Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Twice Exceptional gifted scores and severe processing speed issues

hi all
i am just catching up on all the new posts. I started the thread. I wanted to add that my son also has some anxiety.. but not enought to explain "everything" just tends to hate preassure, does worse if he knows its a rush, will yell "stop rushing me" at the slightest hint of pressure.

so these are the qualities that most of the kids on this thread seem to share.

low coding score
gifted range for VCI and/or PCI
poor handwriting but not necessarily dysgraphia
poor computation skills
dislike of writing
ok with spelling (but not great, but certainly not bad enough for dysgraphia)
excellent reading and comprehension
anxiety
social awkward at times, but not enough for a Pervasive disorder (autism)
motor skills ok
possible visual/spatial learner (but not 100% fit)
speed on "strength area" tests just fine, like reading or math concepts.
distractibility (but by external stimuli, not own "stims")

are any of your kids also very interested in music and/or dance? excellent tone?
also he is extremely interested in science and history. For a first grader, these are the only real "content" subjects so i think this is interesting. Does it ring any bells?

irene

also forgot to add

how many of these kids would be described as "late bloomers".. mine had FSIQ of 89 at 4...

renie1
Yes those all fit my 11 year old except that his handwriting is neat, just labored and almost nonexistent. And he is unbelievably interested in science. History yes, but not so passionate.

Benny

I am a homeschool mom and I feel so guilty that I have said these words to my 11 year old son with motor dyspraxia, hypotonia and SPD out of frustration--"Just try harder" even though I know he is trying. He included this little phrase in a parody of me and one of our typical homeschool days. His big sister, his dad and I were at a pizza restaurant and his sister asked him how our homeschooling was going and having never been a kid to answer with only a few cliche words, he immediately went into an improv performance to show her. Afterwards, his sister told him it was really, really good and I had to agree and he definitely pointed out some problems we are having in a humorous way.

In his parody he included an imitation of me on the message board asking him questions even though I told him he could take a break--it went something like this: DS: Mom, You have to see this YouTube video I just found, its really good. Me: I'll have to look at it later. Look at this--another kid not coloring in the lines but reading chapter books in Kindergarten, I have to say something about this, What do you think about it? DS: Mom, I thought it was my break time. I would really like to enjoy my break. Me: But it will just take a minute, just tell me what you think..... He also included a scene with me criticizing his appearance and eavesdropping on a conversation with his sister and making an excuse for walking into the room when they are sharing secrets.

It was so good that he had me laughing. He has my mannerisms and typical phrases that I might use down perfectly.

The words "Just try harder" tend to come out of my mouth when I am worn down from trying to get him to finish things that are motor related--things like handwriting or piano or even getting ready to go somewhere.

My son has enough people already telling him to just try harder because he doesn't look or sound like a kid that would have these problems. For years I have been aware that he sounds smarter than I do when he speaks. If you could compare a written transcript of what he says in conversation about almost any subject and what I say, you would see that he is much more articulate than I am and you would think he is more well read than I am--but I am right there with him when he is reading a lot of what he read or watching the educational shows with him. I would wonder how he could retain so much more information and be able to come up with some really good analogies that I would have never thought of. People, especially older kids, would ask us his IQ and I didn't know because he hasn't had an IQ test, but I would say "It has to be higher than mine, and they would nod their heads in agreement."

My son would take forever to write one paragraph, but if allowed enough time, he can write in cursive legibly and he uses correct spelling and punctuation. Because he can write legibly if he does it slowly I am not sure my son still has dysgraphia. If he prints or tries to write quickly or has to write more than a paragraph, then it sure looks like dysgraphia. I don't know how I am supposed to know if he has dysgraphia or not when one doctor says he has it and the OT says handwriting is low normal, and then he has days where he can do things better than others and he is not consistent so maybe my son has dysgraphia some days and not others. I really need help to figure this out and I think we are finally going to get some answers when he is tested next month.

I think never knowing if he will be able to do some physical thing that other kids do so easily causes my son anxiety. A few years ago the doctor noticed that his heart rate went up when she said he needed to learn to ride a bicycle. I think anxiety causes his heart to beat faster. For me, this anxiety happens if I am asked to speak in front of a group. I had what may have been selective mutism as a child so I have lived with some anxiety my entire life. I want my son to overcome this anxiety that he gets any time he is asked to do anything physical.

My son hates being in a room by himself and this causes some anxiety, especially at night. He has trouble sleeping, so I sometimes worry that he will keep the other kids awake. He had a sleepover Saturday night but he didn't sleep until the next morning. Luckily one of his friends is the same way so it wasn't a problem.

My son really likes music and often finds piano music online that he wants to play, often Japanese anime music. He always picks out challenging pieces and his piano teacher lets him work on these even though they are grade levels above where he is now. It might take him longer than the average kid to learn these because of his motor learning disability, but he will keep trying until he gets it because he wants to do this and he is being given the support necessary to allow him to do this. I wish all teachers were like my son's piano teacher.

