Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Twice Exceptional I need your thoughts on this

Hi everyone,

Sorry to ask all the questions. I'm very upset with school that DS 7 is attending and could really use objective perspectives.

A brief recap of what happened last January. DS was put through a battery of tests because of behavioral issues at school. He scored 98 to 99.6 on the academic achievement tests. He scored a 127 on the IQ test(I don't remember the name of which test they gave him) The school Psychologist and the Speech Path had a disagreement on their evaluations on him. The Psychologists said she felt he fit on the Autism spectrum and SP said he was normal. Because of this disagreement, the school recommended him to be evaluated independently, but they would only recognize a diagnoses from a Pediatric Neurologist.

I made an appointment with the Children's Hospital in Boston with a Pediatric Neurologist. She examined him only for gross and fine motor skills, then tells me that she is not qualified to diagnose anything on the Autistic spectrum. When I made the appointment I was very clear on why I was making the appointment. So, I'm back to square one.

My husband and I had a meeting with the school last Wednesday to discuss the appointment with the Neurologist. The school wants him tested again with another Neurologist. At the meeting it was brought up that the school could make and send in all the paperwork in a Neurologist of there choice. I told them I wanted to make the appointment, so I could talk with the Neurologist to make sure it was a good fit. They all just looked at each other and a new topic was brought up.

After the meeting my husband and I talked in detail about the whole meeting and decided we did not want him tested by a Neurologists. I called the school the next day and told them our decision.

I received a phone call from his teacher last night trying to talk me back into re-testing him. Telling me she could not do anything additional with him without an IEP. She also said that the school wanted to send all the paperwork from the testing in January and just send it to a Neurologist without the Neurologist meeting my son. I was horrified! How can someone send out dated info. This is not logical! If they sent all the paperwork it would show a large discrepancy between the way he acts at school and the way he acts at home. Additionally, it would show a large difference between the school Psychologist and the SP. How could anyone make a diagnoses based on that info, without meeting him.

I've has a suspicion for some time now that the school was not looking out for my son's best interest. I feel it's all about funding. The school is pushing so hard for a diagnoses of any kind.

Please tell me my thinking is off base, because I have lost faith in the system that I was counting on to help and education my son.

Oh,I also told the teacher that we will have my son tested, but not through a Neurologist. We will pick someone who has my son's best interest in mind.

Do you think that he has Autism? Or is this something that the school is dreaming up?

I thought that by law they couldn't tell you to take your child to a doctor, am I wrong about that?

And they were going to just send his info in to the doctor and the doctor was going to send back a diagnosis without seeing him? That seems very fishy!

No, I don't feel he's on the Autism spectrum. The school however, feels differently. The school told me, he could be acting differently at school because of all the stimulation, and he may not be able to handle it.

I don't know if the school can tell you to see a doctor or not. I think they can recommend an independent evaluation on the child if there is a disagreement.

Yes, they wanted to just send in the test paperwork to a Neurologist from last January, without meeting him.

When I told the school about the appointment I had, and how I brought in every scrap of paper the school has given me to the Neurologist. You should have seen the look on their faces. One person even said."You brought all the papers?" Well of course I did. I brought in the good, the bad, and the ugly. In my eyes, It's the only way a doctor would be able to fully understand everything going on.

That sounds like a nightmare to me. It's like the school is trying to force you into getting him diagnosed.

Is he still having problems at school?

I'd call the Children's Hospital neurologist and ask her who would be able to diagnose something on the Autism spectrum? I'd also ask her about the idea of making a diagnosis without meeting the child. That seems very off.

Sounds like you have a long road ahead but give yourself a pat on the back for how well you've done so far! I'd avoid sharing your concern with the school that they may not have your son's best interest in mind. That may make them too defensive.

Inky's got the right idea. The child neurologist you saw may specialize in, say, epilepsy or neuromuscular disorders, and not be well-versed in developmental disorders, especially at a place like Children's in Boston. Ask for a pediatric neuropsychologist, and specifically ask if they can assess for autistic spectrum disorders, nonverbal learning disorders, and other behavioral issues.

With the obvious caveat that I'm not a medical professional...

Some of the children of parents in our local gifted advocacy group have found themselves in a similar position, with schools seeking to have an autism spectrum diagnosis put in place in order to secure additional funding to support the child's learning needs (by hiring an educational aide, for example, for the classroom). Some parents have Asperger's/gifted kids, but others have done autism assessments that have produced an array of results from speech pathologists, occupational therapists, and educational psychologists: auditory processing issue; ADHD; sensory processing/coordination issues; depression/anxiety/OCD; and of course simple gifted overexcitabilities/intensity. So my sense is that autism may be a bit of a diagnosis-du-jour for some school professionals (and I mean no disrespect to the many kids and parents dealing with ASDs, but I'm really concerned about the fact that schools are generating this suggestion).

