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Joined: May 2012
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It seems like they already did the eval they need to do then, they just have to get it together and put a plan into place. If the did the BRIEF and it showed what areas are impaired (working memory for instance), why would they need to do more evals? Here is my gut, maybe irrational, emotional feeling: I think they WANT an ADHD dx and are pushing hard this year to get it. I know this is cliche parent-reaction and maybe I am just reacting poorly/misreading whatever. But I think they really want me to try meds (and maybe their hearts are really in the right place but we disagree). I think the teacher's talk in the lounge is that "[DS] doesn't need a scribe and writing accommodations - he needs ADHD drugs! His mom is all about writing accommodations and dysgraphia and his hypotonia(EDS); oh, and his 'giftedness' (eyeroll) but his real problem is that he is just an ADHD boy and needs some drugs." Last year, he only came up at risk for attention... This year, their goal is to make sure he is no longer "at risk" but clinically significant and then it's not their problem he has school issues (i.e., it's not because they aren't supporting his already identified disabilities, and it's not becasue he needs higher level material), it can be 'fixed' with some medicine.
Last edited by Irena; 01/08/14 10:26 AM.
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This is not to say he doesn't have ADHD! He may have it... Although I really think that of he does it's relatively mild. I think the problems at achool (adhd or whatever) are exacerbated by the fact that they do not like to give him scribing accommodations. They do not like that he gifted. He's a noncompliant, pain in the butt who complains he's bored and can't write.  The negative halo. My other kid has the postive halo - nothing he does is a problem. This kid is "always" a problem - he does nothing right.
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Joined: May 2013
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I would bring up the BRIEF and tell them "look, here it shows he's impaired with organization and working memory but good with attention. Let's try to make some concrete adjustments to help with the executive functioning issue and see if he improves." If they put a plan into place and he STILL is struggling, then look at ADHD, medication, etc. Medication is great--it works wonders in my DD but not something you want to give to a very mildly affected kid who can do well if given more structure. My DD is a basket case when she is not on her drugs. It's obvious that she needs them. With my DS I don't even want to go there unless nothing else works. And like your DS he comes out fine on the computerized testing, the "attention" parts of the inventories, teacher says he listens with rapt attention in class. It's just organization. And who knows if meds would help if that's the only issue anyway. They need to be able to separate in their minds if it's an "attention" issue, or an "organizational" issue. There is a definite difference.
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I don't know what the other testing showed about attention, but if it was borderline normal I would point out that organization is worse and clearly the biggest problem, so why not start there?
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Thanks Blackcat. Honestly, i do love hearing medication success stories. So please feel free to remind me often how much it has helped your child. Because I WILL try meds if I get the go-ahead from his private eval and the opinon is it could help a lot. Dr. Barkley really gave me hope when he said if your kid's gonna have something then ADHD is the better thing to have because the meds are good and most (90% I think he said) repond well to them (with the right tweaks). Some EDSers I have talked to said ADHD meds helped them and even seemed to help with their EDS (maybe the brain fog, the fatigue, etc that is also attributed to EDS). BUT my fear is that I don't want to give him meds for a disorder that he doesn't have. I want to make sure he really has it at a high evenough level that warrants a try with medication.
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Interesting story about DD. Yesterday she was off school and I worked with her on ixl.com a little bit, since she learns no math in school and she likes it. I thought that she did not have her medication. I couldn't figure out why she wasn't wiggling, why she was actually focusing on the questions, and seemed calm. I thought "maybe she doesn't really have ADHD if she does this well without meds?" I was seriously confused. Later on I figured out she DID have her medication. Dh gave it to her before he went to work.
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Exactly. That's my thought on DS as well. But I think worst case scenrio that will happen is you get a mis-diagnosis of ADHD and try meds. You do not see much or any difference. You stop meds. If you do the ADHD dianosis privately the school will never know and it won't be in any records. If a "normal" kid takes ADHD meds for a month or two as a trial, but they don't really have ADHD, I really doubt that any permanent harm will be done. I have been tempted to give DS some of DD's meds just to see what happens, but of course I'm not going to do that. Thanks this is good advice and reassuring. I think this is exactly how I will proceed privately.
