don't want to appear the neurotic mom and ask before he even starts school. But, who am I kidding, I am a neurotic mom. And I do believe in early testing. I happened to have a great kindergarten teacher when I was young who spotted me and had me tested within months of starting school. My uneducated parents never did know what to do with me. I think they thought it was normal for a child to teach themself to read. I was put into my own math and reading group after being tested, though, and I definately don't think that helped my social skills.

Melisa -
I totally empathise with not wanting to appear to be an neurotic mom. You will.

As the Mom of a boy who wasn't identified until 2nd grade, I applaud your awareness and your efforts. If I could go back in time, then I think I would have wished for early entrance or direct enterance to 1st grade, just for the reasons you outlined, becuase we want the best possible social development for these boys. I think that if he starts with 1st grade, then I won't have to go through making and re-making friends.

I like the IdeA, of not wanting one's child isolated, and still wanting one's child to get the same proper challenge at school that anyother kid gets - but it's probably impossible for most of us most of the time. I could dream of a multiage classroom with clusters of MG, HG, and PG kids along with normal kids.

I think we have a tendency to assign "blame collectors." Would your social skill have been better if you Hadn'T been in solitary reading and math groups - maybe yes and maybe no. It's so easy for a grade skipped child to look back and say, well, I was younger and less mature, so I didn't fit in, but really, perhaps that child was underskipped!

I was the youngest in myclass room, and though that my poor social skills were due to being "too young" now I think it might have been because I was "underplaced." We'll never know! Good Luck

Trin

My daughter's 3YO preschool teacher told me that my daughter was highly gifted. It took a long time for that to sink in. I figured she told everyone that! Anyway, I never really saw the need to have my kids tested. What would a number do for me? My daughter received all the available services through school, so testing wasn't going to bring in any more.

I finally had both of my kids tested when I thought about sending them to a gifted school, and it was required. I learned alot about the way each of my children learn and their strengths and weaknesses. It was useful for me, though not in identifying that they were gifted, I already knew that.

Honestly, I think the preschool teachers assessment was the best thing for me - I spent the time to figure out what my daughter needed in the way of education. I evaluated all the school options in our area and determine that the public school was in fact the best option. I advocated for (and got, hurray!) additional services for all high functioning kids at various different grade levels in our school system. My husband and I agreed on what we wished for our children. (A chance to be children, to run and jump and play and experience, not just to learn through books.)

The key in my mind is not early testing, but early identification. And the hesitancy is that if an educator (or a pediatrician) identifies a child as gifted and it turns out that the child does not do well in school, then what? Is it incumbant upon the school to ensure that the child achieves at the anticipated level or at grade level... Blah, blah, blah.

I have always said in our district that you should identify the children at preschool screening who are precocious, and label them as such. Then provide services for "precocious children" until such a time you as the school system is comfortable identifying them as "gifted." So perhaps you provide precocious K-2nd graders with advanced reading, and math and explorations options and then at 3rd grade you provide gifted classes or pull-outs or whatever.

I like the idea of Precocious for K-2 and gifted as seperate ideas. That way you can give the moderatly gifted early reader an appropriate education all the way through, and the gifted first grader who is sitting alone reading college level Math texts a different appropriate education. Note that those would be very different. In my mind "precocious" is good because it refers to skill development that is can be demonstrated to be above age expectations on a video tape. It refers to what is and how it is different from what is expected. "Gifted" in my mind, refers to a child who needs to learn differently from other same age children, using techniques such as compacted curriculum, telescoped cirriculum, idea-heavy curriculum, abstract learning style, visual spacial learning style, mentoring, concurrent enrollment, subject acceleration, full grade acceleration, differentiated social skill and character development, and partial program public school combined with partial homeschooling.

(LOL - I've learned a lot of words this year!)

((smiles))
Trinity

Melissa -

I also live in a rural area. We knew DS was gifted when he started reading (self taught) at 2.... but didn't see any need in testing. Then came kindergarten and a teacher who mentally abused him ( I hope inadvertantly) by treating him like he had a problem rather than like he had a gift and a need that needed addressing.

In retrospect, I wish we had tested early - and privately - at a younger age and been able to present the teachers with a satisfactory explanation of the various behaviors that they would see.

It would have been very nice to have avoided that horrid experience.

Honestly - test when you have reason to test and when the testing will matter. In your case - test before starting school if possible. Avoid the problems before they start if you can.

