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    #43646 04/02/09 05:49 PM
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    Is it really true that giving a child caffeine is a good way to confirm whether or not he has ADHD?

    I recently gave my son a cappuccino and he bounced off the walls for the rest of the day and couldn't sleep that night.

    I'd like to believe this means he does not have ADHD.




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    I don't know if this is fact or myth because I am not ADHD however, I was told caffeine and/or stimulants "relax" those who are dx.

    I can see an instant change in my son's behavior when he is on meds and he describes it as numeral messages constructing thoughts in his mind are quieted just to the ones he wants to focus and concentrate on. Without meds, he says he has difficulty concentrating very long on one particular task especially if it is boring.

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    I googled on this, and found a good bit of chat about it but not too much science. It was a quick look though. If it helps that would be nicer seeming than other drugs. I found almost nothing on using this as a test for adhd, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be. I would love to see/find a study on it.
    A cap might be overdoing it! 2 cups of 'american coffee' (too weak 4 me) seems recommended- by some, and you have to figure on weight being a factor...I'm not saying try again, but there is some info on dosage on the web too.

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    I can honestly say that caffeine puts me to sleep. A small amount works great for me at work when I have to do a lot of focused repetitive tasks for periods of time.

    Artana #43678 04/03/09 06:58 AM
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    Yes. About 2 cups seems to work for DS6 - and helps him for about half a day. Or half a bottle of non-sugar Mountain Dew. I used to give him a couple of sips - afriad he would bounce off walls - and concluded that it "didn't do anything". I didn't give him enough.

    I did confirm the caffeine thing with the pscyhologist before trying it. I try not to post "any old opinion" on these boards -because there is no much rubbish out on chat boards in general. We need to try extra hard to keep integrity on this one! If your son is bouncing he probably does not have ADHD - but I said coffee - NOT expresso (!) (Kidding). That's probably a good thing. Besides - I thought we'd already concluded on previous chats that your son's Basal Ganglia (sp) was being affected by his infection? So sounded like you already had the science on that one. In addition - I don't recommend anyone just try coffee to come up with their own diagnosis. It's just something a parent an do if they SUSPECT ADHD and want to test their theory before getting proper medical advice on it. After all - medical tests are often not covered by insurance - so maybe you want to be pretty darn sure before paying for the doctor.

    If anyone finds anything reliable on the net about caffeine though - please do post!

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    Hey Ironmom,
    Yeah, I initially thought-- great, he has this PANDAS things and not ADHD. ADHD is a dx I have been very resistant to. But now it turns out the ADHD-ish behaviors are a big part of PANDAS and may not resolve that easily... so I am not sure anymore whether one excludes the other.

    There are just so many behavior patterns with no many different causes that can all be called "ADHD" just like there are many different kinds of "headaches."

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    My BIL has ADHD/Dyslexia and was diagnosed back when I guess they hadn't studied appropriate med doses for kids. Instead they put him on coffee. He says he would go to school each day with a thermos of coffee, while the other kids were drinking milk at lunch. He still continues to drink coffee throughout the day and my sister claims he gets really 'weird' when he doesn't get his coffee. He is both mathematically inclined and a poet. I've tried it with my ds and haven't really noticed a difference in focus but then again he has ASP with some ADD like qualities. We've never thought he was ADD and certainly not the H part, but the caffeine is good for his asthma!

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    How in the world do you get your dc to drink coffee? I'm tempted to try the coffee thing, but I'm sure my ds wouldn't drink it. He also won't dring anything carbonated, so cola and mountain dew are out.

    I know adults with ADHD who self-medicate with coffee.

    keet #44799 04/16/09 09:23 AM
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    I've heard of 18 yr olds self-medicating with the soda. DS6 likes coffee with Splenda. Make it sweet enough - he'll drink it. Also we've tried Chocolate Velvet coffee.

    The downside is of course, you don't want them to get a coffee addiction - where they act weird without the coffee - so we certainly aren't "over doing" it.

