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    Joined: Oct 2013
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    madant Offline OP
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    Hi all! I am new here. Last spring my son was tested and received special ed services for his ADHD, they agreed to FINALLY give him an OT evaluation because we are having huge deficits in his written communication which conflict with his academic ability. He just turned 8 and is in the second grade. I received his OT evaluation results today and our IEP meeting is scheduled for Friday. I do not understand what the scores mean and want to be prepared if I am going to have a fight on my hands Friday. I have searched online but cannot find out what the scores mean. If any of you could help I would GREATLY appreciate it! Thanks in advance!

    Beery VMI Test: Standard score 84
    Subtest Visual Perception: 93
    Subtest Motor Coordination: 74

    The Evaluation Tool of Children's Handwriting - Manuscript
    words: 50%
    letters: 66%
    numerals:94%

    If anyone can help me I would be so thankful! I just dont want to go into this IEP meeting blind! Thanks!!

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    I don't know the second tool you list but I can share that my PG w Dysgraphia and Dyspraxia kiddo had a Beery VMI with these scores and corresponding %tiles:

    VMI Standard score of 45= 2nd percentile (Very Low)
    Visual Perception of 93= 31st percentile (Average)
    Motor Coordination of 69= 15th percentile (Very Low)

    The first number tells overall ability for visual motor and the other two are to tease apart where the challenge lies. My son showed more motor than visual perception challenge.

    I hope that gives you something to work with. If you can find an OT forum of some sort you may be able to post your question there and learn more.

    I hope your meeting goes well! Take a deep breath, ask lots of questions, and take good notes. Then let us know how it goes!


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    Just found another piece for you on Beery.... Standard score of 90-109 = average performance. Your child's scores should hopefully lead to help in that 45 is well below that range.

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    The ranges for VMI scores are:

    133-160 - very high (2% of test takers)
    118-132 - high (14% of test takers)
    83-117 - average (68% of test takers)
    68-82 - low (14% of test takers)
    40-67 - very low (2% of test takers)

    These ranges are not perfectly consistent with HappilyMom's reported results, but they're not too far off, either.

    I'm not sure if the percentages for the ETCH are percentiles or something else. This study suggests that if they are scores, your child should be diagnosed with handwriting dysfunction. Unfortunately, I can't read the full study to see if I'm interpreting the abstract correctly. This paper seems to concur.

    Good luck with your IEP meeting. I suspect it will go well. Remember that everyone at the table has the same goal - to help the child.

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    I am not familiar with the ETCH, but fwiw, these were my dysgraphic ds' most recent Beery VMI scores. He has fine motor dysgraphia associated with developmental coordination disorder:

    Beery VMI 114 SS 82nd percentile
    Visual Perception 109 SS 73rd percentile
    Motor Coordination 82 SS 12th percentile

    I didn't have time to look at Elizabeth's link, but I think the slight variation in ranges of percentiles may be a function of the child's age when they took the test - an 80 SS for a 11 year old might be a different percentile than an 80 SS for a 6 year old.

    FWIW, my ds, with a similar range Motor Coordination score to your ds, struggles tremendously with handwriting and can't rely on it at all to show his knowledge. Yet he has what looks like legible handwriting - so we had a tough time demonstrating why it was an issue when he was in elementary school - especially since there were a lot of kids in early elementary with handwriting that looks completely messy with reversals etc - who aren't dysgraphic smile Some of the things that are important to keep in mind or consider for your meeting:

    * How much time does it take your ds to use handwriting relative to his peers? There are two parts to this question - the simple act of handwriting that doesn't require thinking, and what happens re time when he is putting together thoughts such as writing a paragraph or story etc. You can time how long it takes him to "just write" and compare the letters per minute to same-age peers - have him write the alphabet from memory, lower and upper case, and time it. Then google "letters per minute + 1st grade (or whatever grade)" and you'll find some typical ranges to compare handwriting speed to. You might also want to repeat this exercise by having him copy something and time that - because copying is sometimes very difficult for dysgraphic kids and requires accommodations. These two tests will give you not only time data but also written samples showing how well he copies and how well he writes the alphabet - does he have reversals? Does he know all of his caps/lower case consistently? etc.

    * Watch him while he writes. Does he have an odd pencil grip? Does he rub his wrists, take lots of breaks? Does he seem easily distractible? Does he seem to have to stop and think how to form his letters? Does he form them consistently (same way every time)? The OT eval should have included observations of all of this, but it's good for you to have watched and have an idea too.

    * If the school staff doesn't mention it, ask if they considered or ruled out dysgraphia - and if they didn't consider dysgraphia or don't think it's a possibility, ask what they *do* think is the cause of the fine motor challenge. If they don't have an answer, request an evaluation for dysgraphia. If they tell you it *is* dysgraphia, you need to consider - do you want accommodations for keyboarding etc. The issue with dysgraphia is that children don't develop true automaticity of handwriting (they essentially are rethinking how to draw each letter every time they write it), hence every time they rely on handwriting they are using up so much working memory getting the letters down (even if the letters look great) that they don't have left-over working memory for the next order of thinking in writing (punctuation, grammar, capital letters etc) and very very little working memory left over to actually think about the content of what they want to write. OT can help some dysgraphic children with reducing hand pain and giving them legible handwriting, but it can't take away the basic neurological disconnect that prevents the automaticity of letter-forming, so if your ds *is* dysgraphic, you need to be thinking through if/when etc re keyboarding etc.