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Interesting story about DD. Yesterday she was off school and I worked with her on ixl.com a little bit, since she learns no math in school and she likes it. I thought that she did not have her medication. I couldn't figure out why she wasn't wiggling, why she was actually focusing on the questions, and seemed calm. I thought "maybe she doesn't really have ADHD if she does this well without meds?" I was seriously confused. Later on I figured out she DID have her medication. Dh gave it to her before he went to work. Before I got to the part that she actually had her meds I was thinking "computer." Apparently, computer games are unique in their delivery of consequences that really reach a peeson with ADHD ... Something like the immediancy and the several things going on at once? So, basically an person with adhd supposedly can concertrate for hours on a computer game without meds. Not sure if IXL would count as a computer "game," though. My DS does great on it, though. Very focused by it  His computer vision therapy though - whooaaa excrutiating for him apparently
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Yeah, I don't think it was because it was the computer because when she is NOT medicated and tries to use that site, usually she is very wiggly, actually gets up and paces around the room, takes FOREVER to look at each question, etc. It's not really a game, it's just math on a screen. But it's been a while since I tried it with her and she's not medicated. So I thought "maybe she's growing out of the ADHD." But nope.
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I love you guys Okay. I drafted this to the team about the Baseline Data Collection, let me know what you think: "The data collection to establish a baseline sounds like a very good idea! We need specific information as when exactly DS's attention is failing as it simply can not be possible that he is "never paying any attention at all ever."
However, we have some concerns about how this will happen:
First, who will be collecting the data? This person needs to be objective but also truly understand a pretty obscure disability that is often misunderstood in general.
Secondly, we need to know the circumstances prior, during, and after in order to figure out what led to the behavior and how the behavior occurred. The behavior observed should be specific like "fails to place paper in basket," and "moves too slowly to get paper in basket" or something like that. Rather than simply "fails to attend to teacher direction." And when, exactly, is DS not "paying attention" or "following directions?" What are the circumstances surrounding this? Is the teacher talking to the class as a whole? If so, is there background noise? Is he trying to do something else (like packing up, putting things away, lining up) while trying to listen? Are the other kids walking around? What do DS's inattentive times look like and what is the functional significance?
Thirdly, we need to document how exactly the teacher(s) attempts to gain attention (and obviously which efforts are successful and which are not). Does she touch DS's sholder? Does he pay attention then?
Additional concerns:
Are the teachers putting into place what was included in the IEP as a result of last year's assessment? There were accommodations suggested by Dr. in her report, and some (all?) of those were added to the IEP, as a result of the BRIEF and NEPSY assessments (attention and executive functioning assessments) such as chunking, breaks, checking for understanding of directions, breaking multi-step tasks into smaller more manageable components, organization support, etc.) that she did last year. Are those accommodations currently being followed? When they are followed is attention still failing? Or are the accommodations not happening and attention is failing? I propose we discuss trying to make some concrete adjustments to help with the executive functioning issue based on Dr.'s evaluation last year and see how that helps with the "attention problems."
While we do need specific, thorough observation, I'd refrain from interpretation of the data prior to our meeting because inattention can be caused by all sorts of things including:
a. knowing (or believing you already know) the material so not bothering;
b. seizure;
c. pain - (I have more than once found myself talking to DS and he seeming not to hear me while banging on his ankle or banging his knee joint. When I ask to please pay attention he has said to me, "Just wait for a second mom, I am trying to get my knee (or ankle) back into place."
d. hearing issue-- some kids need to see the face of the person talking, some can't process sounds in a busy environment, some have difficulty processing auditory information, etc.;
e. motor planning difficulties - child who has difficulty with motor planning can't automatically figure out space and time on the fly. (do I get out of my chair while people are walking behind me? how do I avoid crashing into people going south while I am walking north? How do I get my paper out so everything else doesn't fall? How can I get it in the basket when I have to reach across this cup of water?)
f. avoidance of something not necessarily apparent to the observer like anticipation or noise, chaos, lunch or glue smells, a shadow or light, etc."
Last edited by Irena; 01/08/14 10:59 AM.
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