    The Omegas seem to work. He's only had about 53g of EPA in the current. We've been told to up it to 200g EPA - and the EPA is the part you need to look at.

    I'll report back if I see some improvements. I've started taking 2000 mg of Omega Fish Oil myself and so far feel loads better. I think sleep deprivation and stress caused a lot of my previous symptoms - but now that I suspect my own giftedness and ADHD too - I figured I should try to cure myself too - as I was getting very forgetful, having trouble concentratining - but then - I have other medical issues that bring these symptoms with them - so its hard to separate them out sometimes.

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    Hi,
    Our son was a Coca Cola addict up until grad school when he quit it. I suspect he felt it calmed him. Was the cappucicno artificially flavored? ADHD kids can be set off by additives.

    #46855 05/07/09 12:22 PM
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    hi all
    i am 40 years old and just realized this year that i've been using caffeine for many years to self-medicate for ADD. When i tried to go off caffeine i got horrible headaches and also could not attend to any task, make a grocery list, etc. it was horrible!! so IMO caffeine absolutely can have a positive effect on attentional issues though not without other side-effects that aren't so pleasant, like withdrawal symptoms!
    irene

    #46863 05/07/09 01:19 PM
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    This article is fascinating and has some information on caffeine and its affects on ADD.


    Wednesday, Mar. 25, 2009

    Kids with ADHD May Learn Better by Fidgeting

    By John Cloud

    Like nose-picking and a preoccupation with feculence, the inability to sit still for long periods is a defining characteristic of childhood. But children with attention-deficit/hyperactivity disorder (ADHD) often squirm constantly, even when other kids can remain still. Many parents and teachers respond by trying to get ADHD kids, at any cost, to stop fidgeting. The assumption is that if they could just stop wriggling, they would be able to focus and learn.

    But a new study suggests that a better approach for ADHD kids (at least those who are not hyperactive to the point of breaking things) is to let them move all they want. That's because many kids use their movements � like swiveling in a chair or folding a leg underneath themselves and bouncing in a desk seat or repeatedly lolling and righting their head � the way many adults use caffeine: to stay focused. In other words, it may be that excessive movement doesn't prevent learning but actually facilitates it. (See the top 10 medical breakthroughs of 2008.)

    Longtime ADHD researcher Mark Rapport supervised the study, which is set to be published in the Journal of Abnormal Child Psychology. Rapport, a professor at the University of Central Florida (UCF) in Orlando, notes that our activity level � how much we move around in everyday situations � is one of the most fixed parts of our personalities. If you are a fidgety kid, you will be a fidgety adult, even if you learn to manage your movements with caffeine, stress-reduction, a personal trainer or other adult accoutrements.

    The idea that stimulants like caffeine (or Ritalin or even something stronger like cocaine) can help you sit still and pay attention seems counterintuitive at first. But that surprising fact lies at the heart of Rapport's work: stimulants augment your working, or short-term, memory, where information is stored temporarily and used to carry out deliberate tasks like, say, solving a challenging math problem. ADHD kids have a hard time with working memory because they lack adequate cortical arousal, and Rapport believes that their squirms and fidgets help stimulate that arousal.

    His study was small � just 23 boys ages 8 to 12 participated � but uncompromisingly meticulous; it took four years to recruit, screen and test the participants and to analyze the results. Twelve of the boys had an ADHD diagnosis. The other 11 were developing normally. All underwent a battery of tests at Rapport's lab over four consecutive Saturdays.

    Since I've always been fidgety, I asked Rapport if he wouldn't mind putting me through the same tests he gave the boys. And so last week I found myself at the UCF Psychology Department, where a grad student affixed a device called an actigraph to my left wrist. Actigraphs look like digital watches and generate a signal each time they are moved, even slightly. They allow researchers to measure, quite precisely, a subject's kinetic activity. The boys in Rapport's experiments wore actigraphs on their ankles as well as their wrists because kids are often just as twitchy below the waist as above. (See the most common hospital mishaps.)

