Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Learning Environments VS kid too distracted in class

DD5 has just started school, loves it - they love her, long may it last!

She has been saying that she is too distracted to learn because of classroom noise and too many beautiful colours. She is extremely visual spacial, the teacher knows this but I'm pretty sure she can't do too much to accommodate. The kids don't have assigned seating and can't dull down the room.

Any ideas on how to help? The teacher seems receptive and we will get an IEP in September but even then I'm not sure how they can accommodate this. At this stage we don't believe she has a 2nd e, just a learning pref. I'm mostly concerned because our schools are moving toward the "modern learning" style which advocates for super classrooms of up to 60 kids (poss more) with roaming teachers. Kids get to learn in a way that suits them and most parents I know love the idea but I know it will be a nightmare situation for DD who wants silence to learn.

I know some of this is learning to get along but at the same time I want to give her some coping skills as I can't see the world changing for her on this one!

I'm not sure what to do about the visual distractions, but for the classroom noise/etc I'd give earplugs a try. Regular earplugs should work and still allow your dd to hear the teacher - if they don't do the trick, you could try a pair of noise cancellation headphones. My 2e ds has a pair of these which he wears while doing homework when the background noise is bothering him.

The open classroom / lack of structure just didn't work for my kids. To be honest, when we were in early elementary in a school with a very laid-back type of structure similar to what you are describing (but with 1/3 the # of students in the room)... I'm not sure it was really working for *any* of the kids.

Why do you have to wait until September for the IEP? Is the school year almost over? Has your dd been through an IEP eligibility eval and testing?

polarbear

Cardboard study carrel ....kind of isolating but might be helpful.

http://www.classroomproducts.com/3Side13studycarrels.html

Our school (in NZ) is working towards the modern learning environment too. I still can't work out how it is different to the open plan classrooms of the 70's which were disestablished because they didn't work. I can see a small number of children thriving in them but I also predict an upswing in ADHD, anxiety and sensory overload meltdowns. I will be watching closely.

she needs to do 6 weeks "school policy" for them to see how her ed psych report matches to their observations then they'll do an Iep based on that, so factor in holidays and paper shuffling we are looking at sept.

You know, if it looks like a duck...

I got to give it to the public school system in NZ for at least not giving up on progressive education.

Mahagogo5, are you sure it's going to be 60 students all in one classroom all the time? I can't imagine that working for the majority of elementary school students. Maybe that's just one of many settings?

i missed who the OP was. She is in NZ too. The so called modern learning environment basically consists of removing the wall between 2 classes and smushing them together although there is usually a movable wall that can be used. Class sizes are about 24 to 30 so 48 to 60 kids and two teachers. Full inclusion (one difference from the 70's) so those 60 kids could include low functioning autistic kids, developmentally delayed kids and kids with uncontrolled ADHD. Group work is mandatory and moving around necessary because keeping the kids at their desk is considered old fashioned. I am going to get some sort of noise reduction device for ds 8 when he moves into the school hall with 59 other kids while the build the new 60 kid classroom.

The really sad thing is it was only the year before last that I saw a piece on TV about the last open plan classroom being divided up.

Noise cancelling headphones with FM receiving from the teacher alone who is microphoned (she would turn it on to get his attention and then turn it off after he took the headphones off).

That would be great but it is very hard to get in NZ even if you have a serious auditory processing issue. Also there is a lot of group work. My kids are told they have to ask at least two classmates before asking the teacher if they didn't hear/don't understand. I am expecting to have to fight for the slight noise dulling ear plugs as he has been told he will just have to get used to it. Luckily it wasn't his main teacher who told him that.

Sorry not trying to take over the OP's thread just give extra info on the NZ system which is rigged against kids like Mahagogo's daughter.

I did homeschool one of my children for several years because he needed a quiet environment. I would never have been able to reintroduce him to school ever!

My other son can get into a zone and tune everyone out...not hear a thing.

Oh good grief! My kids would have just given up in a situation like that.

How extremely frustrating!!!

polarbear

We have been in both traditional classrooms and the open structure. Both of my kids have focus issues, with DD being pretty extreme. We had tried headphones (noise blocking and also music or white noise), earplugs, etc. She said that she felt like she was in hell. She WANTS to hear everything going on and seeks out the stimulation. Yet at the same time she gets irritated when her concentration is disrupted. I don't know what the answer is, but the traditional classroom wasn't better because it was way too crowded. The schools weren't built to pack 25-35 kids in a classroom. So then they end up grouping desks together anyway, and she was surrounded on all sides by kids with their desks adjoining. Since the rooms were small, it became very loud, whereas in the open format schools there was more space and at least the noise came across more like a constant background buzz. I guess what I'm trying to say is that either way it's bad news for DD. I think it depends a lot more on the teacher and how the teacher manages the class rather than the actual space and whether there are walls.