My advice would be to seek a comprehensive assessment by someone who is familiar with gifted kids and with kids on the spectrum. There are some overlapping behaviours--the Webb book on misdiagnosis/dual diagnoses is helpful--that could be examined. And your child's pediatrician is a good place to start, too; if exams up to now have not turned up any indicators for autism in terms of developmental issues than it seems unlikely that it would first manifest at school, doesn't it? Best wishes.

Thanks Inky!! I have a call into her now.

She told me after the exam that I needed to see a Pediatric Neuropsychiatrist to diagnose Autism/Aspergers. I told the school this and it fell on deaf ears.

The school will only have him see a Neurologist, not a Neuropsychiatrist. I don't get it.

He is not having the issues this year like he did last year. He has tested his teacher, but learned quickly she will not put up with his arguing.

Ask them to quote the regulation and policy on this. My guess is that they don't have one.

What do I do if they don't have one??

You probably need either a pediatric neuropsychologist (a PhD who specializes in testing such as IQ testing, etc) or as they suggested, a pediatric neuropsychiatrist or pediatric behavioral specialist (an MD who evals/treats these disorders, sometimes using medicines if appropriate). Any of these specialists should be able to help, although I would ask the scheduling personnel specifically when you make the appointment.

If you're in the Boston area, maybe this would help

http://www.childrenshospital.org/clinicalservices/Site1893/mainpageS1893P0.html

From my experience with friends who went through this, you will probably need to seek out this consult on your own. The school may not help you with the referral, but the school should recognize the results if you seek out a reputable professional. You may want to check with your health insurance provider to see if any of this would be covered by insurance.

Here is the big question. What is to gain with a diagnosis? Really, a diagnosis isn't necessary for an IEP, period. Qualifiying, documented need is all that is necessary for an IEP. My DD has an AS diagnosis by a psychologist that isn't recognized by the school. One isn't necessary for services. She has a pragmatic speech delay and that qualifies her for services. That doesn't make sense unless they are pushing for money. I would read up on IDEA 2004 before any more meetings and look at what benefit your son would get from all this testing. If he is doing well this year then it might not need addressed at all right now.

Completely unrelated to the problem at hand with the school. It is common for many AS kids to test 'within normal range' on speech tests such as the CASL and others commonly given but fail miserably when given something like the PLSI (pragmatic language skills inventory). So, if they aren't giving the right test he may have AS and not qualify without the right test. Does that make sense? My DD didn't qualify two years ago because the school didn't yet have the PLSI. Most GT kids walk all over the CASL regardless of an AS diagnosis until around middle to high school. I'm not saying he has AS, just giving you the scenario. The psychologist picked up on it where the speech therapist didn't until later when pressed for more AS specific testing.

Austin, you are right! The school doesn't have a policy. The counselor called me today, and I asked her to send me a copy of the policy. She became very flustered and said everyone was confused on this. She got off the phone as soon as possible. It was pretty funny in a sad way.

I think we will try to get an appointment with a child Psychologist that deals with GT and Aspergers. She's down in RI. Could take a while to get in.

Could someone kindly tell me how to multi-quote?? It's very difficult to respond to members, one post at a time

Thank you everyone who responded to this thread. I was really up set about all of this. It was a breath of fresh air to talk to you all.

I'd figure out how the School District is structured and who keeps copies of all their policies and procedures. And do your own enquiry.

If they don't have one, then you can contact Dr Ruf or the folks at Davidson and get a model policy for them to adopt.

That's how bureaucracies work.

Hi Tall boys

I don't know about the US but I found out that here in NZ the schools would much prefer a child is diagnosed on the Autistic Spectrum because they get extra funding for that but nothing if a child is gifted. If they see behaviour issues they like to be able to support the teacher with a teacher aide which they can get if they have an autistic/asperger's etc child in the class.

And his behaviour may be no more than my DS6 who; when bored acts out, when being overly perfectionist has major melt-downs and is emotionally very sensitive. We also warned the school right at the beginning of the year to put him with a strong teacher who will see through his manipulating and not put up with his arguing - seems to have worked so far, although we are having a bad week, as I've said somewhere else he may be taking a developmental leap or just in need of end of term break.

Good luck - hope you find the right help, we did and it made all the difference.