    Wearing the actigraph, I sat before a computer in a small windowless room and took working-memory tests. For one test, I had to recite aloud a series of numbers that appeared on the screen. I was asked not only to remember the numbers but also to restate them in proper numerical order. So if I saw 4, then 3, then 1, then 8, I had to say, "One, three, four, eight." Each series of numbers also included a random letter, which I had to state at the end: "One, three, four, eight, D."

    At first the test sounded simple, not least because I knew an 8-year-old could ostensibly complete it. But I found it quite difficult. Working-memory tests require intense concentration, and I was distracted because I was nervous. Rapport, several of his grad students, a UCF public relations official and a friend of mine were all watching me through an open doorway while I performed the tests. I ended up scoring worse than some of Rapport's kids.

    My experience of being nervous was instructive because it mimicked, in a way, the cognitive strain under which an ADHD kid takes such tests. ADHD compromises the brain's executive functioning � its ability to master unexpected exercises. The same way I got nervous, ADHD kids get momentarily lost, their attention fractured for a few seconds. Think about when you're reading and get to the end of a paragraph and realize you haven't been paying attention: that's what it's like for ADHD kids, all the time. My actigraph scores confirmed that I wasn't operating normally for a 38-year-old adult. Instead, during the experiment, I displayed the involuntary body movements of a typical 12-year-old boy. (See pictures of a diverse group of American teens.)

    Rapport also conducted a control experiment with the boys in which they watched the pod-racing scene from Star Wars: Episode I [EM] The Phantom Menace. He showed me a video of a couple of the boys watching the scene, and I was shocked: even the ADHD kids who had spun around endlessly during their cognitive tests sat perfectly still while they watched the pod race. The film clip required almost no working memory, no concentrated effort. The scene simply washed over the passively watching boys, none of whom had to move around to stay alert.

    Which suggests a classroom technique for ADHD kids: Don't overly tax their working memory. Rapport, who used to be a school psychologist, says the average teacher doesn't understand how ADHD kids process information. "If you go into a typical classroom," he told me, "you might hear, 'Take out the book. Turn to page 23. Do items 1 through 8, but don't do 5.' And you've just given them four or five directions. The child with working-memory problems has dropped three of them, and so he's like, 'Page 23 � what I am supposed to do?' " Similarly, a parent might tell a kid, "Take my keys, go to the car, get your sister's toy, and before you go, take the trash with you." The ADHD kid will get to the car without remembering what else to do. Their instructions must be broken down carefully because their working memory is weak.

    When I asked Rapport whether there's a cure other than breaking down instructions, his answer was a bit depressing: no. ADHD is incurable. Drugs like Ritalin are a common answer for controlling the condition, which affects about 3% to 5% of children, but Rapport notes that they have proven to be only a limited solution. In the short term, they can facilitate a child's ability to read � undoubtedly a crucial benefit � but Rapport says longitudinal studies have failed to show that Ritalin or other psychostimulants have consistent long-term behavioral effects. (Even if they did, another question would arise: Would you want to be dependent on a stimulant for the rest of your life?) Rapport hopes that his work will lead to the development of early behavioral and cognitive interventions that could help the youngest ADHD kids recognize, predict and somehow avoid ADHD's concentration gaps.

    Such research is in its infancy, though, and if you have a child with ADHD, it's important to understand that he processes the world in a different way. He might be (literally) running circles around you, but that may be his way of paying attention.

    lanfan #46867 05/07/09 02:15 PM
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    My little brother had ADD and the meds they gave him caused more problems. Someone told my mom try coffee. She would give him a cup of coffee in the morning before school and again before he did his homework. He thought he was cool because he was drinking cofee and my mom thought it was cool because it really worked for him and with out the nasty side effects he had with the meds.

    keet #46899 05/07/09 08:14 PM
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    Originally Posted by keet
    I know adults with ADHD who self-medicate with coffee.

    I went for about 10 years without caffeine due to persistant bladder infections. But I jumped back on the wagon about the time when I started my ADD meds... I'm amazingly proficient at work... it still bores me to DEATH, but I can stay focused MOST of the time. smile

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