The nice thing is about the open structure is that the teachers can group the kids according to ability level much more easily than a traditional classroom. So they go to one teacher for reading, a different one for math, etc. DS goes from 2nd grade to 5th grade for math, which is not a big deal because 5th grade is right there in the same area. Then the 5th grade itself is ability grouped so he is placed in a group doing 6th grade math. It's flexible so kids can be moved around if necessary.

Puffin your experience is very valuable

Not every NZ school agrees with the way the Ministry is going with open plan classrooms but you might have to go private to avoid it.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11446451

I seem to remember the Catholic Education Office in NSW following a similar open plan approach in recent years. Not sure if it is still the trend of the day.

What was interesting in the article is the distinction made between a student and teacher led approach to learning. Is the massive classroom set up student led because it's impossible to hear the teacher (tongue in cheek but still...)?

thanks all for some good suggestions and support! I think this is going to be an ongoing issue for us with a lot of trial and error. She's a trooper so I guess at some stage she will just deal with it but I feel bad for her.

ndw: private is not an option until secondary for us ($18000 plus per year)so the local will need to do. As I said the teacher (and school has been great so far but this just might be a tricky thing to sort. Anyway we'll see how it goes...

I'm impressed you get an IEP. She may find it a bit easier once she has settled a bit. She may not of course but be optimistic for now. I must admit though I feel sorry for the older teachers who would have been beginning their career in the open classroom stage and are ending it in the modern learning environment hype. it must be hard to be constantly asked not only to change horses midstream but to do so with enough conviction to convince people you are on the same horse.

Are these changes based on the need to justify a greater student : teacher ratio or on actual new educational research/ideology? I have 2 daughters at school, my airy fairy, creative one would be a mess in that environment. She's doing extremely well academically but it's with a low key classroom environment, small class size and a seat close to the teacher. My other one, DD7, is very autonomous and independent but she hates other children repetitively interrupting her work.

I went to school in NZ - I lived in an average sized city and there were probably 15 children in my class in the early years. These changes make me feel old!

The cynic in me was wondering the same thing re student/teacher ratio

FWIW, the school my children were in with a similar philosophy had all the right "talk" in place - having an open classroom with multiple ages/grades together would allow for differentiation and allow students to work at their own pace, but in reality it didn't work out at all, and without careful planning and a real motivation on the part of the school to do so, I'm not sure that an open classroom in and of itself lends itself to being any easier to differentiate in than a standard classroom situation. I hope it works out!

polarbear

I worked in an open school at one point, and it was used by staff to collaborate and differentiate...but the first thing every teacher did with his/her space was to put up barriers (bookcases, additional white/chalkboards, drapery, etc.). We also quietly placed certain children into the few closed classrooms in the building, including all of the kindergarten and first-graders.

I will say it was fabulous for classroom observations, though, as I could stand on the third floor balcony and observe student behavior on the first floor, without anyone knowing who I was observing. (This was an all-in open school, with one enormous, cavernous open space on three levels. Including the school library.)

When I first heard of it, I thought it would be amazing, and had DD been NT I would probably be quite excited about the changes, I just know she'll be far too distracted.

One classroom with 60 kids sounds like a nightmare for almost any kid, but doubly so for any kid with special needs.

My super cynical thought it that it sounds like a training ground for the new "modern office" BS in which everyone has a tiny desk in a huge open room. Because, you know, being able to see and hear absolutely everyone else you work with increases "collaboration."

You must have gone to school in one of the low student teacher ratio drives. There was one 10 years ago but now they are sure teacher quality is more important so class sizes are going up. In the 70's when I went to school 35 was the designated class size. Ds8 had 18 in the first year of school but ds6 had 24 in the same class with the same teacher. ds8 now has 29. I would like the idea better if it was multi age and people could work at their own level but ds8 is in a year 4 class and they are combining with a y3/4 composite which isn't much help. The teacher ratio stays the same so it isn't that. I really think the teachers think (or are required to pretend to think) that it can be done differently this time and will be great.

And yes it is a lot like the open office concept where everyone has to try and do work the requires concentration and privacy in the equivalent of an airport departures lounge. My firm belief is that most people find it stressful to some level and a very few thrive on it. I used to want to strangle the woman who had loud private conversations while I was trying to check payment runs.

I'm really hoping that it just takes forever to be implemented and she's older when it comes in.

I have to pick her up soon, I think I may have to schedule a meeting sooner than the 6 weeks based on her already being bored (a week in)

Based on what DD has already said this week I'm pretty sure this rule will be coming into effect pretty soon. She just doesn't view other kids as her peers (good for playing with, not for learning off) so she is going to be a total PIA to the teacher. Anyway I'm hoping she'll pick up on the other kids behaviour on that and follow suit