He always liked singing in musical theater but dancing was always a problem because of his motor learning disability but he was always willing to work on the dances until he got it, even though the musical theater teacher made rude comments about his dancing ability in front of the other kids. As someone with lifelong social anxiety issues, this ability to keep trying amazed me. Because he wanted to do this, he could tolerate the comments from his teacher and continue to do his best and ignore her, but I think the friends he had in the group provided the support he needed to deal with her.

My son loves science and history and chose another history encyclopedia for his birthday. We have plenty of science encyclopedias and books already. We are doing a decade study and one of his books has a lot of info about the science discoveries that were made each year and we often look up more information when the book only leaves my son with more questions. He chose a science encyclopedia for his reading book in our first year of homeschooling when he was six and I had another homeschool mom look at me like I was crazy when I told her about this so I learned to not say anything to anyone about what we were using, except to my special ed teacher friend and mom of two of my son's best friends.

"Because he can write legibly if he does it slowly I am not sure my son still has dysgraphia."

Lori, This has been the issue I have had with my son,11. When he was diagnosed with dysgraphia at 9 I was confused because his handwriting is not messy; he's just slow and "refuses" to write. He says it's hard, but when I ask him why he reverts to "I don't know." At the time of the diagnosis the psychologist said that dysgraphia is not always just handwriting. It is something in the process of getting the words to the paper. Now going back and looking at the report from 2 years ago it makes more sense to me, but I haven't found literature to explain this aspect of dysgraphia. The paragaph my son wrote yesterday about the myth of the contellation Cancer, was what I would consider 2nd grade level (except with good spelling). If I ask him to tell me the story he can go on in great detail, as I'm sure you can imagine. So, it doesn't seem to involve short term memory, he just doesn't write. Does this ring true with you?

BTW - I think if YOU tell your son to try harder, that's different than a teacher telling a parent that the child is not trying hard. How does she know how hard something is for him? I do try to say things like, just keep focusing a little longer, or don't stop trying yet, to acknowledge that there is and has been effort.

That sounds similar to my son. At Cub Scouts when he was still in Webelos earlier this year, he had to fill out worksheets and I watched all the other boys quickly filling out the sheets with no problem but I couldn't see what they said or anything else, just that they were writing a lot more than my son. My son looked like he was trying to hide his writing and when I looked at it he used very short phrases to answer the questions with as few words as possible. He printed instead of using cursive because that was what all the other kids were doing and his handwriting looked like that of a much younger child, so they let me act as a scribe for him and let him finish at home when most of the other kids were able to finish in the hour they had. There were no lines on the paper and his handwriting and his handwriting is worse without lined paper. This would definitely be a problem for him if he were in school. He can type but there is no way he can carry a computer around with him everywhere. Even when he is allowed to type he doesn't want to write and I haven't tried to force him to write more than just a paragraph or two in emails to his sister or to friends. I am not sure what to do about it. I have him practice handwriting a little even during the summer months and that hasn't helped with speed or the amount of writing he can do. I know this causes some anxiety for my son and I wish I knew what to do about it. I am hoping to find some answers when my son is tested next month.

My son's memory, with the exception of motor memory, has always been very good. Definitely better than mine. He watches educational videos and takes online tests and he always does very well on these. If he takes a multiple choice test over what he reads, he always does very well. I remember watching him play some typing and spelling game where a word or phrase were flashed on the screen and he had to type the word using correct spelling from memory. I don't think he had seen some of the words before but he could spell them correctly or get close without having had time to really think about it. So his memory for words is excellent and he is better than I am on the brain age games involving quick number memorization. He and his dad are both really good at this.

What if you could find something that transcribed what you said into little ribbons of paper with sticky backs? That would help with worksheets.

I imagine you could find a bluetooth enabled ribbon printer and then write an iphone app to use VR technology to drive the printer.

Maybe this is a bunny trail, maybe not.

Ds8 loves science, social studies is his favorite some of the time, some of the time it's math - despite the math fact issues he's had in the past. He takes dance class, has since he was 4. He quit dance one year but came back to it after seeing the Nutcracker when he was 6 or so.
As far as content subjects, contextless/rote work is sort of a non-starter with ds - subjects where you really do stuff or see things in action or apply ideas are much more his cup of tea. I have heard this referred to as 'meaningful work'.

At six, my scores on sections of that test ranged from 140 to 18, so I understand this issue. OT did help a lot, and my lowest scores have risen over the last ten years. One thing you should watch out for is teachers who think that a "smart kid" who has trouble with some things isn't trying. Sometimes well meaning teachers, especially older ones who don�t believe in or weren�t trained to deal with LD and things of that ilk, can be dangerous to twice exceptional kids. I had one of those when I was six. She had the best of intentions, but she decided I was just lazy when I couldn�t learn to read and write. She pushed me until I broke. I became the only first grader in my school depressed to the point of being suicidal.