Teachers don't listen when you say 'my child is gifted' - but they do listen when you say 'here is a copy of the psych's report on DS'.

Mary

My granddaughter turned two in March. I am looking into info on identifying and testing her gifted characteristics. She sang her ABC's all the way through when she was 16 months old. She speaks to everyone like she is an adult. She counts to 20 on her own. Identifies animals by their correct name...not just dog and cat...She let me know that I was incorrect about a tiger, it was a cheetah. She remembers things you tell her only once. She can spell her name..Alexus. She identifies all of her family in pictures. She knows well over 20 songs, and sings along with the radio. She knows letters that correspond with her family members...B is for Becca..and so on. I could go on and on.. but I just wanted to touch base and see if anyone has information to share.
My son and daughter-in-law are fantastic about working with her but I was wondering if there is anything else that we could be doing to feed into her.
Any info would be greatly appreciated.


Lisa Bodkin
Lexi's Ya Ya..(she starting calling me that on her own...love it, we didn't even know that it was the Greek word for Grandmother.)

Thanks again...

Welcome Lisa,
Pat yourself on the back!

here are some ideas:

Get the book "losing our minds: gifted children left behind" by Deborah Ruf. also read anything you can about unschooling, John Holt's idea about following the child's lead in exploring her world.

It sounds likely that homeschooling or private schooling is in your future. Anything you can do to help the parents prepare financially for that is a blessing. anything you can do to help Mom and Dad maintain their "couple" relationship is another blessing. As delightful as these children are, they require lots and lots of energy and attention. If it helps to think of her as "special needs," they go ahead and use that perspective.

Praise Effort and Persistience, not Ability. Try to head off well meaning strangers who want to gush about how bright she is - say "I love living with a child who is so very curious about everthing."

Mostly just enjoy. Write back if you have any specific questions - protecing her privacy, of course.

Smiles,
Trinity

Hi Lisa,

Your grand-daughter is so lucky to have you, not to mention how lucky your son and daughter-in-law are. I think one of the hardest things about having highly gifted kids is the loneliness as adults. I see their high intelligence almost as a disability (in NM gifted is under special education) because the kids don't entirely fit in with their age-mates, have more complex interests, require so much more from parents, and are basically more intense. I wouldn't trade it for anything, but there is often no one to talk to (except you all on bulletin boards) after my mom passed away. Everyone else thinks you're bragging, or "neurotic"/pushy uber-mom, or saying your kids are better than theirs. They resent you and your kids' achievements. The only people I have found very supportive are school district professionals. I have taken to not talking to anyone other than professionals and my husband about them. What I'm trying to say is that being available as a caring advocate for your grand-daughter to your son/d-i-l is invaluable.

Also what I suggest to help your grand-daughter is to help provide enriching experiences to nurture her gifts (museums, library trips, art classes, board games, puzzles, read lots and lots of interesting stories to her including non-fiction, fables, folk tales, poetry, etc.) Talk to her about everything that is going on, to help her develop a rich vocabulary. If she has her ABCs down, start talking to her about phonics and playing games to get her to learn the sounds of letters, then what letters certain words start and end with. I think schools progress too slowly for "precocious" children. Capitalize on her enthusiasm at such a young age. I bought magnetic letters for the refrigerator and my son spells simple words with sounds while I'm cooking. I also recommend workbooks, though some people don't like them, but doing them with her during down-time to introduce topics. My son has fun adding/subtracting numbers and even multiplying, measuring with a ruler, telling time, etc. (he's just 4) mostly because they are new topics and he can quickly master them. If I waited for school, it'd be another couple years before he'd even heard of these things.

Good Luck,
Cym

I am new to this board and I have learned a great deal in a couple of days. I celebrate my son's gifts and think he is amazing. I have found that society considers him a problem. After speaking with the principle of the local elemenatary school, he also oversees the TAG program, he told me "ohh wow, I don't know what YOU will do with him". Don't I pay taxes? I know this is ugly to say but... don't we do all kinds of things for children with disabilities? Why don't we do more for children with uber abilities? Thank goodness for the internet and that I can stay home with him. It will kill me to see the light in his eyes that he has for learning go out because he is forced to sit in a bland environment day after day. I know realize why my teachers were always fussing with me. I was incredibly bored and hated everyday I spent in school. They kept telling me that they knew I could do better. Yes I could but why should I have?