    * I would take examples of his work with you to the meeting - if you don't have a comparison, have him write something at home and then have him tell you something similar verbally. If he can keyboard, have him give you a writing sample with keyboarding. Hopefully you will have a much more cooperative school staff than we did, but we frequently found when advocating for our ds that the school staff would bring the absolute best (or very contrived) examples of ds' handwriting to prove that there was not an issue. Having my own set of handwriting examples (from ds - some were from his schoolwork, others from home), helped illustrate the true picture of his challenges and bring the focus of the meeting back to actually helping ds instead of proving there wasn't an issue.

    Good luck with your meeting!

    polarbear

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    madant Offline OP
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    Thank you all so much! My ds is in 2nd grade. I have been "fighting" he school since Kindergarten and finally he was tested last spring (end of first grade) He is very bright and tests above average in all areas, yet he is consistently failing when there is any written work. He can tell you how words are spelled, explain answers well above grade level, and can verbally tell very detailed stories. However, when he has to write his thoughts down the letters are various sizes, some capitals some lower case, there is zero spacing, there are never complete sentences, and it is all unreadable unless you are used to deciphering his writing. I have mentioned dysgraphia MANY times, have brought research on it, and shared how he hits EVERY POINT of dysgraphia, but the school refuses to acknowledge it. They wont even use the word?!? I KNOW he has this... I know it is more then just weak fine motor skills (granted they are an issues as well). I have printed out more info on dysgraphia for this meeting... I hope they will listen now.

    my main questions are going to be:
    If not dysgraphia is it a developmental coordination disorder?
    Will you start keyboarding with him?
    What can we do to get his thoughts onto the paper?

    Can you think of any others? He currently has an IEP due to his ADHD and he is pulled 30 minutes/ day to work on organization, time management, etc. I really want the OT added because he does need it (He is 8 and still struggles buttoning pants, eating with utensils, etc and it can't hurt the writing right?)

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    madant Offline OP
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    Polar Bear, what accommodations do you have for the dysgraphia? At what grade did they finally recognize it? Last year they just kept saying these handwriting "issues" were still in the "normal range for first graders". Its all so frustrating and overwhelming!!! Thanks for sharing!

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    My DS's Beery VMI score was 105 with a percentile of 63. It says Age Equaivalent 7:1 (probably 7 years 1 month). He was 6 years 2 months when he took the test. It doesn't break the score down into different parts on the report like motor coordination and visual perception, which would have been helpful, because other tests show DS's motor coordination to be around the 1st percentile, and visual perception is 99th percentile. So I guess the 63 are those two things averaged out. Pretty useless in terms of whether a chld should be diagnosed with dysgraphia or DCD or something else requiring OT. DS was diagnosed with DCD based on a test called the Grooved Pegboard Test, where his Z scores were like -4. (plus other private OT assessments we've had in the past).
    DS is in first grade and the school is in the process of evaluating him, mainly because we have a diagnosis from a neuropsych (DCD) and I'm making a huge fuss!

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    In light of above mentioned variations for age. Mine was 6.5 when he was tested with Beery.

    As a 1st grader I have heard the "there's such a large range" and "he's not really behind". I followed their advice until during vision testing the Doc was showing me what he couldn't do physically and recommended doing OT before Vision Therapy. Those numbers made a huge difference in changing from seeing him as "defiant/lazy" versus "delayed/challenged". I'm a big believer in DATA. It's easier to argue need with data.

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    You know someone on here linked to a visual of Dyspraxia that he/she shared at some point that was fabulous. I have a print out but no more link. It visibly shows all the zones of impact. I think you would find it useful. I'll try to dig more and find it. It was something on someone's website for their advocacy company or some such IIRC. Maybe someone else will remember.

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    I finally found the 2 graphic representations of dyspraxia and dysgraphia someone here had posted awhile back.

    I hope these help you at meetings ahead:

    Dyspraxia: http://tutoringduluth.com/2013/06/great-visual/
    Dysgraphia: http://tutoringduluth.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/dysgraphia-mind-map.jpg

    I wish I had been able to use them in advocacy for my son.

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    I am another one who was consistently told that the reversals and handwriting problems were "age appropriate" He was consistently TWO YEARS delayed in handwriting and fine motor skills (which they didn't believe until I showed them two different private evals - one from a children's hospital). He wrote a 31 day calendar with every single number reversed. He wrote a paragraph of work starting from the bottom up and going backwards with reversals. It was shocking. They sat there with a straight face and insisted it was normal. My son has dyspraxia and dysgraphia. He also has EDS which causes poor joints and pain in his hands. Now he types everything and has a scribe. I don't even bother the school about dysgraphia/dyspraxia dx anymore, it's useless - I used the EDS to get him accommodations... they seem to be more comfortable with that for some reason. If you search my posts I have posted previously the accommodations for which I successfully advocated. This year the school is teaching DS cursive (seems like it will be much easier for DS - some dysgraphics find cursive easier) and typing.

    Last edited by Irena; 10/03/13 03:47 PM.
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    Does anyone know if there is a "correct" or "best" age for a VMI to be done? ie would a 6 year old who scores average be accurate or would it likely decrease to below average as the writing requirements got harder at school?

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    Originally Posted by mykids
    Does anyone know if there is a "correct" or "best" age for a VMI to be done? ie would a 6 year old who scores average be accurate or would it likely decrease to below average as the writing requirements got harder at school?

    mykids, the Beery VMI does not include any handwriting, it is a set of tests that includes drawing and copying - so I wouldn't expect a child's score on the Beery VMI to decrease as writing requirements at school increased. However, what I might expect to see is that a child who scores to be "ok" in early elementary might appear to be functioning ok in school, but their ability to keep up with writing demands as they move up in grades might decrease. Please note - I don't know what the cutoff line for a true "ok" really is - I suspect it varies with each child.

    polarbear

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