I firmly believe that kids should be taught according to education level and NOT age. Some children are better with some topics and not others. Doesn't it make common sense that we teach them that way? Doctors have been saying for years that girls are better verbally and boys are better mathmatically shouldn't they be taught at diiferent levels and styles? The more I read on this board the more angry and frustrated I become.

Welcome rocksea,
sounds like you are part of the "Gifted Movement" now!

Yippee that you can homeschool! You can post resource requests here.

As far as the "we do it for disabled kids" argument - i agree that it's ugly. How about we take the high road and try to educate EVERY child in a way that works for them, without discriminating against anyone, including gifted? Remember that parent's of disabled children have been organizing politically since the 1950's and have put a lot of hard work into their results. We should learn from them and win their support. (Of course some of us or also them - wink)

Welcome and Love,
trinity

It would be great if there were something that could be done in addition to what parents do at home. We have over 200 books for my son, plus he loves music (can play drums, harmonica), loves to dance, loves to color and paint at 12 months.

What have we heard the most from people "don't teach him too much - he will be bored in school".

Having programs that encourage gifted young children would be great!

Given that children can have such severe asynchronous development that it can impair their learning, I think it's imperative gifted children be identified as soon as possible. The earlier the better.

Frankly I think the health care professions need to take responsibility in identifying gifted kids. It is a need. It is a special need. It needs support, and in some cases, medical interventions. When the health care professionals start to realize THEY are preventing children from getting the interventions they need to be educated and thrive, we will see a shift in the field of education. I wish oh wish Mite and DS15 had been identified when they were young. I wish I had pushed harder. It may have made a huge difference for them.

jmo,though.

LOL - What have we heard the most from people "don't teach him too much - he will be bored in school".

You must learn to tune out that piece of advice. I "stopped" doing anything remotly educational with DS10 when he entered kindergarden, for that very reason. They the critics, from me, that I tried it, and he was bored in school anyway. I can pretty much guarentee that regular school isn't going to be an issue for your family.

I do agee with WG that it's the Pediatricians who are best situated to inform the parents about a child "asynchronous development." I'd love to see us reach out to them and be part of Pediatricition education. Not sure how to do it. In my experience, many pediatricians are themselves gifted and have gifted children, and are still in the place of "trying hard not to offend or out anybody." But it is a special need. A real need. And if thoses needs aren't met - - - watch out!

Trinity

Hi,

As usual, some great conversation here.

This message thread really hits close to home for me. Initially, my wife and I knew very little about gifted education until it sprung itself upon us via our son about one year ago(currently 8 years old).

Part of the solution is to educate the parents about giftedness. Forums like this and DITD website are a real blessing. To be honest, until we discovered our son was gifted, we just thought he was an above average "bright" kid (early reader, speaker, etc.) and our friends' children were not as bright (no insult intended). As mentioned, we did not know about gifted children and therefore, we didn't know what to look for.

When applying to schools, we tried to do the right thing and we actually held him back one year because he was a summer boy. We were advised that summer boys should be held back a year due to maturity issues. In Kindergarten and the beginning of first grade, he told us he was very bored but we told him to stick with it. I still feel guilty about this response as he could have easily shut down. Fortunately, de did not.

Thankfully, his first grade teacher alerted us last year (November 2005) and we were able to have him tested and design a better program for him (we finally decided on home schooling). And, as parents, we were able to educate ourselves.

Part of the challenge, in my opinion, is that giftedness, by definition, covers such a small part of the population - anywhere from 1% to 2%. The school system is setup to deal with the vast majority of the children who sit in the 95%. And, the school systems (public and private) are challenged dealing with the norm.

I like Trinity's idea about having some basic milestones. These milestones should be given to all parents when they put their children in pre-school. Or, as WG states, by health care professionals. This would help alert parents to the world of giftedness if they see the milestones.

When I talk to friends about it, I compare discovering our son's giftedness to another parent discovering their child has dsylexia. Obviously, giftedness is a happy event. However, both "conditions" must be dealt with and the school system does not know how to deal with them because they are way outside the norm.

Just my two cents...

Hi SFParent -

"In Kindergarten and the beginning of first grade, he told us he was very bored but we told him to stick with it. I still feel guilty about this response as he could have easily shut down. Fortunately, de did not."

Please stop feeling guilty over this. You did the best you knew with the information you had at the time. Same with us, and "shut down" DS did - luckily quite loudly! However, know that DS10, from the perspective of 3 years down the road, really values the life experience he gained during that rough patch - so who knows?

Trinity

Thanks Trinity!!

I am a combination of Jewish/Catholic guilt so it is hard to let go easily.

I really enjoy all the posts and I read most of them. My goal is to participate more and more.

Take care.

I didn't say it was easy - SFParent - LOL! I didn't say that I could do it. But I do try...that's all we can ask, right?

I'm looking forward to hearing more about your challenges and successes!

Trinity

Hi Jill!
The computer says you stopped by. How are your son and daughter? Did you get services for DS? DD sounds so "take no prisioners" - my kind of female - obviously! What are you plans and hopes?
Trinity

Hi Trinity,

Thanks for asking!

My DS got unofficial services this year - gifted testing just started a couple weeks ago. He's in a classroom with a gifted trained teacher who has been really good for him. The start of the year was pretty rough because he developed some pretty bad habits last year. (Typical smart kid stuff - no need to pay attention, so he didn't.) The new teacher makes a point of asking "thought questions" as a part of regular instruction and providing lots of opportunity to expand on the topic. My DS didn't like the fact that she expected him to pay attention.

The teacher does a more open ended math program than the standard 2nd grade program and he is eating it up. I've been explaining at home how to represent his word problems in algebraic notation and teaching him how to program formulas in Excel. The teacher gives very open-ended math projects each week & he's been delighted to use his new tools to solve the problems.

DS's teacher also does an open ended reading program & there are other kids in the room who read well. He picks books with a reading partner. They decide together how much of the book to read as homework each night and then write a reponse for the next day's discussion. My DS is not that fond of writing but he loves the fact that he has some control of what he has to read. She's also very supportive of his desire to read his own books when he is done with his work. For a while he brought Harry Potter and the 1/2 Blood Prince to class, and was really pleased that no one teased him about reading it. (Teasing about his books was an issue last year.)

I just hope this continues to work because I am sooo relieved that he is a bit happier with life these days.

My DD is driving me nuts, but in a good way. (It's the energy it takes to keep her stimulated that makes me crazy.) We are homeschooling kindergarten right now because she is not old enough for school and preschool was so not working. I also signed her up for Spanish lessons. That's been pretty cool, because I've always thought that the lack of integrated foreign language lessons from an early age is a major problem in the American education system. It's fun to hear her talking and suddenly say something like "when I was riding my new bicicleta roja (red bike)...".

My DS has never displayed the uber-geek personality that her big brother has, so I have to admit that I was really suprised to discover that she has a real talent and love for math and science. I feel like a bad Mom - I'm SUPPOSED to notice stuff like that! I got a Saxon homeschool K math program & she's almost done with March. The K program is really too easy in many ways, but it gives me ideas for cool projects (like doing all of the shape and color lessons in Spanish), and parts of the program address new topics. Saxon uses lots of hands on activites, which are great for a preschooler. The program is adaptable enough that I will probably buy the 1st grade program to start after Christmas.

She's also been writing her own books for our science program. The first one was "DS Grows" - reproduction and the first year of life. (Egg and Sperm. In the uterus. ... DS is born. ... DS talks. ...) Now she is creating a book called "Plants Grow". She is growing lettuce and writing and drawing pictures about the project.

Friends keep asking what about next year because DS will start K already reading, doing math, and so on. I jokingly reply that that's the school's problem, but I do worry. Most of my friends don't realize that DS is already reading, writing, and doing math at more of a 1st grade level than a K level. This time around, my husband and I plan to ask for TAG screening immediately. We hope to head off some of the problems that DS encountered.

Jill

Hi Jill -
I loved hearing about DS and his teacher sounds wonderful

Here are some flowers for how she got DS out of his bad habits - ((virtual bouquet)) That's a tough road, as I now know, with DS10 in grade skip at the new school! But a very happy tough road!

You work with DD sounds wonderful! I'd love to see those books! ((have you applied to the Young Scholar's Program? I forgot.)) Keep discovering her! She's a brand new continent, and it's bound to be confusing. OK - Columbus thought he was in India, you thought she was more traditional in her strengths - if this were easy, everyone would be good at it! LOL!

I agree that the best course is to "dance like there's no one watching; Homeschool like there will always be appropriate placement in the future"

Big Hugs -
Trin